Q&A with Praetorian - National Level Competitor

[raw]

first post but been reading your Q&A for a while

I am currently in my off-season yet am ALWAYS hungry. I competed back in July and i'm up 30lbs since my comp (enhanced and did a controlled reverse diet) and while i'm holding some bodyfat I am at a point where I am pretty happy. Currently on off days I am taking in 3400 calories and on workout days i am taking in close to 4000. I do some low intensity cardio 7 days per week for 25min per session just to keep BF under control as best as I can.

Thing is, why am I so damn hungry all the time. I don't want to up calories to the point where things start to get out of control.

[Hugheser]

One it doesnt affect protein synthesis to any significant degree, two it is a combination anti biotic...amoxicillin works by killing the bacteria that is causing the infection. Clavulanic acid helps make the amoxicillin more effective...commonly used to treat infections of the sinus, ear, lung, skin, and bladder.
P


Hey P,

I remember reading a month or so ago your post about "Clavulin". I went to my doctor today and he said he never heard of it and that it must be an american product. Is this a brand name or the name of the actual product compound?

Thanks,

ps. On Benzac now and just seems to be slowing down the breakouts but not the cure per say. I have had acne since high school 03' and you name it, I have been prescribed it.

[Praetorian]

I'm starting week 9 of a 12 week, 625mg/week Sustanon 250 cycle. 6'4, 250lbs, 30 years old. Libido was great for the first 4 weeks and ever since has been gone completely. Unable to perform whatsoever. Have not used any anti-es, but have Nolva and Clomid for PCT. Any recommendation to remedy this issue? Would herbals help, Trib etc, or would an AI or SERM while "on" make a difference in sex drive?

Sorry for the delay just got back from Cabo and some much needed R&R.

Are you experiencing estro sides? Your estrogen may be high and killing sex drive. Herbals wont do anything...adding an anti e like aromasin may help.
P

[Praetorian]

What is your opinion on priming or slight deficit in caloric intake before a bulk? Will it significantly help put on lean mass due to the rebound or its just a myth? I think I read this lots of times from competitors who just finished a gruesome diet and did put on quality mass afterwards.

A prime is good but it has to be long enough to get an anabolic rebound...ie minimum 8 weeks better 12-16. A few weeks of lower cals wont do anything.
P

[Praetorian]

p,

what is a good pre workout muscle rub, i used to use finalgon, but can't get it anymore it was really good, hot and stung came with applicator. i have tried bengay and all that crap just doesn't seem to activate or do anything at all?

thx

I never use that stuff...take a hot shower and ride the bike for 5 min youll be warm.
P

[Praetorian]

first post but been reading your Q&A for a while

I am currently in my off-season yet am ALWAYS hungry. I competed back in July and i'm up 30lbs since my comp (enhanced and did a controlled reverse diet) and while i'm holding some bodyfat I am at a point where I am pretty happy. Currently on off days I am taking in 3400 calories and on workout days i am taking in close to 4000. I do some low intensity cardio 7 days per week for 25min per session just to keep BF under control as best as I can.

Thing is, why am I so damn hungry all the time. I don't want to up calories to the point where things start to get out of control.

I wish i had your appetite...for me i have to work to get in all the food. I would drop some of the cardio sessions...cardio tends to increase appetite...increase the good fat content in your meals and drop a bit of the carbs and see how that goes. Fat takes longer to digest...add some fibre as well.
P

[Praetorian]

Hey P,

I remember reading a month or so ago your post about "Clavulin". I went to my doctor today and he said he never heard of it and that it must be an american product. Is this a brand name or the name of the actual product compound?

Thanks,

ps. On Benzac now and just seems to be slowing down the breakouts but not the cure per say. I have had acne since high school 03' and you name it, I have been prescribed it.


The American brand is called Augmentin...you can get the generic brand in Canada..Amoxi-Clav.
P

[pcruiser73]

I would just like to take this time to thank Prae for his pe-contest professional services. I competed yesterday and was in the best shape I ever could have imagined. I took 2nd place in both the Masters and LHW. Everyone said looked absolutley great. I wouldnt have been dialed in like that without Prae in my corner. Thanks again. Anybody who is on the fence about using Prae as a coach all I have to say is he is worth his fee and then some.:a+

[shredded_Tris]

I would just like to take this time to thank Prae for his pe-contest professional services. I competed yesterday and was in the best shape I ever could have imagined. I took 2nd place in both the Masters and LHW. Everyone said looked absolutley great. I wouldnt have been dialed in like that without Prae in my corner. Thanks again. Anybody who is on the fence about using Prae as a coach all I have to say is he is worth his fee and then some.:a+

Yeah he is definitely one smart dude! I am very impressed also with how he is getting me prepared!
You should post some pics man it would be sweet to see some stage pics and maybe a few pics from about 3 weeks out to compare.

[pcruiser73]

Yes I am waiting for my pics from the photographer to come back and I will for sure. Of course I still have to figure out "how to" post pics, but ill get it. My avatar is as good as it gets right now.

[Hugheser]

The American brand is called Augmentin...you can get the generic brand in Canada..Amoxi-Clav.
P


Your the man, thanks.

[Praetorian]

I would just like to take this time to thank Prae for his pe-contest professional services. I competed yesterday and was in the best shape I ever could have imagined. I took 2nd place in both the Masters and LHW. Everyone said looked absolutley great. I wouldnt have been dialed in like that without Prae in my corner. Thanks again. Anybody who is on the fence about using Prae as a coach all I have to say is he is worth his fee and then some.:a+

Thanks for the compliments pc...you worked very hard and looked fantastic!
P

[drdnj]

Yeah he is definitely one smart dude! I am very impressed also with how he is getting me prepared!
You should post some pics man it would be sweet to see some stage pics and maybe a few pics from about 3 weeks out to compare.

I have to echo these sentiments! Great coach!

[White T]

Sorry for the delay just got back from Cabo and some much needed R&R.

Are you experiencing estro sides? Your estrogen may be high and killing sex drive. Herbals wont do anything...adding an anti e like aromasin may help.
P

Thank you for your answer P!

I have 2 weeks left in the cycle.. Should I forget about an ANTI-E now and just wait to run my Nolva/Clomid PCT and then hope things improve after that? Or would I still do 2 weeks of an anti-e (I don't have aromasin, only Arimidex) to bring down estro before I wind up the 12 weeks?

[laslo101]

hey P i have read alot of your stuff but there is way way more for me to learn but question for you... as much as i searched couldn't find the answere. going to go with a keto diet over carb cycling i think. so if i were to follow a palumbo template( because i like all the foods) where would i go to decrease once fat loss stalls and cardio is at a high range... doing a 13 week diet starting with 25- 30 min cardio upping 5 min every 2 weeks. but confused as to what to lower in the diet because alot of people say dont change it but i don't see how that will give constant results as bodyfat gets lower.

[Vitamin S]

p,

just started an off season lean mass cycle with sust/deca/dbol. its given i will hold some water/bloat and I am in the midsection and chest area where my body fat is higher. i don't care and for that reason I am not taking any anti-estrogens and have ran this before without antiestrogens and had no gyno issues. my question to you is, other than to prevent gyno, why would someone use an antiestrogen for a bulker? is it even needed? I know when dieting its used to dry one out and more accuratley one can gauge their progress by not mistaking fat for water retention.

also i know that antiestrogens will effect libido and lipids, if using it when drying out for a show is there one that is less harsh then the others in regards to libido and lipids? does low estrogen increase or decrease sex drive?

if i did use it for this cycle of 500mg test/300 deca/30mg dbol how much would i need like .5mg arimidex eod or 12.5mg aromasin eod.


thx

[A_N_T]

Praetorian, simple question what do you suggest/eat before bed? do you get up at night for snack or shake? what it consist of?
thanks!

[Praetorian]

Thank you for your answer P!

I have 2 weeks left in the cycle.. Should I forget about an ANTI-E now and just wait to run my Nolva/Clomid PCT and then hope things improve after that? Or would I still do 2 weeks of an anti-e (I don't have aromasin, only Arimidex) to bring down estro before I wind up the 12 weeks?

If you arent going to use HCG then I would just wait and run the nolva/clomid.
P

[Praetorian]

hey P i have read alot of your stuff but there is way way more for me to learn but question for you... as much as i searched couldn't find the answere. going to go with a keto diet over carb cycling i think. so if i were to follow a palumbo template( because i like all the foods) where would i go to decrease once fat loss stalls and cardio is at a high range... doing a 13 week diet starting with 25- 30 min cardio upping 5 min every 2 weeks. but confused as to what to lower in the diet because alot of people say dont change it but i don't see how that will give constant results as bodyfat gets lower.

The diet is a baseline only...everything changes as your fat loss stalls...or should I say before it stalls. At some point you may have to drop fats and run almost straight protein with trace carbs from veggies.
P

[Praetorian]

p,

just started an off season lean mass cycle with sust/deca/dbol. its given i will hold some water/bloat and I am in the midsection and chest area where my body fat is higher. i don't care and for that reason I am not taking any anti-estrogens and have ran this before without antiestrogens and had no gyno issues. my question to you is, other than to prevent gyno, why would someone use an antiestrogen for a bulker? is it even needed? I know when dieting its used to dry one out and more accuratley one can gauge their progress by not mistaking fat for water retention.

also i know that antiestrogens will effect libido and lipids, if using it when drying out for a show is there one that is less harsh then the others in regards to libido and lipids? does low estrogen increase or decrease sex drive?

if i did use it for this cycle of 500mg test/300 deca/30mg dbol how much would i need like .5mg arimidex eod or 12.5mg aromasin eod.


thx

Anti e's are just that....they are used to control estrogen that is it. There are some beneficial sides when dieting....when estrogen is low you will appear harder as well you will be able to drop the last bit of tough estro type fat stores. Too high a does will kill sex drive yes and will also slow muscle gains on cycle. Most people dont need an anti e off season they just need to be tighter on their diet...iuts the over eating of carbs that bloats them not the estro. On 500mg test weekly you will have very little estro conversion.
Adjust your diet and avoid an anti e unless absolutely necessary.
P

[Praetorian]

Praetorian, simple question what do you suggest/eat before bed? do you get up at night for snack or shake? what it consist of?
thanks!

I prefer a slow acting protein source such as cottage cheese with a bit of berries and some essential fats.
P

[A_N_T]

thanks!
what do you think about saw palmetto on cycle or on pct??

[laslo101]

ok thank you very much il run pro/veggie days starting at 1 day per week when fat loss stalls.

[Praetorian]

thanks!
what do you think about saw palmetto on cycle or on pct??

I take a prostate support supp(includes saw palmetto) every day....its a good idea as you get over 30.
P

[moh2010]

Hey man. I've been reading half of your faq so far. Very interesting stuff.

I would like to know your opinion on my cycle.

I'm dieting just for fun, to get leaner (down to 8%). Tired of eating and preparing food haha.

So I'm on keto since 7 weeks. I'm on trt (200mg of cyp week). I added 75mg of tren ace eod with clen (started at 100mcg and Im at 200mcg right now). So far I lost 10 pounds.

I need to stop the clen soon as my dosage is getting high and my system getting used to it.

I was thinking to stop the tren and clen, and switch to masteron (150mg eod) and lipo-ex(yohimbine hcl, green tea, albuterol and caffeine) with my usual 200mg of cyp week.

I was thinking masteron because I want a tighter, harder look and Im already below 10% (225, 9.2% at the moment).


My doubt right now is that masteron wont be as anti-catabolic as tren. might lose some muscles? Diet is spot on. I eat around 50g of prot and 20g of fat with some veggies every meal.

I haven't started cardio yet. I do cardio with my weight training so far. Im a big believer of Charles Poliquin. Im doing the Advanced german body composition (Tri-sets of the same muscle =6 slow reps, followed with 12 medium reps and then 25 fast reps, 2min off then repeat). I'm taking lots of bcaa to stay as anabolic as possible during my workout.


So should I keep the tren and start doing some cardio or switch to masteron? hmmm

Sorry if it was long to read. Im trying to give you as much infos as possible.

Thank you for your time!

[Praetorian]

Hey man. I've been reading half of your faq so far. Very interesting stuff.

I would like to know your opinion on my cycle.

I'm dieting just for fun, to get leaner (down to 8%). Tired of eating and preparing food haha.

So I'm on keto since 7 weeks. I'm on trt (200mg of cyp week). I added 75mg of tren ace eod with clen (started at 100mcg and Im at 200mcg right now). So far I lost 10 pounds. YOU STARTED CLEN TOO HIGH AND YOU NEED TO RAMP IT UP SLOWLY...THIS WAY IT IS EFFECTIVE FOR 16 WEEKS,

I need to stop the clen soon as my dosage is getting high and my system getting used to it. NOT REALLY...JUST BECAUSE YOU DONT FEEL SIDES DOESNT MEAN ITS NOT WORKING

I was thinking to stop the tren and clen, and switch to masteron (150mg eod) and lipo-ex(yohimbine hcl, green tea, albuterol and caffeine) with my usual 200mg of cyp week.ON A DIET I WOULD ALWAYS RUN TEST MINIMUM 500MG WEEKLY AND YES EITHER TREN OR MASTERON WILL HARDEN YOU UP. THE TEST WILL MAINTAIN MUSCLE MUCH BETTER WHILE DIETING

I was thinking masteron because I want a tighter, harder look and Im already below 10% (225, 9.2% at the moment).


My doubt right now is that masteron wont be as anti-catabolic as tren. might lose some muscles? Diet is spot on. I eat around 50g of prot and 20g of fat with some veggies every meal. YOU MAY NOT BE IN KETOSIS IF YOU ARE HAVING VEGGIES WITH EVERY MEAL....DO A SEARCH FOR DAVE PALUMBOS KETO DIET AND FOLLOW THAT

I haven't started cardio yet. I do cardio with my weight training so far. Im a big believer of Charles Poliquin. Im doing the Advanced german body composition (Tri-sets of the same muscle =6 slow reps, followed with 12 medium reps and then 25 fast reps, 2min off then repeat). I'm taking lots of bcaa to stay as anabolic as possible during my workout. ON KETO YOU NEED TO TRAIN HIT NT VOLUME BECAUSE YOUR GLYCOGEN STORAGE WILL BE EXTREMELY LOW AND YOU CANNOT USE KETONE BODIES TO TRAIN...TRAINING AS YOU ARE WILL TEND TO BURN MUSCLE BECAUSE YOU WILL BE CONVERTING AMINO ACIDS (MUSCLE) INTO GLUCOSE VIA GLUCONEOGENESIS...KEEP YOUR SETS IN THE 5-10 REP RANGE. BCAA'S ARE UNNECESSARY AS YOU WILL GET PLENTY FROM FOOD AND PROTEIN POWDER...THEY WILL JUST SLOW FAT LOSS.


So should I keep the tren and start doing some cardio or switch to masteron? hmmm YOU SHOULD START CARDIO 30MIN ONCE PER DAY ON EMPTY STOMACH.

Sorry if it was long to read. Im trying to give you as much infos as possible.

Thank you for your time!


P

[moh2010]

P

P? what do you mean buddy?

[razorsedge]

P? what do you mean buddy?

I think u missed P's answers to ur questions...they're in ur question portion in capital letters...interesting scenario you got going there

[moh2010]

I think u missed P's answers to ur questions...they're in ur question portion in capital letters...interesting scenario you got going there

oh thx man. I have not seen it.



AND THX YOU SO MUCH P

[moh2010]

I was thinking I knew alot... Look like I'll need to revised soon hahaha.

Im switching training methods tomorrow.

As for the bcaas, I gotta tell that I feel a huge difference when I take them and when I don't. I have so much more endurance and strength at the gym. I even learned its proved to aid in fat loss. Gotta say I'm shocked when you said it may harm my progress.

I will lower my volume and incorporate cardio. But I'm having issue doing the treadmill in the morning. Best for me would be postworkout. I'm living pretty far from my gym. Is still still okay?

[Praetorian]

I was thinking I knew alot... Look like I'll need to revised soon hahaha.

Im switching training methods tomorrow.

As for the bcaas, I gotta tell that I feel a huge difference when I take them and when I don't. I have so much more endurance and strength at the gym. I even learned its proved to aid in fat loss. Gotta say I'm shocked when you said it may harm my progress.

I will lower my volume and incorporate cardio. But I'm having issue doing the treadmill in the morning. Best for me would be postworkout. I'm living pretty far from my gym. Is still still okay?

Post workout cardio is fine yes....just have your post workout shake after you finish the cardio. BCAA's do not aid fat loss...they are amino acids ie proteins ie calories....they are marketing hype...have a whey isloate protein shake with 2 scoops protein and youll get approx 10g of BCAA's.
P

[fathead]

2 questions prae-

1) ive heard/read of users taking gh both daily, as well as in blasts pwo (ie divide your weekly dose into say 3 shots and have them post workout)

can you explain the reasoning behind this and why one would do it? is it effective? more for size than fat loss perhaps?

what would the timing of food/pwo drink be on this protocol?

2) is a keto style diet more effective over a shorter period of time rather than a longer period? example: if you could get down to say 8% bodyfat using carbs before switching to keto for your final weeks would that result in a more effective final product vs being on keto for a full 16-20 weeks?

basically does the body plateau on keto? are their down sides to being on keto longer then necessary? example: bber #1 does carb cycling for weeks 1-8 and keto for weeks 9-16, bber 2 does keto for weeks 1-16 (hypothetical #'s of weeks)

thanks

[Praetorian]

2 questions prae-

1) ive heard/read of users taking gh both daily, as well as in blasts pwo (ie divide your weekly dose into say 3 shots and have them post workout)
THE MOST EFFECTIVE WAY TO TAKE GH IS TO TAKE SMALLER DOSES THROUGHOUT THE DAY...SAY 3IU MORNING WITH BREAKFAST, 3IU AROUND 1PM AND 3IU POST WORKOUT

can you explain the reasoning behind this and why one would do it? is it effective? more for size than fat loss perhaps?YOU NEED TO TAKE GH EVERYDAY TO GET THE BEST RESULTS...EOD OR 5 ON 2 OFF ETC WILL NOT YIELD THE SAME RESULTS WITH FAT LOSS OR MUSCLE GAIN,

what would the timing of food/pwo drink be on this protocol?
TAKING GH WITH FOOD IE BREAKFAST AND POST WORKOUT IS IDEAL BECAUSE OF THE IGF RESPONSE...IGF ACTS SIMILAR TO INSULIN AND WILL SHUTTLE THE NUTRIENTS INTO THE CELLS

2) is a keto style diet more effective over a shorter period of time rather than a longer period? example: if you could get down to say 8% bodyfat using carbs before switching to keto for your final weeks would that result in a more effective final product vs being on keto for a full 16-20 weeks? THIS ALL DEPENDS ON THE INDIVIDUAL...IF THEY ARE CARRYING ALOT OF MUSCLE MASS THEN YES A SHORTER KETO PHASE IS MORE EFFECTIVE WITH CARBS IN THE EARLY PART OF THE DIET...IF THEY DONT CARRY MUCH MASS THEN IT IS BETTER TO RUN KETO LONGER

basically does the body plateau on keto? are their down sides to being on keto longer then necessary? example: bber #1 does carb cycling for weeks 1-8 and keto for weeks 9-16, bber 2 does keto for weeks 1-16 (hypothetical #'s of weeks) THE BODY PLATEAUS ON ANY TYPE OF DIET INCLUDING KETO...NO NOT REALLY ANY DOWNSIDE...YOU JUST NEED TO WATCH THE REINTRODUCTION OF CARBS AT THE END

thanks

P

[moh2010]

Hey P. I have a good one for you.

I'm about to finished my diet and I'm preparing my bulking cycle. I will take 2 months of maintenance in between.

When I take higher doses of androgen, I tend to have problem sleeping. I tried everything natural (melatonin, zma with 5htp...). The only it worked is ambiant and I dont have a script and I rather don't go that way. It's usually when I used long ester. The first few weeks are okay. But after 5-6 weeks, I start waking up 2-3 times per night. Not good at all. Energy is very low.

I was planing to used this:
1-8 Test-D 200mg eod
1-8 deca 150mg eod
9-16 test-400(e,c and d) 200mg eod
9-16 eq 150mg eod

But I think I'll have issue with sleep. According to pct calculator, I will have around 1300mg of test in me during the middle of the cycle.

What If I used short ester aas such as test prop and npp instead? The hormones wont build up just like long esters does.

1-6 test prop 100mg ED
1-6 npp 75mg ED
7-12 test prop 100mg ED (not sure about this part yet)
7-12 tren a 37.5-50mg ED (not sure about this part yet)

According to pct calculator, I will have around 341mg of test in me during the middle of the cycle. Strange, I'm using the same amount of test(700mg week), but I'll have 5x less than If I use long esters? shit!

Do you think the gains will be as powerful? Of course nutrition and training will be perfect.

thx

[Praetorian]

Hey P. I have a good one for you.

I'm about to finished my diet and I'm preparing my bulking cycle. I will take 2 months of maintenance in between.

When I take higher doses of androgen, I tend to have problem sleeping. I tried everything natural (melatonin, zma with 5htp...). The only it worked is ambiant and I dont have a script and I rather don't go that way. It's usually when I used long ester. The first few weeks are okay. But after 5-6 weeks, I start waking up 2-3 times per night. Not good at all. Energy is very low.

I was planing to used this:
1-8 Test-D 200mg eod
1-8 deca 150mg eod
9-16 test-400(e,c and d) 200mg eod
9-16 eq 150mg eod

But I think I'll have issue with sleep. According to pct calculator, I will have around 1300mg of test in me during the middle of the cycle.

What If I used short ester aas such as test prop and npp instead? The hormones wont build up just like long esters does.

1-6 test prop 100mg ED
1-6 npp 75mg ED
7-12 test prop 100mg ED (not sure about this part yet)
7-12 tren a 37.5-50mg ED (not sure about this part yet)

According to pct calculator, I will have around 341mg of test in me during the middle of the cycle. Strange, I'm using the same amount of test(700mg week), but I'll have 5x less than If I use long esters? shit!

Do you think the gains will be as powerful? Of course nutrition and training will be perfect.

thx



You might want to try Somalyze by Species....i find it works very well. Generally long esters produce better gains overall...but if you arent sleeping that will slow gains as well. Try sustanon 250mg eod a mix of esters...that may work better for you...along with the Somalyze.
P

[moh2010]

thx p for the advices. Sustanon seem like a better choice for me.

[Praetorian]

thx p for the advices. Sustanon seem like a better choice for me.

Glad to help.
P

[moh2010]

Glad to help.
P

My pleasure! What about adding gh? I never used it. I usually do humalog PWO (10iu) with 100g of carbs, 50g of prot). Big meal an hour after(low in fat)

Dave is recommending 4iu of gh with 5 iu of humalog every morning, followed with 5iu of humalog later on. I dont know about of humalog... Seem dangerous to use it everyday, for 3-4 months. Some say to use it a few times a week for better results (2-3 times a week on the hardest workouts).

Im interested on gh for the gains and also to prevent injuries while lifting heavy(tendons). I tend to have tendons issues after lifting heavy for a few weeks (mostly in my arms)

Also, some say to use igf-1(10-20mcg post workout). Cheaper and will produce as much lean mass as gh. And no need to use insulin postworkout. But no help for tendons I guess...

What should I do?

[Praetorian]

My pleasure! What about adding gh? I never used it. I usually do humalog PWO (10iu) with 100g of carbs, 50g of prot). Big meal an hour after(low in fat)

Dave is recommending 4iu of gh with 5 iu of humalog every morning, followed with 5iu of humalog later on. I dont know about of humalog... Seem dangerous to use it everyday, for 3-4 months. Some say to use it a few times a week for better results (2-3 times a week on the hardest workouts).

Im interested on gh for the gains and also to prevent injuries while lifting heavy(tendons). I tend to have tendons issues after lifting heavy for a few weeks (mostly in my arms)

Also, some say to use igf-1(10-20mcg post workout). Cheaper and will produce as much lean mass as gh. And no need to use insulin postworkout. But no help for tendons I guess...

What should I do?


GH, IGF-1, and insulin all have been used successfully by BB for additional growth. The key is to try to max out your growth on aas prior to starting these compounds. GH can also be expensive so it is limited to those who can afford it as you need to use it for a long period of time to see decent gains....ie months not weeks. GH is best used in the morning and post workout...basically your two most catabolic periods. You could start with 2iu twice daily and work up to 3iu twice daily over a few weeks. IGF-1LR3 is best used in conjunction with GH. It just seems to magnify the gains more as opposed to using it by itself. 10mcg in the morning and 10mcg post workout should be the maximum dosage...higher dosages will down regulate the IGF receptors very quickly and will halt any growth rapidly. Also you should run IGF 4 weeks on with a 2 week break in between...you can do this three times during a 16 week cycle..so 4 on 2 off, 4 on 2 off, and 4 on 2 off...then take a few months off. Insulin should only be used if you have stalled gains using GH and IGF. If you use insulin unnecessarily it will make you fat. Also Humulin R should be used NOT Humalog....it is slightly slower acting yet still considered a fast acting insulin. You only want to use insulin a couple times daily...ie morning with your GH and post workout...again your two times where you are most insulin sensitive. If you use Humalog and multiple times daily you are basically mimicking your natural production and you can develop insulin resistance. Humulin R 5-10iu in the morning with the GH and 5-10max post workout..both times obviously with a large meal and carbs. As a precaution start low and slowly work up to the max dosage and always have some fast acting carbs on hand in case you start to go hypo...regular coke is good, or gatorade. The key with insulin is you dont want to take too much and have to feed the insulin...you just want enough to shutle the macro nutrients into the cell and thats it...too much leads to hypo and then having to injest simple carbs and that leads to fat stores.

See below Dave's response from RX Muscle:

First off, whenever you inject exogenous insulin for performance-enhancing purposes (in an off-season growth scenario), you should always use Humulin-R (since it's fast acting but not too fast). What you're essentially attempting to do is to get a boost of this incredibly anabolic hormone 1-2 times per day max (6-10IU per dose) to help stimulate new growth. The way this occurs is that the large bolus of insulin maximally activates insulin receptors (on the surface of muscle cells) and it forces the large load of consumed macronutrients (protein/fats/carbs) into the muscle cells where they can then be utilized to build and repair muscle tissue. ......

You do NOT want to try to try mimic your own insulin production like a type 1 diabetic would (by taking small shots of a super fast-acting insulin such as Humalog) or else you'll find that you desensitize your insulin receptors (become insulin resistant) because you're constantly flooding the receptors with excess insulin (all throughout the day). When this happens the first response of the cells is to downregulate (reduce) the number of insulin receptors. Less receptors mean less growth. In my experience, I've found that twice (2x) daily dosing of Humulin-R will give you all the growth-promoting benefits without the potential concomitant insulin resistance.

For an advanced BB a cycle would look something like this.

week 1-16 GH 2-4 iu morning with breakfast and post workout
Week 1-6 Insulin Humulin R 5-10 iu morning with breakfast and 5-6 hours later preferably post workout.
Week 1-4, 7-10, 13-16 IGF-1 LR3 10mcg morning and post workout

I am not recommending this for ou...its just to illustrate how these compounds are used.

P

[moh2010]

GH, IGF-1, and insulin all have been used successfully by BB for additional growth. The key is to try to max out your growth on aas prior to starting these compounds. GH can also be expensive so it is limited to those who can afford it as you need to use it for a long period of time to see decent gains....ie months not weeks. GH is best used in the morning and post workout...basically your two most catabolic periods. You could start with 2iu twice daily and work up to 3iu twice daily over a few weeks. IGF-1LR3 is best used in conjunction with GH. It just seems to magnify the gains more as opposed to using it by itself. 10mcg in the morning and 10mcg post workout should be the maximum dosage...higher dosages will down regulate the IGF receptors very quickly and will halt any growth rapidly. Also you should run IGF 4 weeks on with a 2 week break in between...you can do this three times during a 16 week cycle..so 4 on 2 off, 4 on 2 off, and 4 on 2 off...then take a few months off. Insulin should only be used if you have stalled gains using GH and IGF. If you use insulin unnecessarily it will make you fat. Also Humulin R should be used NOT Humalog....it is slightly slower acting yet still considered a fast acting insulin. You only want to use insulin a couple times daily...ie morning with your GH and post workout...again your two times where you are most insulin sensitive. If you use Humalog and multiple times daily you are basically mimicking your natural production and you can develop insulin resistance. Humulin R 5-10iu in the morning with the GH and 5-10max post workout..both times obviously with a large meal and carbs. As a precaution start low and slowly work up to the max dosage and always have some fast acting carbs on hand in case you start to go hypo...regular coke is good, or gatorade. The key with insulin is you dont want to take too much and have to feed the insulin...you just want enough to shutle the macro nutrients into the cell and thats it...too much leads to hypo and then having to injest simple carbs and that leads to fat stores.

See below Dave's response from RX Muscle:

First off, whenever you inject exogenous insulin for performance-enhancing purposes (in an off-season growth scenario), you should always use Humulin-R (since it's fast acting but not too fast). What you're essentially attempting to do is to get a boost of this incredibly anabolic hormone 1-2 times per day max (6-10IU per dose) to help stimulate new growth. The way this occurs is that the large bolus of insulin maximally activates insulin receptors (on the surface of muscle cells) and it forces the large load of consumed macronutrients (protein/fats/carbs) into the muscle cells where they can then be utilized to build and repair muscle tissue. ......

You do NOT want to try to try mimic your own insulin production like a type 1 diabetic would (by taking small shots of a super fast-acting insulin such as Humalog) or else you'll find that you desensitize your insulin receptors (become insulin resistant) because you're constantly flooding the receptors with excess insulin (all throughout the day). When this happens the first response of the cells is to downregulate (reduce) the number of insulin receptors. Less receptors mean less growth. In my experience, I've found that twice (2x) daily dosing of Humulin-R will give you all the growth-promoting benefits without the potential concomitant insulin resistance.

For an advanced BB a cycle would look something like this.

week 1-16 GH 2-4 iu morning with breakfast and post workout
Week 1-6 Insulin Humulin R 5-10 iu morning with breakfast and 5-6 hours later preferably post workout.
Week 1-4, 7-10, 13-16 IGF-1 LR3 10mcg morning and post workout

I am not recommending this for ou...its just to illustrate how these compounds are used.

P


Thanks for this great answer. I tried lr3 a year ago, but I took 50mcg every postworkout for 3 months. It didnt worked very well. Took too much I guess. I think I'm gonna try the dave palumbo igf-1 cycle (11mcg everyday for 30 days, 2 weeks off, repeat...). It's 11mcg in the morning on non-training days and 11mcg postwortout. It's will cost me 100$. (with 8 weeks of sust+deca and enan+eq or tren)

As for the gh, I think I'm gonna wait a few years. I'm still young(27) and I dont think its will worth it to spend 1k for 4-5 blue tops. Insulin alone, I've done it and I feel fine. But I think igf-1 will produce better results alone than just 8-10iu of slin PWO. Seem much better for my health too.

[fathead]

p- does green tea have an effect on your adrenals?

ive come off a long diet (with clen/t3/caffeine used) and im trying to normalize everything

ive been supplementing with green tea, is this a bad idea? i know it has minimal amounts of naturally occurring caffeine in it

thanks

[Praetorian]

Hey P,

I followed a palumbo style keto diet for 16 weeks in the summer. Been off it for over 2 months now and up until 1-2 weeks ago everything was good. Now I'm definitely lactose intolerant. Also it seems the food I eat is going right through me.... I'll end up going #2 like 6 times a day. Have you heard or experienced anything like this before?.... and what would you recommend I try doing to fix this?

right now i'm eating alot of egg whites, full O3 eggs, chicken breasts, lean pork, blueberries, mangos, broccoli, pecans, almonds, walnuts... and whey protein (i'm under the impression the lactose in whey is extremely minimal)

Thanks

Most adults become lactose intolerant at some point in time...nothing to do with the diet. Are you not eating some form of carbohydrate?
If it is whey isolate then the lactose will be removed...if its a blend there is all kinds of lactose. You need to increase your fibre and add some slow carbs..ie brown rice, oats, etc
P

[Praetorian]

p- does green tea have an effect on your adrenals?

ive come off a long diet (with clen/t3/caffeine used) and im trying to normalize everything

ive been supplementing with green tea, is this a bad idea? i know it has minimal amounts of naturally occurring caffeine in it

thanks

It does contain caffeine but not alot...it should be an issue.
P

[fathead]

It does contain caffeine but not alot...it should be an issue.
P

im assuming you meant SHOULDN'T be an issue?

[Praetorian]

im assuming you meant SHOULDN'T be an issue?

Yep just a typo.
P

[gixxert]

Hey P., I’ve read this entire thread and I must say I’ve learned a lot.

My question is. I’m on week 13 of a 16 week Keto diet which has been quite successful. I’m planning on doing my first cycle and I’m wondering when would be the best time to start? Should I wait 4-6 weeks after I finish the diet so I’m back on carbs and take advantage of the heightened Insulin sensitivity or would it be better to start my cycle along with the heightened Insulin sensitivity?

Stats:
40 years old
5’ 10” @ 190 Lb’s (started at 238 Lb’s)
12% body fat
Training for 8 Years

Cycle Info: (First Cycle)
Week 1-12 Test E 250mg Twice a week (Total of 500mg)
Week 13 nothing
Week 14-15 2500iu of HCG Every third day, Total of 5-6 shots
Week 16-17 Clomid 50mg Twice a day and 12.5mg Aromasin Every day
Note: Aromasin Keep on hand for Gyno.

Should I run HCG or Aromasin along with the cycle? I’ve read conflicting information.

[Praetorian]

Hey P., I’ve read this entire thread and I must say I’ve learned a lot.

My question is. I’m on week 13 of a 16 week Keto diet which has been quite successful. I’m planning on doing my first cycle and I’m wondering when would be the best time to start? Should I wait 4-6 weeks after I finish the diet so I’m back on carbs and take advantage of the heightened Insulin sensitivity or would it be better to start my cycle along with the heightened Insulin sensitivity?

Stats:
40 years old
5’ 10” @ 190 Lb’s (started at 238 Lb’s)
12% body fat
Training for 8 Years

Cycle Info: (First Cycle)
Week 1-12 Test E 250mg Twice a week (Total of 500mg)
Week 13 nothing
Week 14-15 2500iu of HCG Every third day, Total of 5-6 shots
Week 16-17 Clomid 50mg Twice a day and 12.5mg Aromasin Every day
Note: Aromasin Keep on hand for Gyno.

Should I run HCG or Aromasin along with the cycle? I’ve read conflicting information.

You will always get a nice anabolic rebound after you finish a diet...this will last for approx 6 weeks thus I would use the rebound and get a nice natural growth spurt first then once the rebound is finished you can start yoru cycle and push even higher. Remember to add carbs back in very slowly and give your body time to adjust or you will end up retaining alot of water and jeopardizing your health. Only 30g in meals 1-3-5 for the first few weeks.
Cycle looks good....you dont need hcg while on use it when you are finished...as for the aromasin its good to keep on hand but i doubt you will see any estro sides on 500mg weekly of test.
P

[gixxert]

Thanks P., Great info.

[moh2010]

hey P. Igf-1, subq or IM? Ill be using the low doses protocol (3 cycles of 30days, 11mcg). Does it really matter to inject in both biceps after training arms? 5.5mcg on each sides or 11mcg on one side? Im hearing its dispersing in your whole body after a few minutes, so theres no need to do both sides...

hmm

thx

[Praetorian]

hey P. Igf-1, subq or IM? Ill be using the low doses protocol (3 cycles of 30days, 11mcg). Does it really matter to inject in both biceps after training arms? 5.5mcg on each sides or 11mcg on one side? Im hearing its dispersing in your whole body after a few minutes, so theres no need to do both sides...

hmm

thx

IGF-1 LR3 becomes systemic very quickly after injection therefore injecting into individual muscles will do little for that specific muscle. You can inject it IM in the delts is easiest...post workout on training days and in the morning on non training days.
P

[moh2010]

IGF-1 LR3 becomes systemic very quickly after injection therefore injecting into individual muscles will do little for that specific muscle. You can inject it IM in the delts is easiest...post workout on training days and in the morning on non training days.
P

perfect. Thats my plan!

thx!

[Nickjehook]

Im 5 foot 5, just won my first show at 23. it was last saturday lol. ive done several small cycles in the past, but i have until next june for my lvl 3 show. i was woundering for bulking how much test do you think is enough for someone my weight( 170lb 6%bf) to utilize efiiciently and help me move up to the next weight class.my current idea is:
250mg/every 5 days
30mg d-bol ED

i was woundering if this is enough gear to take or would i benefit by including EQ or Deca and if so at what dosage.


thanks for any input

[Praetorian]

Im 5 foot 5, just won my first show at 23. it was last saturday lol. ive done several small cycles in the past, but i have until next june for my lvl 3 show. i was woundering for bulking how much test do you think is enough for someone my weight( 170lb 6%bf) to utilize efiiciently and help me move up to the next weight class.my current idea is:
250mg/every 5 days
30mg d-bol ED

i was woundering if this is enough gear to take or would i benefit by including EQ or Deca and if so at what dosage.


thanks for any input

What was your last cycle?
P

[Nickjehook]

What was your last cycle?
P

i used 500mg week of test and 20mg d-bol
ed and 200mg EQ a week
Gained 10 pounds, kept it on
12 weeks

[Praetorian]

i used 500mg week of test and 20mg d-bol
ed and 200mg EQ a week
Gained 10 pounds, kept it on
12 weeks

Well i dont like orals because they basically kill appetite.
Heres a suggestion:

1-8 sust 250mg twice weekly
1-8 deca 200mg twice weekly
9-16 enanthate 250mg twice weekly
9-16 eq 200mg twice weekly
If you are going to run dbol then run it weeks 6-11

P

[Nickjehook]

Well i dont like orals because they basically kill appetite.
Heres a suggestion:

1-8 sust 250mg twice weekly
1-8 deca 200mg twice weekly
9-16 enanthate 250mg twice weekly
9-16 eq 200mg twice weekly
If you are going to run dbol then run it weeks 6-11

P

Sounds great, thanks alot i will be trying this out asap. I was just woundering the reason for the split at 9 weeks, what are the benefits associated with altering ester lenth and such?
Just curious?

[Praetorian]

Sounds great, thanks alot i will be trying this out asap. I was just woundering the reason for the split at 9 weeks, what are the benefits associated with altering ester lenth and such?
Just curious?

The body attenuates to almost any type of drug over time...thus by changing the compound or even the ester we try to avoid this attenuation. Over the long term switching compounds has shown to be more productive than remaining on the same ones.
P

[Nickjehook]

The body attenuates to almost any type of drug over time...thus by changing the compound or even the ester we try to avoid this attenuation. Over the long term switching compounds has shown to be more productive than remaining on the same ones.
P

thanks makes sense

[moh2010]

Hey p. Would you recommend to follow a cleanse(detoxification) a few times a year (digestion, colon, liver...)? I usually run nac and milk thistle pre or post cycle for the liver. But what about the rest?


Thx for answering my questions. You've been really helpful

[Praetorian]

Hey p. Would you recommend to follow a cleanse(detoxification) a few times a year (digestion, colon, liver...)? I usually run nac and milk thistle pre or post cycle for the liver. But what about the rest?


Thx for answering my questions. You've been really helpful

I always run a good liver flush/support post cycle. I have never done any type of cleanse etc...I know some do once or twice a year...but I cant say if it is really beneficial or not.
P

[Nickjehook]

I was just woundering if you have ever done this or ever heard of this being done. A friend of mine a pro in 202 and under told me that himself and other pros use a50's during the last 20-30 days leading up to a show.I responded to them what about the bloat and estrogen? they said there taking enough aromosin to worry about conversion..all these people that told me this have there pro cards or had, whats your opinion on this and would you recommend a50's ever, even during bulking?

[Praetorian]

I was just woundering if you have ever done this or ever heard of this being done. A friend of mine a pro in 202 and under told me that himself and other pros use a50's during the last 20-30 days leading up to a show.I responded to them what about the bloat and estrogen? they said there taking enough aromosin to worry about conversion..all these people that told me this have there pro cards or had, whats your opinion on this and would you recommend a50's ever, even during bulking?

A50's are very liver toxic so they need to be used very sparingly. I have done the A50's before a show and did not see a big difference. Aromasin wont help with A50 as it does not convert to estrogen anyway. If any oral is used precontest I would always use halo the last few weeks. Combined with test, tren, and winny or masteron you arent going to get any fuller or harder than on that.
Offseason i find dbol produces better longer lasting gains.
P

[Nickjehook]

A50's are very liver toxic so they need to be used very sparingly. I have done the A50's before a show and did not see a big difference. Aromasin wont help with A50 as it does not convert to estrogen anyway. If any oral is used precontest I would always use halo the last few weeks. Combined with test, tren, and winny or masteron you arent going to get any fuller or harder than on that.
Offseason i find dbol produces better longer lasting gains.
P

thanks thats what i suspected...a50 cause increase in SERM estrogen , but it is non reseptor mediated, i guess thats wht aromisin want help.

[Praetorian]

Review of oxymetholone: a 17alpha-alkylated anabolic-androgenic steroid.

Pavlatos AM, Fultz O, Monberg MJ, Vootkur A, Pharmd.
Northside Family Medicine, Chicago, Illinois 60659-4120, USA.
BACKGROUND: Oxymetholone (17beta-hydroxy-2-[hydroxymethylene]-17-methyl-5alpha-androstan-3-one) is a 17alpha-alkylated anabolic-androgenic steroid and a synthetic derivative of testosterone. It has been approved by the US Food and Drug Administration for the treatment of anemias caused by deficient red cell production. OBJECTIVES: This review summarizes the pharmacokinetics, current and future clinical applications, and adverse effects of oxymetholone. Relevant studies were identified using a search of MEDLINE through March 2001, supplemented by conference abstracts and presentations. RESULTS: Because of its anabolic properties, oxymetholone has been studied for the treatment of HIV-associated wasting, antithrombin III deficiency, pediatric growth impairment, and damaged myocardium, with varying degrees of success. Hepatotoxicity is a major adverse effect associated with the use of oxymetholone, with cholestatic jaundice the most important hepatic side effect. Less common hepatic side effects associated with the use of anabolic-androgenic steroids include peliosis hepatis and formation of hepatic tumors. All anabolic-androgenic steroids can cause androgenic side effects, including acne, hirsutism, hair loss, clitoral/phallic enlargement, vocal changes, erectile tissue stimulation, gynecomastia, amenorrhea, and changes in libido and sexual potency. CONCLUSIONS: As is the case with many anabolic-androgenic steroids, few pharmacokinetic and tolerability studies were performed before oxymetholone's approval in the 1960s. It has proved, however, to be an appropriate treatment choice for selected patients with anemia, if carefully monitored.


The point of the above study is that anadrol DOES have estrogenic side effects, but they are not mediated by estrogen metabolites, as is generally the case with other steroids. Anadrol is a DHT derivative and DHT derivatives generally do not aromatize

Either anadrol itself, or it's non-estrogen metabolites, mediates the estrogenic effects.

So dont bother using an aromatase inhibitor (arimidex, aromasin etc) to kill the estrogen effects of anadrol. it won't work.

Use an anti-estrogen instead like tamoxifen which in itself is a weak estrogen and binds to the estrogen receptor itself.


P

[red rocket]

Prae, I have a quick question regarding how I should handle my carb up, pre-contest, when running a keto.

Here's the quick and dirty of it.

Last weekend I competed in the ottawa show. Started my rebound, and was loving life. I started to get a little carried away, but I wasnt too worried as I had lots of time till June.

Now my wife and another competitor have talked me into doing the london show in 2 weeks time. So I am sitting here a little bloated, and decided to go with a keto diet for the next 2 weeks to try and tighten back up for london.

I have my meal plan all figured out, except what to do the final day or 2. I know keto works with the lack of carbs, so I'm not sure how to handle my carb up. Do I wait until after my weigh ins, which are at 8pm friday night. And I hit the stage at 11am saturday morning. Which realistically gives me time to carb up all night. Just set my alarm every 2 hours and eat.

Or do I handle the carb up like normal, and start thurs. This is my delemma.

Anyhelp here would be great.

[red rocket]

Decided not to go with a keto diet. As I didnt use it to get there, and it takes time to get kicken, So I'm just going to go standard protocal, low carbs for a bit, then a standard carb up.

[Praetorian]

Decided not to go with a keto diet. As I didnt use it to get there, and it takes time to get kicken, So I'm just going to go standard protocal, low carbs for a bit, then a standard carb up.

Thats a better idea...you dont have time for keto to be fully effective. Drop your carbs enough to lose the water...then you can deplete further and carb up. You wont have time to fully carb up if you start friday night...even eating thru the night is not long enough. I would start Wednesday and Thursday, drop water Thursday night and be dry for friday....that way you will not go over the weight limit and you can more carbs in with less chance of spilling over.
P

[red rocket]

Thanks bro, I appreciate that. These things are such a head game, and I find myself constantly second guessing myself.

[Nickjehook]

Review of oxymetholone: a 17alpha-alkylated anabolic-androgenic steroid.

Pavlatos AM, Fultz O, Monberg MJ, Vootkur A, Pharmd.
Northside Family Medicine, Chicago, Illinois 60659-4120, USA.
BACKGROUND: Oxymetholone (17beta-hydroxy-2-[hydroxymethylene]-17-methyl-5alpha-androstan-3-one) is a 17alpha-alkylated anabolic-androgenic steroid and a synthetic derivative of testosterone. It has been approved by the US Food and Drug Administration for the treatment of anemias caused by deficient red cell production. OBJECTIVES: This review summarizes the pharmacokinetics, current and future clinical applications, and adverse effects of oxymetholone. Relevant studies were identified using a search of MEDLINE through March 2001, supplemented by conference abstracts and presentations. RESULTS: Because of its anabolic properties, oxymetholone has been studied for the treatment of HIV-associated wasting, antithrombin III deficiency, pediatric growth impairment, and damaged myocardium, with varying degrees of success. Hepatotoxicity is a major adverse effect associated with the use of oxymetholone, with cholestatic jaundice the most important hepatic side effect. Less common hepatic side effects associated with the use of anabolic-androgenic steroids include peliosis hepatis and formation of hepatic tumors. All anabolic-androgenic steroids can cause androgenic side effects, including acne, hirsutism, hair loss, clitoral/phallic enlargement, vocal changes, erectile tissue stimulation, gynecomastia, amenorrhea, and changes in libido and sexual potency. CONCLUSIONS: As is the case with many anabolic-androgenic steroids, few pharmacokinetic and tolerability studies were performed before oxymetholone's approval in the 1960s. It has proved, however, to be an appropriate treatment choice for selected patients with anemia, if carefully monitored.


The point of the above study is that anadrol DOES have estrogenic side effects, but they are not mediated by estrogen metabolites, as is generally the case with other steroids. Anadrol is a DHT derivative and DHT derivatives generally do not aromatize

Either anadrol itself, or it's non-estrogen metabolites, mediates the estrogenic effects.

So dont bother using an aromatase inhibitor (arimidex, aromasin etc) to kill the estrogen effects of anadrol. it won't work.

Use an anti-estrogen instead like tamoxifen which in itself is a weak estrogen and binds to the estrogen receptor itself.


P

thanks bro, much obligued
also just woundering is it better to run nova when using d-bol with test or aromisin/aromidex?

[Shaun73]

p how would you incorperate hcg after a really really long cycle

[Praetorian]

thanks bro, much obligued
also just woundering is it better to run nova when using d-bol with test or aromisin/aromidex?

Dbol aromatizes greatly, especially with test...aromasin is preferred.
P

[Praetorian]

p how would you incorperate hcg after a really really long cycle

2000iu every third day for a total of 10000iu or five shots concurrently with an AI. A quick search will find my PCT protocol.
P

[Vitamin S]

p hows the following for an aggresive pct, been on for 9 months so wanna do it right. got this from palumbo

weeks 1-2 2000iu hcg every 3rd day
weeks 3-5 100mg clomid daily
weeks 1-5 1mg arimidex every other day

will be taking cialias and viagra thruougt and after pct for libido erection issues.

thnx

[Praetorian]

p hows the following for an aggresive pct, been on for 9 months so wanna do it right. got this from palumbo

weeks 1-2 2000iu hcg every 3rd day
weeks 3-5 100mg clomid daily
weeks 1-5 1mg arimidex every other day

will be taking cialias and viagra thruougt and after pct for libido erection issues.

thnx

Looks good...I prefer aromasin over arimidex because it doesnt push hdl down as much.
P

[z83]

Hi P,

What would you suggest for bulking diet ?? I tend to gain fat easily. I mean i'm gaining fat (or getting soft) with the basic keto diet with added carbs. I have 30g of complex carbs (ezekiel bread, oast brown rice only) with 3 meals + 25g malto with pwo shake. Last 2 meals are prot/fat.

I was looking for 50-60g prot, 30g carbs and 10g fats, 6 meals a day.

What would you do ? I thought I could stay somewhat lean... :(

i'm doing test/eq/tbol, 2 weeks in

Thanks

[Praetorian]

Hi P,

What would you suggest for bulking diet ?? I tend to gain fat easily. I mean i'm gaining fat (or getting soft) with the basic keto diet with added carbs. I have 30g of complex carbs (ezekiel bread, oast brown rice only) with 3 meals + 25g malto with pwo shake. Last 2 meals are prot/fat.

I was looking for 50-60g prot, 30g carbs and 10g fats, 6 meals a day.

What would you do ? I thought I could stay somewhat lean... :(

i'm doing test/eq/tbol, 2 weeks in

Thanks

Most people need to gain some fat do put on any significant amount of muscle. If you are worried about getting a bit softer then you wont gain much at all. Thats not to say you need to go over board. Your carb intake is somewhat low for a gaining cycle...you should be im the range of 200-250g of carbs daily. Your protein seems a bit high....50g is more than enough unless you are over 300lbs. I would scrap the malto and just use oats in your post workout shake...some dont respond well to high glycemic carbs.
50g pro+30-40g carbs+15g fat is usually where I would start the average client and adjust from there.
P

[z83]

Most people need to gain some fat do put on any significant amount of muscle. If you are worried about getting a bit softer then you wont gain much at all. Thats not to say you need to go over board. Your carb intake is somewhat low for a gaining cycle...you should be im the range of 200-250g of carbs daily. Your protein seems a bit high....50g is more than enough unless you are over 300lbs. I would scrap the malto and just use oats in your post workout shake...some dont respond well to high glycemic carbs.
50g pro+30-40g carbs+15g fat is usually where I would start the average client and adjust from there.
P

Thanks !! Pillsbury look, here I come.

30 mins cardio low intensity 3-4 time a week a good idea ? (is there a better alternative while adding mass ?)

[Praetorian]

Thanks !! Pillsbury look, here I come.

30 mins cardio low intensity 3-4 time a week a good idea ? (is there a better alternative while adding mass ?)

Yes thats fine.
P

[Nickjehook]

Lol i just asked dave polumbo how much test i could use a week and he said dont take more then 1200mg a week for someone at 160 at 3%bf lol that seems a bit excessive dont you think?

[Praetorian]

Lol i just asked dave polumbo how much test i could use a week and he said dont take more then 1200mg a week for someone at 160 at 3%bf lol that seems a bit excessive dont you think?

Hes talking maximum dosage not recommended dosage....you would do fine on 500-750.
P

[White T]

I finished a 10 week run of 625mg/week Sustanon 250, waited 18 days, and started PCT of Nolva 20mg, Clomid 50mg per day.. I am on day 11 of PCT, feel decent. When is the proper time to have bloodwork done? During PCT or right after it? Thank you :)

[Praetorian]

I finished a 10 week run of 625mg/week Sustanon 250, waited 18 days, and started PCT of Nolva 20mg, Clomid 50mg per day.. I am on day 11 of PCT, feel decent. When is the proper time to have bloodwork done? During PCT or right after it? Thank you :)

Blood work should be done after a two week washout period...ie two weeks after you finish the last clomid tab.
P

[moh2010]

Hey p. What's the safest/effective fatburner a woman can use? I can get clen 40mcg or cytomel 25mcg.

She's on keto since 8 weeks, and training also

[Praetorian]

Hey p. What's the safest/effective fatburner a woman can use? I can get clen 40mcg or cytomel 25mcg.

She's on keto since 8 weeks, and training also

Make sure she has a carb up meal each week otherwise her thyroid function will drop. Also cardio is necessary and should be increased slightly each week or two. Clen starting at 20mcg twice per day and increase by 20mcg every two weeks until max of 80mcg daily in divided doses is achieved. She should be dropping .5 to 1lb each week minimum otherwise she has adapted to the diet and cardio and they need to change.
P

[moh2010]

Make sure she has a carb up meal each week otherwise her thyroid function will drop. Also cardio is necessary and should be increased slightly each week or two. Clen starting at 20mcg twice per day and increase by 20mcg every two weeks until max of 80mcg daily in divided doses is achieved. She should be dropping .5 to 1lb each week minimum otherwise she has adapted to the diet and cardio and they need to change.
P

you're too kind. Thanks for your help P.

[Nickjehook]

what do you think is the most effective dosage of EQ for somebody as far as effeciency is concerned.

[Praetorian]

what do you think is the most effective dosage of EQ for somebody as far as effeciency is concerned.

200mg EOD.
P

[z83]

Hi P,

What do you think of artificial sugar like splenda and sugar free food/drink ?

Avoid of moderate amount ? Like some splenda in oats, crystal light, diet coke...

Thanks

[Praetorian]

Hi P,

What do you think of artificial sugar like splenda and sugar free food/drink ?

Avoid of moderate amount ? Like some splenda in oats, crystal light, diet coke...

Thanks

In moderation I dont see a problem.
P

[spankmonkey]

P,

been away for a bit an am getting back on track. Was curious about your opinion on itermittent fasting following a 16/8 protocal for effective muscle retention and fat pound losses.

Thanks in advance

[Praetorian]

P,

been away for a bit an am getting back on track. Was curious about your opinion on itermittent fasting following a 16/8 protocal for effective muscle retention and fat pound losses.

Thanks in advance

If muscle retention and fat loss is your goal there are specific diet for this...fasting etc is not part of them as it is not conducive to muscle retention...stay away from gimmicks.
P

[Praetorian]

P,

been away for a bit an am getting back on track. Was curious about your opinion on itermittent fasting following a 16/8 protocal for effective muscle retention and fat pound losses.

Thanks in advance

If muscle retention and fat loss is your goal there are recommended diets for this...fasting etc is not part of them as it is not conducive to muscle retention...stay away from gimmicks.
P

[nii]

What's your opinion on

1) Almond Milk - my gf brought home some 'almond breeze' by Blue Diamond Growers and I found it surprisingly good. Possible cows milk replacement? Just checked the ingred read: water, evaporated cane juice, almonds, vanilla flavoring. Meh.

2)Quinoa - Prefer this to long grain brown rice.

[Praetorian]

what's your opinion on

1) almond milk - my gf brought home some 'almond breeze' by blue diamond growers and i found it surprisingly good. Possible cows milk replacement? Just checked the ingred read: Water, evaporated cane juice, almonds, vanilla flavoring.

2)quinoa - prefer this to long grain brown rice.


1)NOT A GOOD CHOICE...LOW IN PROTEIN HIGHER IN SUGAR
2)GREAT ALTERNATIVE


p

[moh2010]

What's your opinion on

1) Almond Milk - my gf brought home some 'almond breeze' by Blue Diamond Growers and I found it surprisingly good. Possible cows milk replacement? Just checked the ingred read: water, evaporated cane juice, almonds, vanilla flavoring. Meh.

2)Quinoa - Prefer this to long grain brown rice.

Just a little input here... Almond breeze is making a no sugar added of vanilla and chocolate. You can add stevia for taste. This is what I do. 2g of carbs per cup

[moh2010]

Hey P. I have a quick question for. I made some research on the pain I get when I curl heavy after awhile... It's called the ulnar stress syndrome. I never found a real solution on the forums switching angles or resting until the pain goes away.


Do you think if I start doing some direct forearm exercises(wrist curls), it might help to keep lifting heavy during my upcoming bulk? I'm off keto like you know and I'm doing a 2 months maintenance. Do you think it will make a difference?

I never worked my forearms directly before... Just reverse curls, hammer curls

[Praetorian]

Hey P. I have a quick question for. I made some research on the pain I get when I curl heavy after awhile... It's called the ulnar stress syndrome. I never found a real solution on the forums switching angles or resting until the pain goes away.


Do you think if I start doing some direct forearm exercises(wrist curls), it might help to keep lifting heavy during my upcoming bulk? I'm off keto like you know and I'm doing a 2 months maintenance. Do you think it will make a difference?

I never worked my forearms directly before... Just reverse curls, hammer curls

That may help, also stick to ez curl bars only and dumbbells.
This is no doubt partially due to using a lot of straight bar curling with a weight heavy enough to only get 4-6 reps in with, it's called ulnar stress syndrome and it's due to extreme supination of the forearms and undue stress placed on the ulna secondary to weak forearm musculature.
P

[Odysseus]

Hi Prae,

I have a bunch of questions but I don't want to be annoying and post dozens of times, so I'll just try to write everything in one post.

Right now I am currently 5'7.5'', 178lbs at 9% bf. First cycle I ever did was var at 30mg/day for four weeks. (Back in 2008). I had amazing results and kept most of the gains. And then after waiting almost half a year and training clean, I tried Test Cyp at 500mg/week for 12 weeks. I ate a lot more due to the increase in appetite and I was constantly horny and felt unbelievably strong. I saw my weight go up with very little water retention or fat gain. (Possibly due to the addition of arimidex). But strangely enough, I almost feel as though my results (in terms of muscle mass) from var were better than the results from Cyp. I feel as though var made me bigger, stronger, and more ripped and the test gave me very little noticable size increase despite crazy strength and libido. Is this possible? I've read so much about how Test should always be the base and that Test alone is always better than running an oral alone when it comes to mass. What do you think accounts for my gains on var being so amazing yet my gains on test being subpar? Is it because my receptors were completely fresh when I tried the var? (Note: I DID make gains on Test, just not as much as I expected. Gained 15 lbs on var and only 10lbs on Test.)

For my next cycle I'm thinking about running Primobolan with Test for 12 weeks, and possibly throw in some more var towards the middle or end of the cycle. Do you think the addition of Primobolan would give me better gains than Test alone? (Assuming that diet and everything else is in check). What are your thoughts on Primo?

[Praetorian]

Hi Prae,

I have a bunch of questions but I don't want to be annoying and post dozens of times, so I'll just try to write everything in one post.

Right now I am currently 5'7.5'', 178lbs at 9% bf. First cycle I ever did was var at 30mg/day for four weeks. (Back in 2008). I had amazing results and kept most of the gains. And then after waiting almost half a year and training clean, I tried Test Cyp at 500mg/week for 12 weeks. I ate a lot more due to the increase in appetite and I was constantly horny and felt unbelievably strong. I saw my weight go up with very little water retention or fat gain. (Possibly due to the addition of arimidex). But strangely enough, I almost feel as though my results (in terms of muscle mass) from var were better than the results from Cyp. I feel as though var made me bigger, stronger, and more ripped and the test gave me very little noticable size increase despite crazy strength and libido. Is this possible? I've read so much about how Test should always be the base and that Test alone is always better than running an oral alone when it comes to mass. What do you think accounts for my gains on var being so amazing yet my gains on test being subpar? Is it because my receptors were completely fresh when I tried the var? (Note: I DID make gains on Test, just not as much as I expected. Gained 15 lbs on var and only 10lbs on Test.)

For my next cycle I'm thinking about running Primobolan with Test for 12 weeks, and possibly throw in some more var towards the middle or end of the cycle. Do you think the addition of Primobolan would give me better gains than Test alone? (Assuming that diet and everything else is in check). What are your thoughts on Primo?

Test should always be the base of any cycle whether you are gaining or dieting. The reason you feel you gained more on the var cycle is because it was your first cycle. This happens to everyone...the first cycle is always the best and you make fantastic gains whatever you use. However test is much more anabolic and androgenic than anavar so if you would have taken the test first instead of the var your gains would have been much higher...possibly 20-25lbs.
Test and primo is ok...any combination of an anabolic with test will always provide better gains than test alone...its called the synergistic effect. I would prefer something like test and EQ as it is a bit more anabolic then primo and it usually costs much less.
P

[Odysseus]

Thank you Prae! I know what to do now. This thread has been incredibly helpful. =)

[Sandwiches]

Prae, why do you believe in caffeine pre-workout? what bonus does it have other than artificial energy?

[Paully25]

I have a friend who ruptured his distal bicep tendon playing hockey. He's wondering if (a) he should get surgery, and (b) if there is a doctor you'd recommend he see that may specialize in these kinds of surgeries. I've seen you post about good doctors for other things, so thought I'd see if you have suggestions for this type of surgery (if you think going that route is best). From what I (he) understands, there is a short time period to make this decision and get the surgery if that is the route to go.

P.S. I read through this entire thread a few weeks ago, and learned A LOT, so thanks! :D

[Praetorian]

Prae, why do you believe in caffeine pre-workout? what bonus does it have other than artificial energy?

Yes it does help just dont overdo it. I dont drink coffee etc so when i take 200mg before a workout i can really feel it. It does enhance fat burning if you are dieting, as well as mental focus.
P

[Praetorian]

I have a friend who ruptured his distal bicep tendon playing hockey. He's wondering if (a) he should get surgery, and (b) if there is a doctor you'd recommend he see that may specialize in these kinds of surgeries. I've seen you post about good doctors for other things, so thought I'd see if you have suggestions for this type of surgery (if you think going that route is best). From what I (he) understands, there is a short time period to make this decision and get the surgery if that is the route to go.

P.S. I read through this entire thread a few weeks ago, and learned A LOT, so thanks! :D

Yes get it repaired if he wants to participate in any type of athletics.
If he is in the Toronto area call Athletes Care and see a sports medicine DR for a referral to an orthopedic surgeon. He has about 4-5 weeks to get it fixed...any longer and the tendon scars over and it cannot be repaired.

P

[moh2010]

Hey P. Im gonna use gh for my tendons next January for the whole 16 weeks.

Quick question: Can I mix igf-1(Acid acetic) and gh(bac water) in the same pin? Will it kill the gh?

[Praetorian]

Hey P. Im gonna use gh for my tendons next January for the whole 16 weeks.

Quick question: Can I mix igf-1(Acid acetic) and gh(bac water) in the same pin? Will it kill the gh?

First off GH will not do much for your tendons...it will not prevent tendonitis nor will it relieve it if you have it. It may strengthen the tendon somewhat but that is an expensive scenario just to improve tendon strength slightly. I would not mix the two IGF and GH...both are different peptides and when constituted are quite fragile...be on the safe side and inject each in separate pins...pins are cheap.
Do you have existing tendon issues?
P

[moh2010]

First off GH will not do much for your tendons...it will not prevent tendonitis nor will it relieve it if you have it. It may strengthen the tendon somewhat but that is an expensive scenario just to improve tendon strength slightly. I would not mix the two IGF and GH...both are different peptides and when constituted are quite fragile...be in the safe side and inject each in separate pins...pics are cheap.
Do you have existing tendon issues?
P

Thx P, I will split the injection then.

I googled '"gh tendons" and I found a bunch of peoples with the same problems as me: After a few weeks of heavy training, they are having tendons issues. A week after taking gh, all the problems goes away and only at 2iu /ed. I have a few friends who did the same(2iu only) and it went away after 4-5 days...

Since a week, I have a new tendon issue in my left arms (elbow flexor). I think I went too heavy on the decline skullcrusher (1-0-4 tempo)... I tried to do back and chest yesterday, but I couldnt do any pressing movement. Back workout was fine, but once I started doing pressing, i feel pain. So I need to rest... It sucks. I'm working on my legs really hard, especially hamstrings.


My priority right now is to heal 100%. So I wont do any pressing movement until I'm good.


It look like my body is not made to be big. I gained more than 80lbs since I started training like you know. If buying 3 kits will help me to keep my tendons strong while bulking, I will do it. Price is not an issue. I love training and having to back down on this is ruining my fun.

[red rocket]

Thx P, I will split the injection then.

I googled '"gh tendons" and I found a bunch of peoples with the same problems as me: After a few weeks of heavy training, they are having tendons issues. A week after taking gh, all the problems goes away and only at 2iu /ed. I have a few friends who did the same(2iu only) and it went away after 4-5 days...

Since a week, I have a new tendon issue in my left arms (elbow flexor). I think I went too heavy on the decline skullcrusher (1-0-4 tempo)... I tried to do back and chest yesterday, but I couldnt do any pressing movement. Back workout was fine, but once I started doing pressing, i feel pain. So I need to rest... It sucks. I'm working on my legs really hard, especially hamstrings.


My priority right now is to heal 100%. So I wont do any pressing movement until I'm good.


It look like my body is not made to be big. I gained more than 80lbs since I started training like you know. If buying 3 kits will help me to keep my tendons strong while bulking, I will do it. Price is not an issue. I love training and having to back down on this is ruining my fun.



I hope you dont mind this P, npp, deca or EQ is a much better way to "lube up" you joints. GH most of the time actually increases the pain in joints.

[Praetorian]

Thx P, I will split the injection then.

I googled '"gh tendons" and I found a bunch of peoples with the same problems as me: After a few weeks of heavy training, they are having tendons issues. A week after taking gh, all the problems goes away and only at 2iu /ed. I have a few friends who did the same(2iu only) and it went away after 4-5 days...

Since a week, I have a new tendon issue in my left arms (elbow flexor). I think I went too heavy on the decline skullcrusher (1-0-4 tempo)... I tried to do back and chest yesterday, but I couldnt do any pressing movement. Back workout was fine, but once I started doing pressing, i feel pain. So I need to rest... It sucks. I'm working on my legs really hard, especially hamstrings.


My priority right now is to heal 100%. So I wont do any pressing movement until I'm good.


It look like my body is not made to be big. I gained more than 80lbs since I started training like you know. If buying 3 kits will help me to keep my tendons strong while bulking, I will do it. Price is not an issue. I love training and having to back down on this is ruining my fun.

Anecdotal evidence is not accurate...if you are having tendon issues from skull crushers which by the way is quite common then I would suggest avoiding them...they tend to put tremendous pressure on the elbow joint and most who do them end up at some point n in time with tendonitis. GH will not help with this....you need to avoid the exercise, use an anti inflammatory (oral and topical) and rest. Pennsaid is a much better and cheaper option the GH...ask your Dr for it ...it is prescription only but he should have no issues giving it to you as it was developed for people with knee arthritis but works on all types of inflammation. Rest, ice, ibuprofen, and Pennsaid will reduce the inflammation quickly and allow healing to occur.
You need to deal with the tendon issue correctly...GH is not the answer and if you do not reduce the inflammation and get in under control you will eventually risk a tear GH or not. I know many many athletes who run GH...with no effect on tendon issues. Ive torn tendons while running GH year round never mind 2-3 kits.
P

[Praetorian]

I hope you dont mind this P, npp, deca or EQ is a much better way to "lube up" you joints. GH most of the time actually increases the pain in joints.

Deca is the best choice out of that group because it pulls fluid into the joint and actually has a mild anti inflammatory effect. However if the athlete has an existing tendon condition it can mask the pain from the tendonitis and he risks serious injury or a tear...its akin to using cortisone on an injury and then heading back out on the field or into the gym...the problem has not gone away you just dont notice it or feel the pain...until its too late.
GH only causes joint pain when injecting too high a dosage too quickly and fluid builds in the joint too fast causing pain. If you taper up slowly this wont happen.
P

[red rocket]

Deca is the best choice out of that group because it pulls fluid into the joint and actually has a mild anti inflammatory effect. However if the athlete has an existing tendon condition it can mask the pain from the tendonitis and he risks serious injury or a tear...its akin to using cortisone on an injury and then heading back out on the field or into the gym...the problem has not gone away you just dont notice it or feel the pain...until its too late.
GH only causes joint pain when injecting too high a dosage too quickly and fluid builds in the joint too fast causing pain. If you taper up slowly this wont happen.
P

Great to know bro, thanks

[moh2010]

Anecdotal evidence is not accurate...if you are having tendon issues from skull crushers which by the way is quite common then I would suggest avoiding them...they tend to put tremendous pressure on the elbow joint and most who do them end up at some point n in time with tendonitis. GH will not help with this....you need to avoid the exercise, use an anti inflammatory (oral and topical) and rest. Pennsaid is a much better and cheaper option the GH...ask your Dr for it ...it is prescription only but he should have no issues giving it to you as it was developed for people with knee arthritis but works on all types of inflammation. Rest, ice, ibuprofen, and Pennsaid will reduce the inflammation quickly and allow healing to occur.
You need to deal with the tendon issue correctly...GH is not the answer and if you do not reduce the inflammation and get in under control you will eventually risk a tear GH or not. I know many many athletes who run GH...with no effect on tendon issues. Ive torn tendons while running GH year round never mind 2-3 kits.
P

thank you P your advices are very well received like usual

[Shaun73]

Does Nandralone phenyl propionate have the same effect of ur joints as nandralone decanate?? I

[Praetorian]

Does Nandralone phenyl propionate have the same effect of ur joints as nandralone decanate?? I

Similar but to a much lesser degree. The shorter ester doesnt promote as much water retention as the much longer decanoate ester.
P

[Shaun73]

P im planning on running this cycle in the new year.

Week/Dose
1-16/ T400,2x a week(800mg test/week)
1-16/ EQ 600mg a week
1-8/NPP 100mg-150mg eod
8-16/Tren ace- 100mg eod

I have a 20ml bottle of test prop lying around and i wanted to use it to kickstart my cycle. Ive never done a front load before how do i go about doing it.

I was thinking frontloading the test prop for 2-3 weeks at 150mg eod

[Praetorian]

P im planning on running this cycle in the new year.

Week/Dose
1-16/ T400,2x a week(800mg test/week)
1-16/ EQ 600mg a week
1-8/NPP 100mg-150mg eod
8-16/Tren ace- 100mg eod

I have a 20ml bottle of test prop lying around and i wanted to use it to kickstart my cycle. Ive never done a front load before how do i go about doing it.

I was thinking frontloading the test prop for 2-3 weeks at 150mg eod

What are your stats...height , weight, age...cycle history...competitive?
P

[Shaun73]

5"7 190 lbs 10% bodyfat
21 years old. Been lfting since i was 15 years old


Done about 4 cycles, ive used everything in above cycle but npp

[Praetorian]

5"7 190 lbs 10% bodyfat
21 years old. Been lfting since i was 15 years old


Done about 4 cycles, ive used everything in above cycle but npp

Your cycle is complete overkill for someone your age and size. I wouldn't even recommend taking gear at your age...your natural test levels are so high there really is no need. If you were going to use something 500mg test weekly with 400mg EQ weekly is more than enough. There is no need for the high doses you posted nor the multiple compounds. At your age if using you might also want to think about running only for 12 weeks...this will make recovery easier and you can continue to grow naturally as well. Front loading is unnecessary...same with tren unnecessary.
P

[Shaun73]

too late for that ive done full blown cycles like this before. Just wanted to know how to kickstart with prop.

Ive done up to 4 compounds in 1 cycle before P, Nothing new to me. I know cuz im young u say this but my body is developed and ive been training since i was 15 years old. At 5'7 190lbs fairly lean im a big boy especially for my age i shit on all my friends lol

[massabsamurai]

^ you should really listen to what p has to say!

[razorsedge]

too late for that ive done full blown cycles like this before. Just wanted to know how to kickstart with prop.

Ive done up to 4 compounds in 1 cycle before P, Nothing new to me. I know cuz im young u say this but my body is developed and ive been training since i was 15 years old. At 5'7 190lbs fairly lean im a big boy especially for my age i shit on all my friends lol

I'm not sure why u asked for advice..u asked...u got it and then basically said ur going to do what u want anyway....big boy doesn't necessarily mean ur a smart boy....just sayin

[moh2010]

I'm not sure why u asked for advice..u asked...u got it and then basically said ur going to do what u want anyway....big boy doesn't necessarily mean ur a smart boy....just sayin

Come on P, you gave him the wrong answer.

[Shaun73]

dude i did cycles like that when i was 19yo. At this point I wont put on much muscle with 500mg of test a week. My body prob wont respond to it. Ive done up to 1200mg a week of test.... Yea i know im young and yea i know its a lot but the damage hase been done.

and guys my question wasnt on what cycle to run my question was how to kickstart with test prop

Dont get me wrong i do appreciate P advice and i do take it into consideration.

[razorsedge]

dude i did cycles like that when i was 19yo. At this point I wont put on much muscle with 500mg of test a week. My body prob wont respond to it. Ive done up to 1200mg a week of test.... Yea i know im young and yea i know its a lot but the damage hase been done.

and guys my question wasnt on what cycle to run my question was how to kickstart with test prop

Dont get me wrong i do appreciate P advice and i do take it into consideration.

Don't want to hijack as this is P's thread...OC..what is ur intent, you didn't say. Are you intending on competing or are you just trying to get bigger and stronger...I'm asking because if ur a competitor and ur going to take the risks with the gear dosages, I guess we could all understand a bit as the competitiveness is there in all of us...but if u just like walking around all jacked up ur taking some risks with ur health...but it's ur business. Thats all I'm saying...carry on as if ur normal

[Praetorian]

dude i did cycles like that when i was 19yo. At this point I wont put on much muscle with 500mg of test a week. My body prob wont respond to it. Ive done up to 1200mg a week of test.... Yea i know im young and yea i know its a lot but the damage hase been done.

and guys my question wasnt on what cycle to run my question was how to kickstart with test prop

Dont get me wrong i do appreciate P advice and i do take it into consideration.

Trust me most pros do alot of gear out of fear that the other guy is doing just as much...they come to realize more is not necessarily better and most guys respond better to much less then they think they need...you are going to have to trust me on this. What you did in the past doesnt have to ruin your future...thats up to you.
P

[Praetorian]

too late for that ive done full blown cycles like this before. Just wanted to know how to kickstart with prop.

Ive done up to 4 compounds in 1 cycle before P, Nothing new to me. I know cuz im young u say this but my body is developed and ive been training since i was 15 years old. At 5'7 190lbs fairly lean im a big boy especially for my age i shit on all my friends lol

Im not trying to be negative here....just realistic. At 5'7 190 even at 10% which i highly doubt is your actual BF % that is not very big...and to be using that much gear you have little room to move. My National level clients at the same height are 230-240 off season and quite lean...competing either at the very top of the LHW class 198lbs or the middle of the HW class 205-210. At 5'7 you really should not need gear to hit 200lbs and still be fairly lean.
P

[Shaun73]

ok i will give it a try

[Praetorian]

ok i will give it a try

Your training and nutrition far outweigh the importance of your cycle...most people make negligible gains not because they didnt take enough gear but because their training lacks intensity, their strength is low, and their nutrition needs dramatic improvements.
P

[Shaun73]

I have a great training/conditioning coach ;)So thats always in check

I do stray from my diet esp during winter i dont feel the need to stay lean
I came off recently and havent been eating clean so im not in my top form. right now im at about 200lbs; 10lbs overweight. My training is always in check and yes i do want to compete. Just waiting for the right time.

[Praetorian]

I have a great training/conditioning coach ;)So thats always in check

I do stray from my diet esp during winter i dont feel the need to stay lean
I came off recently and havent been eating clean so im not in my top form. right now im at about 200lbs; 10lbs overweight. My training is always in check and yes i do want to compete. Just waiting for the right time.

Whats your typical daily diet for offseason?
P

[Shaun73]

this is what my diet normally looks like.

Morning
60g oats pre cooked
1 large grapefruit (approx 10 oz edible portion)
350g liquid egg whites (11 egg whites)

approx 60g carbs, 50g protein, 5g fat

Meal 2
7oz chicken breast(cooked), 8oz baked potato (cooked)
5oz veggies
60g carbs, 50g protein, 6g fat

Meal 3
6.5oz tuna, 80g crispy crispy Minnies
60g carbs, 50g protein, 8g fat

Meal 4
7oz chicken breast(cooked) 7oz white rice(cooked)
1 tbsp low sodium soy sauce
60g carbs 50g protein 6g fat

meal 5
6.5oz inside steak, 7oz yam
42g carbs, 50g protein, 12g fat

Meal 6 (optional)
proteinshake
40g protein

Total cals 2425-2584
282g carbs, 250g-290g protein, 37g fat


If i want to bulk up i add more carbs and fats to each meal. I go around 10g fat per meal and maybe 60-70g carbs and 50g protein

If i lean out a little i just drop the carbs to about 40-50g, protein to 40-50 and fats minimal around 5-6g per meal

[Praetorian]

this is what my diet normally looks like.

Morning
60g oats pre cooked
1 large grapefruit (approx 10 oz edible portion)
350g liquid egg whites (11 egg whites) 3G PRO PER WHITE=33G YOU SHOULD INCREASE THIS TO 45-50G, CARBS CAN BE DROPPED TO 40G, FAT SHOULD BE INCREASED TO 20G

approx 60g carbs, 50g protein, 5g fat

Meal 2
7oz chicken breast(cooked), 8oz baked potato (cooked)
5oz veggies
60g carbs, 50g protein, 6g fat
CARBS TOO HIGH, FAT TOO LOW...GO FOR 40 AND 20

Meal 3
6.5oz tuna, 80g crispy crispy Minnies
60g carbs, 50g protein, 8g fat
AVOID CRISPY MINNIES USE A BETTER CARB SOURCE, AGAIN CARBS TOO HIGH, FAT TOO LOW

Meal 4
7oz chicken breast(cooked) 7oz white rice(cooked)
1 tbsp low sodium soy sauce
60g carbs 50g protein 6g fat
CARBS TOO HIGH FAT TOO LOW, USE BROWN RICE INSTEAD

meal 5
6.5oz inside steak, 7oz yam
42g carbs, 50g protein, 12g fat
INCREASE FAT SLIGHTLY BUT DECENT MEAL

Meal 6 (optional)
proteinshake
40g protein
NOT OPTIONAL 45G WHEY+40G CARBS+20G FAT

Total cals 2425-2584
282g carbs, 250g-290g protein, 37g fat

IF YOU WANT TO LEAN OUT GO ON A SERIOUS DIET OTHERWISE THE OFFSEASON IS FOR GAINING LEAN MASS.



If i want to bulk up i add more carbs and fats to each meal. I go around 10g fat per meal and maybe 60-70g carbs and 50g protein

If i lean out a little i just drop the carbs to about 40-50g, protein to 40-50 and fats minimal around 5-6g per meal


P

[bigtavi8]

Not to compare but im 21 like Overcrime, done 3 shows, nationally qualified and ive never run over 1, 2 compounds and im 242. Big deal. Point being at our age ive experimented with more or less but at this age we can only gain so much. Also i try to keep to short blasts if i do anything so i dont make it so hard to recover. If you were going for broke at the nationals and this was ur offseason id say go all out but if its just for you take ur time. Abuse is abuse but if your momentarily using a high dose for a short short time period to achieve a goal or certain look then go for it. I dont condone abuse but i no what competing is like and u do what u need to do to be at ur best whatever that means to u.

[kg2105]

have a few questions regarding cardio

whats your thoughts on doing low intensity cardio on an empty stomach first thing in the morning on a low carb diet.

once achieved desired body fat is it possible to maintain the condition without doing all the cardio? (i'm really only looking to get below 10%)

i'm 6feet, 217 , currently doing 40mins in the morning, and 30 mins post workout cardio.. going to up it 10 mins every week until i get where i want to be.

im about this lean in the first picture .. these pictures are from some guys post from bodybuilding.com on his various body fat levels (http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=214711)

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?s=&postid=1705834

trying to achieve something along the lines of.

http://forum.bodybuilding.com/attachment.php?s=&postid=2117293

[Praetorian]

Morning fasted cardio is fine and works well. Once desired bodyfat levels are achieved you can reduce cardio to 3-4 times weekly max 30 min each session. Your diet will play a big role in keeping bf levels down...you will have to keep carb levels relatively low.
P

[#8]

When doing seated overhead dumbbell presses heavy what is the best posture for ones back?

I have seen some guys make sure their entire back, including their lower back, stays tight against the bench to avoid using their chest int he lift Im assuming....?

Is it best to arch your back and keep the form strict on the movement, or keep your back perfectly straight?

[Shaun73]

P i noticed you advise against doing cardio during pct, but would 30mins low intensity cardio after workouts 2x/week really be counter productive?

I do this just to keep the fat off. Sometimes i cheat or go out to dinner. Even at only 30 mins 2x a week it does wonders for me keeping the fat off

[Praetorian]

When doing seated overhead dumbbell presses heavy what is the best posture for ones back?

I have seen some guys make sure their entire back, including their lower back, stays tight against the bench to avoid using their chest int he lift Im assuming....?

Is it best to arch your back and keep the form strict on the movement, or keep your back perfectly straight?

To answer this question all you need to do is look at any Olympic lifter doing the clean and jerk...their back is always arched.
P

[Praetorian]

P i noticed you advise against doing cardio during pct, but would 30mins low intensity cardio after workouts 2x/week really be counter productive?

I do this just to keep the fat off. Sometimes i cheat or go out to dinner. Even at only 30 mins 2x a week it does wonders for me keeping the fat off

Twice weekly at low intensity you should be fine.
P

[Shaun73]

P i noticed when u edited my diet u say to aim for 40g carbs 50g protein 20g fat

at 5 meals a day thats only 200g carbs a day. Usually im only able to get in 5 meals whith work and school. Isnt 200g carbs a day low?

[Nickjehook]

just woundering if someone in there off season 23 years old 5'4 180 at about 9% body fat is over kill to take

250 Test enanthate E3D
200 Eq e3D
i also was taking 30mg ED od D-bol, but i stoped because too much aromitizing and that was with taking aromidex 1mg ED?

[Praetorian]

just woundering if someone in there off season 23 years old 5'4 180 at about 9% body fat is over kill to take

250 Test enanthate E3D
200 Eq e3D
i also was taking 30mg ED od D-bol, but i stoped because too much aromitizing and that was with taking aromidex 1mg ED?

Thats fine....avoid orals they kill appetite.
P

[Praetorian]

P i noticed when u edited my diet u say to aim for 40g carbs 50g protein 20g fat

at 5 meals a day thats only 200g carbs a day. Usually im only able to get in 5 meals whith work and school. Isnt 200g carbs a day low?

6 meals per day offseason MINIMUM....thats 240g carbs...plenty to grow on.
P

[fathead]

a question regarding gh and fat loss...

does gh have, how can i phrase this... i max cap for a certain dose?

so for example, bber bob is on diet x and adds 5iu gh/day and is getting fat loss results. if bob stays on diet x will the 5iu of gh eventually be needed to maintain the leanness he achieves? will a dose of gh eventually stop producing ADDITIONAL fat loss (assuming diet is constant)

[fathead]

a question regarding dosages of gear and gains:

i read once in a while guys claiming they (or so and so) achieved better gains on a lower dosage than previously used... can you explain why this may be the case in some circumstances assuming diet and training are constant...

thanks

[Vitamin S]

hey p,

not sure if i asked this already, but is vet grade hcg by intervet the exact same compound as human grade by organon. i was told it is, but due to lableing laws they have to declare it as vet grade but hcg is hcg. what r ur thoughts on this. so if i am able to chose betwen the two, should i opt for vet grade since its cheaper?

thanks.

[Praetorian]

a question regarding gh and fat loss...

does gh have, how can i phrase this... i max cap for a certain dose?

so for example, bber bob is on diet x and adds 5iu gh/day and is getting fat loss results. if bob stays on diet x will the 5iu of gh eventually be needed to maintain the leanness he achieves? will a dose of gh eventually stop producing ADDITIONAL fat loss (assuming diet is constant)

Taking GH while dieting will aid in fat loss but like anything else it wont continue forever something must change....thus it is much easier to add some additional cardio or vary the diet to avoid stagnating instead of raising the GH dosage. Some say 4iu will result in maximum fat loss but I have noticed more fat loss on higher doses say 6iu....generally 10iu is about the max i would go.
P

[Praetorian]

a question regarding dosages of gear and gains:

i read once in a while guys claiming they (or so and so) achieved better gains on a lower dosage than previously used... can you explain why this may be the case in some circumstances assuming diet and training are constant...

thanks

Yes you are correct as that does happen and generally it is because as the dose goes up past the maximum effective dose with minimum sides the body tends to see the additional gear as a foreign substance that needs to be removed...ie people will get flu like effects, and a generally unwell feeling. Take test for example....about 1000-1200mg weekly is the max effective dose while minimizing sides....guys running 2000mg weekly and dropping to 1200 usually see improved gains...this is individualistic to but you can see the point.
P

[Praetorian]

hey p,

not sure if i asked this already, but is vet grade hcg by intervet the exact same compound as human grade by organon. i was told it is, but due to lableing laws they have to declare it as vet grade but hcg is hcg. what r ur thoughts on this. so if i am able to chose betwen the two, should i opt for vet grade since its cheaper?

thanks.

If it is HCG (Human Chorionic Gonadotropin) than it is the same as human stuff which is derived from the urine of pregnant women...its just made for vets who use it on dogs, cattle, horses etc
P

[A_N_T]

hi P! what do you think about this cycle
1-4 anadrol 175 mg ED
1-12 test e 250 EOD
5-12 d-bol 50 ED
5-12 tren e 225 E4D
every third week oral winni 30 mg ED for reducing sex hormone binding globulin
insulin aprox 20 iu after workout
HCG 500 IU E 2 week

[z83]

Hi P,

Do you think working legs twice a week is overtraining ?

It would be 6 days a week/split

[Praetorian]

Hi P,

Do you think working legs twice a week is overtraining ?

It would be 6 days a week/split

Yes if you are training with any type of intensity.
P

[Praetorian]

hi P! what do you think about this cycle
1-4 anadrol 175 mg ED
1-12 test e 250 EOD
5-12 d-bol 50 ED
5-12 tren e 225 E4D
every third week oral winni 30 mg ED for reducing sex hormone binding globulin
insulin aprox 20 iu after workout
HCG 500 IU E 2 week

Scrap the orals they kill appetite and put to much stress on the liver.
20iu is too much insulin in one dose...cut it back and use it twice daily instead...ie 8-10iu morning with breakfast and 8-10 iu post workout with shake,,,make sure you have enough carbs and use humulin R. HCG i would save until after the cycle.
1-8 test e 250mg EOD
9-16 test c or sust 250mg EOD
1-8 deca 200mg EOD
9-16 tren ace 100mg EOD
HGH 4-6iu ED

P

[A_N_T]

thanks! as i see you don't like orals at all :) you don't use them? is there any other reasons besides than it kills appetite (in my case yhey dont) and put to much stress on the liver?
do you think it's much more beneficial to switch esters of test? i have lots of test E nad prop (ethyl oleate)...
unfortunatly i found deca is not working for me (results was the same with or without deca)...
do you prefer tren ace in musclebilding cycle? or just because you dont want to finish on long eater?

[Praetorian]

thanks! As i see you don't like orals at all :) you don't use them?

*No i dont use them...only halo 2 weeks out from a contest thats it

is there any other reasons besides than it kills appetite (in my case yhey dont) and put to much stress on the liver?

*The results are not worth the cost nor the toxicity

do you think it's much more beneficial to switch esters of test? I have lots of test e nad prop (ethyl oleate)...yes it is beneficial to switch esters
unfortunatly i found deca is not working for me (results was the same with or without deca)...

*then unfortunately your deca is not good..use EQ instead

do you prefer tren ace in musclebilding cycle? Or just because you dont want to finish on long eater?

* tren ace is better then enanthate for a few reasons...mainly more aggression and faster in



p

[z83]

Yes if you are training with any type of intensity.
P

What's a good training to improve legs ? (they are lagging due to back injuries)

My usual training is squat, hacksquat or single leg press, leg curl/extension, stiff leg deadlift.

I'm focusing on good form for dead/squat to not injure my lower back again (not super heavy as I used)

[Praetorian]

What's a good training to improve legs ? (they are lagging due to back injuries)

My usual training is squat, hacksquat or single leg press, leg curl/extension, stiff leg deadlift.

I'm focusing on good form for dead/squat to not injure my lower back again (not super heavy as I used)

Squat, box squat, two leg leg press, glute ham raise, stiff legged deads, deads,
Its all about intensity....routines really dont ,matter much.
P

[fathead]

what would your suggestion be for leg training for a person with lower back issues that does not allow for deep squatting/pressing or heavy poundages?

buy track pants?

[Praetorian]

what would your suggestion be for leg training for a person with lower back issues that does not allow for deep squatting/pressing or heavy poundages?

buy track pants?

Honestly there are some with legitimate back issues but they are few and far between...most are just excuses to not have to squat etc. I had a herniated disk about 15 years ago...i was still able to recover and squat over 700lbs.
If the back is in fact an issue you can do unilateral exercises...ie single leg leg press, leg extension, also box squats off a higher box work well.
P

[MMASTAR]

Hey P, whats the best way to take GH and IGF together? Both PWO (if so what is the timing and where does the PWO shake fit in?) or GH in the AM and IGF PWO? As well, am i right in beliving that eating low glycemic carbs is OK with GH as it doesnt spike insulin to fast?

[A_N_T]

thank you P! in Russia almost everybody thinks that EQ is useless...do you think it works good? and what dosage?

[JacktheThriller]

Hey P just read BodyRx in one sitting, really enjoyed it. I have a question about his training schedule? He says 4 days a week with shoulders and abs on the last day. I do my shoulders after benching on chest and biceps day, basically i do i Upper Front/ Upper Rear and Lower body split into 3 days. It showing some good numbers in weight so I like it. What do you think of this?

[Praetorian]

thank you P! in Russia almost everybody thinks that EQ is useless...do you think it works good? and what dosage?

Nothing wrong with EQ...its not as androgenic as say tren but it is a good anabolic...200mg EOD is fine.
P

[Praetorian]

Hey P just read BodyRx in one sitting, really enjoyed it. I have a question about his training schedule? He says 4 days a week with shoulders and abs on the last day. I do my shoulders after benching on chest and biceps day, basically i do i Upper Front/ Upper Rear and Lower body split into 3 days. It showing some good numbers in weight so I like it. What do you think of this?

If you are going to do a 3 day workout then i would split the upper front and upper rear workouts with the lower body workout. Back to back chest and shoulders is asking for an injury...your front delts will be taking a beating. I would do Upper front Monday, lower body Wednesday, upper rear Friday.
P

[JacktheThriller]

good idea prae

[Casino]

Hey bro, been reading through this thread, very good info in here. Got a Q or 2 if u dont mind

1. so it seems from your previous advice, if i wanna do cardio JUST to keep my cardiovascular system in good health and not too lose fat you reccomend 15-20 min, higher intensity cardio about 2-3 times a week on non-workout days? is this right?

2. im finding my flexibility really going out the window the more size i put on, and this is bothering me, gotta do something about it, do you have a good stretching routine you can point me to, or a method u use?

[Praetorian]

Hey bro, been reading through this thread, very good info in here. Got a Q or 2 if u dont mind

1. so it seems from your previous advice, if i wanna do cardio JUST to keep my cardiovascular system in good health and not too lose fat you reccomend 15-20 min, higher intensity cardio about 2-3 times a week on non-workout days? is this right?

2. im finding my flexibility really going out the window the more size i put on, and this is bothering me, gotta do something about it, do you have a good stretching routine you can point me to, or a method u use?

1. Correct...you basically want to get your heart rate up to improve O2 efficiency.

2. I dont have any specific routine....stretching is done best after training...just google stretching for BB and youll find alot of info

P

[yannyboy]

Prae, firstly must say this has been such a good and informative thread.
What do you think of the slingshot training system, straight sets and 8 week blasts with anabolics with 2 week cruises?

[Praetorian]

Prae, firstly must say this has been such a good and informative thread.
What do you think of the slingshot training system, straight sets and 8 week blasts with anabolics with 2 week cruises?

Its a gimmick....you cant blast for 8 weeks then cruise for 2 if you are using long esters...the proper way to cycle is to run 12-16 weeks....with a long ester test as a base and an anabolic for synergistic effect. You can switch esters and anabolics at the midway point. The slingshot effect is best after a period of dieting ie precontest for 12-16 weeks.....the following 4-6 week window is a very anabolic period because the body literally absorbs almost all macronutrients. Also when you are off you are off that means just PCT and no aas period.
P

[Muayboran]

Yo brother

I have problems with my thyroid hormone T3. A while a go I ****ed up with t3 and went up to high dosages such as 100-200 mcg and since then I get fat really quick.. I think it switched my metabolism to a slow metabolism and I can't grind on junk like I used too..

very strange, my twin brother blp send me here and how can you advise me please

TANK YOU

[Praetorian]

Yo brother

I have problems with my thyroid hormone T3. A while a go I ****ed up with t3 and went up to high dosages such as 100-200 mcg and since then I get fat really quick.. I think it switched my metabolism to a slow metabolism and I can't grind on junk like I used too..

very strange, my twin brother blp send me here and how can you advise me please

TANK YOU

What is your age?
How long were you on T3?
How long have you been off?
P

[yannyboy]

Its a gimmick....you cant blast for 8 weeks then cruise for 2 if you are using long esters...the proper way to cycle is to run 12-16 weeks....with a long ester test as a base and an anabolic for synergistic effect. You can switch esters and anabolics at the midway point. The slingshot effect is best after a period of dieting ie precontest for 12-16 weeks.....the following 4-6 week window is a very anabolic period because the body literally absorbs almost all macronutrients. Also when you are off you are off that means just PCT and no aas period.
P

I am on TRT so I won't be doing any PCT. What do you advise for someone like myself who wants to blast/cruise, how long for each?
Do you agree with the slingshot when it comes to straight sets or do you prefer some other method like forced reps or drop sets?
Cheers Prae.

[Praetorian]

I am on TRT so I won't be doing any PCT. What do you advise for someone like myself who wants to blast/cruise, how long for each?
Do you agree with the slingshot when it comes to straight sets or do you prefer some other method like forced reps or drop sets?
Cheers Prae.

Please explain the slingshot effect with straight sets? I dont see how that works?
P

[massabsamurai]

Hey P,

should there be a change in your training system when you are on pct (lower sets, lower intensity) to keep the maximum gains?

[Praetorian]

Hey P,

should there be a change in your training system when you are on pct (lower sets, lower intensity) to keep the maximum gains?

Yes, you dont want to train to failure and yo also want to keep volume in check....thus 2-3 sets per exercise and stop before hitting failure.
P

[massabsamurai]

cool, thank you P!

[yannyboy]

Please explain the slingshot effect with straight sets? I dont see how that works?
P

You do no more than 12 working sets for each bodypart per week.
3-4 working sets to failure for each exercise.
Each set to failure is between 6-10 reps with no drop sets, forced reps, supersets etc.
Also how long in weeks would you recommend for blast/cruise?

[Praetorian]

You do no more than 12 working sets for each bodypart per week.
3-4 working sets to failure for each exercise.
Each set to failure is between 6-10 reps with no drop sets, forced reps, supersets etc.
Also how long in weeks would you recommend for blast/cruise?

I do straight sets, 3-4 exercises per bodypart, 3-4 sets per exercise, bodypart trained once weekly...no drop sets, no forced reps, no supersets all the time...I still dont see where the slingshot effect comes from??? Please explain

If you cycle for 12-16 weeks you should be cruising for at least 8.
P

[yannyboy]

Slingshot is because you blast for 8 weeks for high anabolics and 12 sets per bodypart then cruise for 2 weeks with trt levels of anabolics and 6 sets per bodypart. Author reckons gains on the blast tail of after 8 weeks and the cruise period sets you up for another blast. I have only just started running this system and it seems to be working.

[Praetorian]

Slingshot is because you blast for 8 weeks for high anabolics and 12 sets per bodypart then cruise for 2 weeks with trt levels of anabolics and 6 sets per bodypart. Author reckons gains on the blast tail of after 8 weeks and the cruise period sets you up for another blast. I have only just started running this system and it seems to be working.

That has nothing to do with a slingshot effect. Typically a BB will run a 12-16 week cycle and train with as much intensity as possible during this time. Once the cycle is finished aas are stopped and PCT is started and the intensity level of training is dropped because of lower test and higher cortisol levels.
In your scenario all you are doing is a de-loading phase that's it. If you truly want a slingshot effect it comes after a period of low carb dieting. At the point of finishing the diet the body is primed to be very anabolic once carbs are returned to the diet slowly. This can be achieved once per year by running a 12-16 week pre-contest type diet. This also gives the BB the advantage of reducing BF levels each year and enabling a lower BF throughout the rest of the year...a very good way to add lean mass without additional fat.
P

[yannyboy]

Okay, cheers Prae.
With regard to what you have said about blast/cruise, 12-16 weeks seems a long time to hit the anabolics hard and 8 weeks seems too long to cruise in order to maintain gains but hey, you have achieved alot more than myself so I will take on board what you have suggested.

[Praetorian]

Okay, cheers Prae.
With regard to what you have said about blast/cruise, 12-16 weeks seems a long time to hit the anabolics hard and 8 weeks seems too long to cruise in order to maintain gains but hey, you have achieved alot more than myself so I will take on board what you have suggested.

I go off all aas when running PCT and I maintain all my size without issue....no aas at all for 8 weeks. Why would it be difficult to maintain gains while on TRT cruising?
P

[yannyboy]

Prae, why would somebody of your standard come off AAS's completely for 8 weeks?

[z83]

Prae, why would somebody of your standard come off AAS's completely for 8 weeks?

health ?

[yannyboy]

I thought all the top bodybuilders were pretty much permanently on the gear

[Praetorian]

health ?

bingo!!
P

[Praetorian]

I thought all the top bodybuilders were pretty much permanently on the gear

Yes some are....the smarter ones come off and let the body normalize for health issues.
P

[yannyboy]

Okay cheers Prae, I think I will re-evaluate my cycles.

[solectronlondon]

P,
I have 2 questions...

1. what is your protocol for insulin use (humalog r) in terms of nutrient amount and timing?

2. what do you think of igf-1?

thank you again for answer

[bigtavi8]

I also would like to hear this from you P. Love doing research and no one better to ask then someone with a large amount of personal expierence and science to back it up.

[Praetorian]

P,
I have 2 questions...

1. what is your protocol for insulin use (humalog r) in terms of nutrient amount and timing?

2. what do you think of igf-1?

thank you again for answer

First off you should always use Humulin R not Humalog. You dont want to mimick the natural pulsatile schedule of endogenous insulin because that will lead to insulin resistance. You want to minimize its use and make it more efficient not less.
Humulin R used twice daily morning and post workout is best...5-10iu each time.
IGF-1 LR3 is ok but I find it tends to work best when combined with HGH...by itself I have seen little benefits. It should be used again morning and post workout 10mcg each time. Using more will not lead to better gains in fact you will see much less because it will quickly lead to receptor downgrade.
P

[Shaun73]

Hey P i dont know if any one has asked this before but can EQ and Deca be used together in a cycle with test? for example

800test/week
600eq/week
600deca/week

[Praetorian]

Hey P i dont know if any one has asked this before but can EQ and Deca be used together in a cycle with test? for example

800test/week
600eq/week
600deca/week

You can use them together yes...I prefer to split them up. I would increase the test to 1000mg weekly if you are running both at that dosage.
P

[z83]

Hey P,

Do you think vitamins are a must ? I've been told they help cleaning the organism (which shgould be a good thing with all the food, training, supplements)

Thanks

z83

[Praetorian]

Hey P,

Do you think vitamins are a must ? I've been told they help cleaning the organism (which shgould be a good thing with all the food, training, supplements)

Thanks

z83

The problem today is our food is lacking nutrients because of the way it is produced and stored. Years ago vitamins would not be of any benefit because the food was much more nutrient dense. Supplementing with vitamins now is not necessarily a must but it does provide additional nutrients that we are missing from our food. Vitamins do not help clean out the organism.
P

[solectronlondon]

First off you should always use Humulin R not Humalog. You dont want to mimick the natural pulsatile schedule of endogenous insulin because that will lead to insulin resistance. You want to minimize its use and make it more efficient not less.
Humulin R used twice daily morning and post workout is best...5-10iu each time.
IGF-1 LR3 is ok but I find it tends to work best when combined with HGH...by itself I have seen little benefits. It should be used again morning and post workout 10mcg each time. Using more will not lead to better gains in fact you will see much less because it will quickly lead to receptor downgrade.
P

P,
do you recommend injecting igf in the muscle worked post workout?

thanks again

[Praetorian]

P,
do you recommend injecting igf in the muscle worked post workout?

thanks again

IGF-1 LR3 becomes systemic within minutes after injecting therefore injecting into the muscle that was just worked does not make any difference. You can inject anywhere and still get the same effect.
P

[Vitamin S]

hey p,

not sure if u know the answer to this, i have been juicing every other morning before any meals using the jack lalane juicer. it basically consists of one apple, carrot, celery, beet and lemon. i like this combo and feel good drinking and skin has improved and overall just want to supply my body of nutrients. i still eat my veges, such as asparagus and broclli and cauliflower spinach etc with my meals in the day.

been reading a bit more, and found that most juicers create heat obviouslaly when juicing and this caueses nutrient and enzyme loss to some extent, but also oxidation occurs. so i got some tips like to keep the produce in fridge so its at cold temp, make sure the blade is in fridge over night, etc to reduce friction and rise in temp but the oxidation is that something that is actually dangerous to the body like i don't wanna be juicing and find out later that all this juice was rancid and i have been creating more oxidation from spoiled juice which can create health probs?

i been told it will happen no matter what and i can add lemon to it to off set it, and even when u cut an apple open oxidation immediatly occurs so if that was the case eating any vegetable or fruit would be bad?

thx

[Praetorian]

hey p,

not sure if u know the answer to this, i have been juicing every other morning before any meals using the jack lalane juicer. it basically consists of one apple, carrot, celery, beet and lemon. i like this combo and feel good drinking and skin has improved and overall just want to supply my body of nutrients. i still eat my veges, such as asparagus and broclli and cauliflower spinach etc with my meals in the day.

been reading a bit more, and found that most juicers create heat obviouslaly when juicing and this caueses nutrient and enzyme loss to some extent, but also oxidation occurs. so i got some tips like to keep the produce in fridge so its at cold temp, make sure the blade is in fridge over night, etc to reduce friction and rise in temp but the oxidation is that something that is actually dangerous to the body like i don't wanna be juicing and find out later that all this juice was rancid and i have been creating more oxidation from spoiled juice which can create health probs?

i been told it will happen no matter what and i can add lemon to it to off set it, and even when u cut an apple open oxidation immediatly occurs so if that was the case eating any vegetable or fruit would be bad?

thx

The heat and oxidation are minimal at best...insignificant to worry about.
P

[Vitamin S]

thanks.

[19inchCannons]

Hi Praetorian,

Just about to hit 8 weeks off AAS after using your HCG and other PCT advice. I feel really good so obviously I really appreciate your help. Wondering what somebody like you would suggest for my first run with HGH. I am a larger person, about 6'2 and 265lbs with 14%bf from caliper test today. 23 years old, and I have cycled responsibly for about 4 years. Always PCT after and always time off. I have no problem retaining size and never loose gains or strength. My plan is to try and take my body to monster status, and I know HGH would be the next step for me.

My plan is to take 200mg Prop eod, and Fina 200 mg eod. Nothing too crazy but pretty sizable dosage still. My diet and training will take care of the rest. What would be the HGH protocol for me?

Thanks very much in advance!

[Praetorian]

Hi Praetorian,

Just about to hit 8 weeks off AAS after using your HCG and other PCT advice. I feel really good so obviously I really appreciate your help. Wondering what somebody like you would suggest for my first run with HGH. I am a larger person, about 6'2 and 265lbs with 14%bf from caliper test today. 23 years old, and I have cycled responsibly for about 4 years. Always PCT after and always time off. I have no problem retaining size and never loose gains or strength. My plan is to try and take my body to monster status, and I know HGH would be the next step for me.

My plan is to take 200mg Prop eod, and Fina 200 mg eod. Nothing too crazy but pretty sizable dosage still. My diet and training will take care of the rest. What would be the HGH protocol for me?

Thanks very much in advance!


First off get full blood work done to make sure all i well. Feeling good is great but it is not an indication of everything being fine. In my opinion you need a few more years training prior to running GH...your diet and training will propel you much farther than GH will at this time. However for someone stating GH I would advise to start at 2iu per day and gradually increase to 2iu twice daily...morning and post workout. You need to run GH for months for best results not weeks so be prepared to spend a few thousand dollars otherwise you are wasting your time and money...and dont expect huge gains overnight...gains using GH are subtle and but build over time.
P

[fathead]

Prae- can you explain your (and others) reasoning behind why so many meals/feedings are required when dieting down? Is it purely for "metabolic" reasons because i know not everyone believes that to be true

I absolutely hate eating 6-7x a day. if it were up to me id eat 3-4x.

what would the difference be between bber A and bber B if they ate the exact same amount of food (and foods) during their contest prep but one ate them in more servings?

[Praetorian]

Prae- can you explain your (and others) reasoning behind why so many meals/feedings are required when dieting down? Is it purely for "metabolic" reasons because i know not everyone believes that to be true

I absolutely hate eating 6-7x a day. if it were up to me id eat 3-4x.

what would the difference be between bber A and bber B if they ate the exact same amount of food (and foods) during their contest prep but one ate them in more servings?

Foods have a thermic rating...protein is the highest which means you burn calories just digesting it. Also eating increases your metabolic rate...which is self explanatory. Eating the same amount of food in only 3-4 meals means the calorie content in those meals will be much higher...not the best when trying to get the body to use BF for fuel...ie calorie restriction. Also going longer between meals..ie 3-4 meals per day means the body wil be starving for amino acids during this time...hence it will have a tendency to catabolize muscle. I know not everyone agrees with this method but in BB it has been proven time and time again...it simply works and works well. In the scenario you spoke of I would say the BB thta ate the same but in less meals would be smaller muscle wise and less lean after all is said and done.
BB is one of the most difficult sports in the world....thats why there are very few guys walking around huge and ripped....because it takes alot of sacrafice and pain....and not too many people as you say enjoy that.
P

[Vitamin S]

hey p,

is it bad if i have 20g of protein from pasteriuzed egg whites with each meal, i just drink it down. based on budget constraints, and the good deal i get on them, i just do this to make sure i get all my protein in, this helps me. is it bad if i have too many egg whites.

[Praetorian]

hey p,

is it bad if i have 20g of protein from pasteriuzed egg whites with each meal, i just drink it down. based on budget constraints, and the good deal i get on them, i just do this to make sure i get all my protein in, this helps me. is it bad if i have too many egg whites.

Because they are pasteurized you avoid the risk of salmonella...but Avidin which is found in raw egg whites, blocks the uptake of Vitamin B6 (Biotin) causing a vitamin deficiency. I would say you are better off to have a scoop or so of whey protein instead.
P

[Vitamin S]

ok just have some conflicting info taken from http://www.leehayward.com/eggwhites/

so not sure kinda confused lol?

The human body cannot digest a raw egg white. So, if you like to do the "Rocky Routine" with a raw egg or raw egg white in your drink, you are wasting your time. Because of the Avidin found in a raw egg white, your body cannot digest a raw egg white. Not to mention the threat of Salmonella. You must cook the egg white to neutralize the Avidin and allow your body to digest the protein. Too much Avidin in your system can cause a Biotin deficiency.

[Vitamin S]

p,

i noticed allota top bb such as branch eat tons of red meat, reason being it keeps their muscle bellies full instead of flat which they claim chicken or other sources do. if this is the case why not eat chicken, and have healthy fats, after all the only reason why red meat keeps u full is due to fat content? is this not true and if its also creatine, they can use creatine on the side from powder form?

or is there another reason im missing?

thx

[Praetorian]

p,

i noticed allota top bb such as branch eat tons of red meat, reason being it keeps their muscle bellies full instead of flat which they claim chicken or other sources do. if this is the case why not eat chicken, and have healthy fats, after all the only reason why red meat keeps u full is due to fat content? is this not true and if its also creatine, they can use creatine on the side from powder form?

or is there another reason im missing?

thx

If you add fats to chicken and use creatine there is no difference...just personal preference.
P

[Praetorian]

ok just have some conflicting info taken from http://www.leehayward.com/eggwhites/

so not sure kinda confused lol?

The human body cannot digest a raw egg white. So, if you like to do the "Rocky Routine" with a raw egg or raw egg white in your drink, you are wasting your time. Because of the Avidin found in a raw egg white, your body cannot digest a raw egg white. Not to mention the threat of Salmonella. You must cook the egg white to neutralize the Avidin and allow your body to digest the protein. Too much Avidin in your system can cause a Biotin deficiency.

Thats just marketng BS...the body can digest raw egg whites it just cause a biotin deficiency over time. Pasteurized egg whites are not raw...they have been heated to kill bacteria...ie salmonella.
P

[O.S.B.B.]

First off you should always use Humulin R not Humalog. You dont want to mimick the natural pulsatile schedule of endogenous insulin because that will lead to insulin resistance. You want to minimize its use and make it more efficient not less.
Humulin R used twice daily morning and post workout is best...5-10iu each time.
IGF-1 LR3 is ok but I find it tends to work best when combined with HGH...by itself I have seen little benefits. It should be used again morning and post workout 10mcg each time. Using more will not lead to better gains in fact you will see much less because it will quickly lead to receptor downgrade.
P

What is the guideline as far as simple carb intake with IGF-1? I've read that with Humulin you should ingest 15g carbs per IU. Secondly, not that it will likely make much difference but should one take their IGF-1 BEFORE taking the HGH or vice versa??

Thanks P

[Praetorian]

What is the guideline as far as simple carb intake with IGF-1? I've read that with Humulin you should ingest 15g carbs per IU. Secondly, not that it will likely make much difference but should one take their IGF-1 BEFORE taking the HGH or vice versa??

Thanks P

Just have a balanced meal after taking IGF....you can also take IGF and HGH within minutes of each other and then have breakfast...no problem. 15g per iu of insulin is way too much....you will get fat as pig doing that. 10g per iu is more than enough...especially if you are eating a balanced meal.
P

[White T]

Last week, I came off of Finasteride (proscar 1.25mg/day) after 5 years of ED usage. I've read the horror stories on propeciahelp . com and am waiting to see if I experience a crash or the 'post-finasteride syndrome' as they call it. Would you recommend waiting to see what happens with my hormones now that I'm no longer taking this drug before starting to use gear again? I have been off for 12 weeks and had full blood testing done 2 weeks after my PCT ended, and everything was excellent (Don't know if it is to be attributed at all to the Finasteride or just a great recovery, but my T, Free T, and Bioavailable T were all above the baseline). The doctor called me in to discuss my results of higher than normal Test levels and this was not long after my PCT, which was a pleasant surprise to me. Could you share your thoughts on if it's safe to start a cycle or if I should see how my body acts without the finasteride in it now? Thank you as always

[#8]

What is the best exercise to strengthen and build muscle in the outer part of the quad? I have overly developed inner quads with only moderate development on the outside of it. What is the best target exercise or form within an exercise to achieve this?

[O.S.B.B.]

Thanks P.

One more quick one;

Do you believe ed for gh is more beneficial over the 5 on 2 off protocol? I'm doing 3iu/day right now and was thinking of bumping it up to 4iu/day but at 5 on 2 off.

Thanks again for all the help!

[fathead]

what are your feelings on quinoa as a carb source compared to say rice or oats... and lets assume were talking about carb sources while dieting (yes, i know youre a keto guy but... ;) )

[Praetorian]

Last week, I came off of Finasteride (proscar 1.25mg/day) after 5 years of ED usage. I've read the horror stories on propeciahelp . com and am waiting to see if I experience a crash or the 'post-finasteride syndrome' as they call it. Would you recommend waiting to see what happens with my hormones now that I'm no longer taking this drug before starting to use gear again? I have been off for 12 weeks and had full blood testing done 2 weeks after my PCT ended, and everything was excellent (Don't know if it is to be attributed at all to the Finasteride or just a great recovery, but my T, Free T, and Bioavailable T were all above the baseline). The doctor called me in to discuss my results of higher than normal Test levels and this was not long after my PCT, which was a pleasant surprise to me. Could you share your thoughts on if it's safe to start a cycle or if I should see how my body acts without the finasteride in it now? Thank you as always

If you have done blood work and all is ok then i dont think you wodl have to wait to start. What is your cycle history, age, weight, approx BF %?
P

[Praetorian]

Thanks P.

One more quick one;

Do you believe ed for gh is more beneficial over the 5 on 2 off protocol? I'm doing 3iu/day right now and was thinking of bumping it up to 4iu/day but at 5 on 2 off.

Thanks again for all the help!

Your body naturally pulses GH multiple times daily...there for an ED program using exogenous GH would be much more beneficial than 5 on 2 off. The only reason guys started using the 5 on 2 off method was to save money.
P

[Praetorian]

what are your feelings on quinoa as a carb source compared to say rice or oats... and lets assume were talking about carb sources while dieting (yes, i know youre a keto guy but... ;) )

Great carb source! Im not necessarily a keto guy its just one of the tools in my arsenal.
P

[ubcpower]

Hi Prae,
I am interested in trying D-Aspartic Acid as a non-enhanced athlete. I will probably order from TS and use around 3 grams/day in powder form. The one concern i have with the product are the statements claiming D-Aspartic Acid causes the body to produce aromatase...something i am obviously scared about! Now obviously if i was open to the idea of using drugs i could solve the problem by using an aromatase inhibitor. My questions to you are:
1. IS the product worth a go for myself?
2. Should i be concerned with the effects re: estrogen
3. If so, is there any over the counter or natural remedies to inhibit these aromatizing effects?

[White T]

If you have done blood work and all is ok then i dont think you wodl have to wait to start. What is your cycle history, age, weight, approx BF %?
P

Thank you P.

3 cycles, all 10 weeks with Test only.

29 years old, 245lbs, 6'5", 12% approx BF.

I haven't had blood tests since coming off of finasteride. They were completely fine after my PCT, though.

Would I worry that my hormones will become screwed up due to quitting finasteride, and thus putting off starting another cycle?

[Praetorian]

Thank you P.

3 cycles, all 10 weeks with Test only.

29 years old, 245lbs, 6'5", 12% approx BF.

I haven't had blood tests since coming off of finasteride. They were completely fine after my PCT, though.

Would I worry that my hormones will become screwed up due to quitting finasteride, and thus putting off starting another cycle?

I highly doubt your hormones would be screwed up from finastride..i think its more of an internet scare than anything. If it was actually causing serious issues it would have been taken off the market long ago. If in doubt get another blood test to be sure...its free and easy.
As for the next cycle I would recommend test enanthate or cypionate with an anabolic such as EQ or deca.
P

[Praetorian]

Hi Prae,
I am interested in trying D-Aspartic Acid as a non-enhanced athlete. I will probably order from TS and use around 3 grams/day in powder form. The one concern i have with the product are the statements claiming D-Aspartic Acid causes the body to produce aromatase...something i am obviously scared about! Now obviously if i was open to the idea of using drugs i could solve the problem by using an aromatase inhibitor. My questions to you are:
1. IS the product worth a go for myself?
2. Should i be concerned with the effects re: estrogen
3. If so, is there any over the counter or natural remedies to inhibit these aromatizing effects?

1. Not sure how much it costs but Im having a difficult time believing it will be worth the money...the people posting about using it do not seem impartial what so ever...alot of placebo effect happening there

2. Yes estrogen should be a concern..it can cause issues but the question is how much is actually produced.....IMO probably not much or not enough to be concerned about....especially with regards to running an AI

3. Novedex XT used to be a very good product for reducing estrogen but with the removal of 6 oxo from the market I dont see any viable natural alternatives

P

[Bam Bam]

hello I am new to the site and fairly new to the world of BB. I have started a cycle about a month ago and really need some advice. Am I on the right thread or is there a better plac that i could be asking these questions. thank you

[Bam Bam]

hello I am new to the site and fairly new to the world of BB. I have started a cycle about a month ago and really need some advice. Am I on the right thread or is there a better plac that i could be asking these questions. thank you

[massabsamurai]

hello I am fairly new to the world of BB. I have started a cycle about a month ago

LOL :wtf

[BMac]

hello I am new to the site and fairly new to the world of BB. I have started a cycle about a month ago and really need some advice. Am I on the right thread or is there a better plac that i could be asking these questions. thank you

:popc ask your questions here...prae knows his shit..though if you just started lifting and already on a cycle I most can tell you it's a bad idea

[Praetorian]

hello I am new to the site and fairly new to the world of BB. I have started a cycle about a month ago and really need some advice. Am I on the right thread or is there a better plac that i could be asking these questions. thank you

What is your question?
P

[#8]

What is the best exercise to strengthen and build muscle in the outer part of the quad? I have overly developed inner quads with only moderate development on the outside of it. What is the best target exercise or form within an exercise to achieve this?

[Praetorian]

What is the best exercise to strengthen and build muscle in the outer part of the quad? I have overly developed inner quads with only moderate development on the outside of it. What is the best target exercise or form within an exercise to achieve this?

Full barbell squat with a wide stance puts more emphasis on the vastus lateralis...or outer quad which you've probably heard as quad sweep.
P

[#8]

^^ Thanks.

What constitutes as "wide stance"? Anything greater than shoulder width apart? Should I go right to super wide or work my way out incrementally until I can get to a "sumo like" squat?

[Praetorian]

^^ Thanks.

What constitutes as "wide stance"? Anything greater than shoulder width apart? Should I go right to super wide or work my way out incrementally until I can get to a "sumo like" squat?

Just a bit wider then shoulder width is fine.
P

[#8]

toes pointing out or forward, or does it even matter?

[Praetorian]

toes pointing out or forward, or does it even matter?

Slightly out.
P

[#8]

My chest routine as of recent is as follows:

Warm up 2 sets of rotator cuff with 5lb weight x 12 reps

Incline DBell press:
30 x 10
50 x 10
80 x 5
110 x 8
95 x 10
80 x 12
65 x 15

With 1 - 2 minute rest in between each one approx.

Then I sometimes do weighted dips with a 10lb weight only cause my chest is pretty gassed after the presses and or pretty light cable crossovers. Most of the time I only do the cable stuff cause I fear Im over training chest as Im a natural lifter now.

Is this a decent routine for building steady strength / size? I eat A LOT of food, and use pretty good sources from all the food groups. Im making steady progress almost weekly but Im wondering if I can improve even faster or more efficiently.

Thanks.

[Praetorian]

My chest routine as of recent is as follows:

Warm up 2 sets of rotator cuff with 5lb weight x 12 reps

Incline DBell press:
30 x 10
50 x 10
80 x 5
110 x 8
95 x 10
80 x 12
65 x 15

With 1 - 2 minute rest in between each one approx.

Then I sometimes do weighted dips with a 10lb weight only cause my chest is pretty gassed after the presses and or pretty light cable crossovers. Most of the time I only do the cable stuff cause I fear Im over training chest as Im a natural lifter now.

Is this a decent routine for building steady strength / size? I eat A LOT of food, and use pretty good sources from all the food groups. Im making steady progress almost weekly but Im wondering if I can improve even faster or more efficiently.

Thanks.

As a natural lifer you can still push maximum weights on compound movements...just limit the volume. You will improve dramatically doing a compound movement before the dumbbells..ie barbell bench press, incline barbell press, hammer strength incline press. If you have shoulder issues make sure your form is correct...good arch, up on traps, tuck elbows, bring bar lower, drive with the legs, stay tight, squeeze the bar..do not use false grip. I would suggest 2-3 sets 4-5 reps, 6-8 reps, 8-10 reps after warming up. Then move to dumbbells, and finally you can do an isolation like cables or pec dec. You wont need as many warm ups with the dumbbells since youll be pretty warm from the compound movement.
P

[#8]

The reason I tend to use dumbbells only is because it seems to work better for me for building strength. I find it uncomfortable and somewhat painful for my shoulder even when my form is strict and perfect on a bbell bench press.

Does the dbell press not give me the same compound movement that a bbell bench is gonna give me?

[Praetorian]

The reason I tend to use dumbbells only is because it seems to work better for me for building strength. I find it uncomfortable and somewhat painful for my shoulder even when my form is strict and perfect on a bbell bench press.

Does the dbell press not give me the same compound movement that a bbell bench is gonna give me?

You will never get the same development from dumbbells as with a barbell. One you can use more weight with a barbell and two its bilateral movement...strength correlation is much higher on bilateral movements...ie squats as opposed to lunges, two legged leg press as opposed to single, bilateral leg extension. The other issue is while strength may increase with dumbbells to a point...it can become very dangerous just getting into and out of position. My best bench press was 585lbs....but there is no way in hell im going to try to dumbbell press the 200lb ers'...i value by shoulders and bicep tendons too much.
P

[#8]

So should I be maxing out on the barbell bench before I do the dumbbells? 2-3 sets, with the first set (after warm up) being a MAX lift of 5-6 reps, then pyramid down accordingly?

[Praetorian]

So should I be maxing out on the barbell bench before I do the dumbbells? 2-3 sets, with the first set (after warm up) being a MAX lift of 5-6 reps, then pyramid down accordingly?

Yes...exactly.
P

[#8]

So if Im maxing out on the bbell should I not be maxing out on the dbell? Should I also be trying to hit my max on the first working set of dbell press for 5-6 reps again, and pyramid down the same way?

[Praetorian]

So if Im maxing out on the bbell should I not be maxing out on the dbell? Should I also be trying to hit my max on the first working set of dbell press for 5-6 reps again, and pyramid down the same way?

Yes.
P

[ubcpower]

My chest routine as of recent is as follows:

Im a natural lifter now.

Thanks.

HRT is very natural

[bigdaddydrew123]

you might have answered this question but i havnt been on here in awhile, whats your opinion on slin without gh,im a competitive bb, want to up the gains, doing test 500/week deca 300/week

[Praetorian]

you might have answered this question but i havnt been on here in awhile, whats your opinion on slin without gh,im a competitive bb, want to up the gains, doing test 500/week deca 300/week

At the stage you are at slin is the last thing you need. Your cycles are still very beginner sized and you will make decent gains just from aas and good diet and optimal training. Slin is really only necessary when gains come to a halt for the BB who is on max dosages and running gh as well. If slin is used when you dont need it you will basically just get fat.
P

[#8]

HRT is very natural

the 100mg a week im on puts me in the normal range of free test and total test every time i get my blood work done.

so ya, i would say that im lifting without any assistance from sauce right now.

thanks for your input though.

[bigdaddydrew123]

At the stage you are at slin is the last thing you need. Your cycles are still very beginner sized and you will make decent gains just from aas and good diet and optimal training. Slin is really only necessary when gains come to a halt for the BB who is on max dosages and running gh as well. If slin is used when you dont need it you will basically just get fat.
P next question can a 46 year old make gains or am i foolin myself ,i know i can improve ie condition but at this stage can i make actual gains, itrain hard eat right, got off track for the last year and havnt trained consistantly for the first time since teens, im thinkin one last kick at the competitive can, but wondering if its worth poundin lots of gear if its to look the same at the end

[Praetorian]

next question can a 46 year old make gains or am i foolin myself ,i know i can improve ie condition but at this stage can i make actual gains, itrain hard eat right, got off track for the last year and havnt trained consistantly for the first time since teens, im thinkin one last kick at the competitive can, but wondering if its worth poundin lots of gear if its to look the same at the end

Simple answer....yes you can....if you are willing to put in the effort and sacrifice.
P

[Benny62]

Hey P, Happy New Year....

I'm 2 weeks into my Keto Diet. My keto sticks have been in the med/large and large amounts for keytones over the past week (40-80 mg/dL). Do you think it's a must to have one cheat meal a week? What's your protocol or the one you've prescribed?

What are the pro's or cons of not having a cheat meal through ALL weeks of dieting? I've never tried this.

This is my third time at the diet, so i'm tweaking things a bit but looking for input.

Thanks in advance.

B

[Praetorian]

Hey P, Happy New Year....

I'm 2 weeks into my Keto Diet. My keto sticks have been in the med/large and large amounts for keytones over the past week (40-80 mg/dL). Do you think it's a must to have one cheat meal a week? What's your protocol or the one you've prescribed?

What are the pro's or cons of not having a cheat meal through ALL weeks of dieting? I've never tried this.

This is my third time at the diet, so i'm tweaking things a bit but looking for input.

Thanks in advance.

B


Happy new year! Ketostix are useless for an athlete on a keto diet...if your diet is correct you will be in ketosis you dont need to measure it...they are also very inaccurate to begin with. A cheat meal or rather a metabolism boosting meal is very necessary on a keto diet because it prevents the reduction in t4 to t3 conversion. Running a keto diet without a cheat meal will result in a drastic reduction in overall fat loss.
P