Carbing up for the big show

[Praetorian]

Yah you are right, I was over generalizing.

The thiazide diuretcs have effects SIMMILAR to those of the loop duretics. Much like loop diuretics, thiazides increase renal excretion of sodium, chloride, potassium and water. In addition, thiazides elevate plasma levels of uric acid and glucose. The principal difference between the thiazides and the high-ceiling (loop) diuritics is that the maxium diuresis produced by the thiazides is considerably lower than the maximum diuresis produced by the high-ceiling agents. Additionally whereas loop diuretics can be effective even when urine flow is scant, (such as in patients with severe renal impairment)... the loop diuretics are usually effective even with low glomular filtration rates. The thiazides are not.

Mechanisms of action ... basically the thiazides work in the distal convoluted tubule (just past the ascending tubule of the loop) . The promote uring production by blocking reuptake of sodium and chloride... but they also increase renal excretion of potassium.


Basically the difference between a thiazide and a loop, is that the loop is more effective at doing its job.

**that becomes the problem

The way I see it, taking a loop in lower dosages isn't any different than taking a thiazide in higher dossage, other than you can be sure the loop is going to make you pee.

**more is not better.

So yah from a safety stand point, if you don't know what you are doing than taking a thiazide is a safer bet, as its got a built in safety mechanism.

**fine tuning....not pulling hard

That being said, I have give loads of lasix iv push to patients in the hospital. I have had patients who take lasix at 120 mg oral twice a day, every day.

** awful stuff...tried it a few times....it like death warmed over

Bottom line IMO is diuretics are much safer if you know what you are doing than the sodium depletion/ water loading methods.
**couldnt agree more

the other rule of thumb is LESS diuretic is BEST.

**BINGO....best advice yet!!!

The leaner you are though, the less you have to worry anyway about drying out, as there will be no place to hold water anyways.

**BINGO again....most guys who are "holding water" are spelling water incorrectly....it should be F.A.T ;o)

P

[Praetorian]

As for loading Sodium, I'll say yah I load it with my carb load, but I definitely don't start loading sodium when i start increasing my carbs. It takes a few days for me to fully load, I go very slow and conservatively, as the last thing I want is to get a turtle gut... Sodium goes from being avoided, to not avoided, but at the same time not overly sought after, and then at a certain point it is sought after. Bellow are some morning pics from my latest show.

Yah, I was harder at night and even harder then next morning, however... These pics alone demostrate better conditioning and hardness then I have ever brought to the stage in previous years alone.... Finding the perfect timing can only be done this way...

I don't like being attacked bro. The beautiful thing about bodybuilding is there are many different ways to skin the cat... Thats why it is such a unique sport!

I don't think my morning condition in these shots really can be strongly critizized... but from my standpoint there is much room for improvement, and that is why I love the sport.

Thats BB brother...they either love you or they hate you...no in between....as you get better the divide becomes clearer and clearer....no worries tho if you love the sport its water under the bridge.
P

[slin_shady1]

Holy f*(& you were hard and dry prisioner!! Nice job. Look forward to seeing you in S town soon.

[Prisoner#22]

**sodium was your problem...too low...you dont need to cut it just dont add additional sodium to foods...plus add it back in saturday...it will raise blood pressure and rid you of the cramping. Quinine sulfate will help but you need to take it days in advance....sugar free tonic water in a pinch....natural form of quinine.
P

Somebody told me drinking Milk helps also. ever heard of this?

[Andre Gregoire]

It's not the milk it's the calcium /magnesium that helps. When on a low carb diet I usually add in a cal/mag supplement anyway.

[Praetorian]

Somebody told me drinking Milk helps also. ever heard of this?

I would avoid milk...too many people are lactose intolerant and this will cause stomach distention and gas not good...also milk is very mucous forming....(the magnesium is a muscle relaxant and many are deficient-cannot be stored) so you add a magnesium supp and sip on sugar free tonic water and dip your finger in salt to reintroduce sodium.
P

[steve_d]

**sodium was your problem...too low...you dont need to cut it just dont add additional sodium to foods...plus add it back in saturday...it will raise blood pressure and rid you of the cramping. Quinine sulfate will help but you need to take it days in advance....sugar free tonic water in a pinch....natural form of quinine.
P

I didn't cut it, I was consuming about 3-4 grams per day (which I did on a regular basis throughout my diet) The cramping started within hours of waking I added it back in basically friday at 9am, had about 2grams friday and same saturday. Cramping didn't really subside until the night show - and was worse when sitting. I guess like you said, maybe the quinine was finally taking effect. Perhaps I should take days in advance as a precaution - because I always cramp on show day, perhaps I wouldn't have had the crazy friday cramps had I had some quinine a few days before.

The week after I had similar problems. It is probably something in my genetics...I can remember back in the day cramping up when getting dehydrated towards the end of a cycling race. Almost every time. I was the only person with this problem except for my brother - who often had same issue. I can only assume something about our genetics making us more easily cramped when dehydrated.

[Prisoner#22]

I would avoid milk...too many people are lactose intolerant and this will cause stomach distention and gas not good...also milk is very mucous forming....(the magnesium is a muscle relaxant and many are deficient-cannot be stored) so you add a magnesium supp and sip on sugar free tonic water and dip your finger in salt to reintroduce sodium.
P

Nah, what I meant is for somebody backstage who is having an attack of the cramps... downing say a litre of skim milk quick is suppose to subside them quickly. Thats what somebody told me.. but I have no direct experience with that.

[Andre Gregoire]

Nah, what I meant is for somebody backstage who is having an attack of the cramps... downing say a litre of skim milk quick is suppose to subside them quickly. Thats what somebody told me.. but I have no direct experience with that.

Pedialyte or Gatorade would do a much better job. Like P said it's an electrolyte imbalance, you need to put back in sodium and water or try to deal with it.

After the show is over I always have me some Pedialyte.

[Praetorian]

Pedialyte or Gatorade would do a much better job. Like P said it's an electrolyte imbalance, you need to put back in sodium and water or try to deal with it.

After the show is over I always have me some Pedialyte.

Yep!!
P