Bench Press Plateu...

[Primal]

Hey CB, been putting a ton of effort into getting my bench press numbers as high as possible for strength and size (mostly the latter -.- chest is still super lagging behind). About 2 weeks ago went for a 225 on the incline bench but failed on it unfortunately. I almost had it, was a good slow decent but my sticking point was about 3 inches off where I start to push up. I heard floor presses were really good for getting good at the lockouts but I don't know how to do them well and I don't know the speed or the reps that I should do them for. If anybody has done them or has a video on how to do them specifically for strength gains that would be greatly appreciated. I am also nearing the peak of my bulk (about 200 as of writing this) and I don't plan on going much higher. I'm about 11-12% and so I don't think the whole 'eat more and your bench will increase as your body weight increases' will work well for me. Anything past 203 lbs and I start to become incredibly bloated and it's hard to focus on lifting when you feel like crap!

Thanks guys!

-Primal

[steve_d]

Hey CB, been putting a ton of effort into getting my bench press numbers as high as possible for strength and size (mostly the latter -.- chest is still super lagging behind). About 2 weeks ago went for a 225 on the incline bench but failed on it unfortunately. I almost had it, was a good slow decent but my sticking point was about 3 inches off where I start to push up. I heard floor presses were really good for getting good at the lockouts but I don't know how to do them well and I don't know the speed or the reps that I should do them for. If anybody has done them or has a video on how to do them specifically for strength gains that would be greatly appreciated. I am also nearing the peak of my bulk (about 200 as of writing this) and I don't plan on going much higher. I'm about 11-12% and so I don't think the whole 'eat more and your bench will increase as your body weight increases' will work well for me. Anything past 203 lbs and I start to become incredibly bloated and it's hard to focus on lifting when you feel like crap!

Thanks guys!

-Primal

If incredibly bloated and feeling like crap, it's likely you are well over 11% and that your numbers on the bench will likely not improve that much more with the added bulk. If ~10-12% then I would think the size increase from there would have an impact on your numbers. But all of that is besides the point! Getting your bench up takes time and consistency. With everything perfected (technique, etc) you will need time. It also depends a lot on if you are looking to simply increase your 1RM, or just overall numbers on the bench. It seems size is more your focus, therefore I don't see the 1rm as necessarily the goal, so I wouldn't advise going for a 1rm incline press unless it's part of your specific training. In the past for example, I might have worked on 1 rm for weeks, and as the CNS gets used to the strain of 1 rep, and gets accustomed to it, the muscle fibers respond and the 1rm goes up. After a period of a few weeks of really low rep ranges, I surprisingly am able to handle higher weight for higher reps. So there is a possible benefit in alternating your training from low to high rep periods. In any case, for your question on floor presses....

I've done them in the past, I like them for a while, but tend to stop after a while since it's not the most comfortable thing to train. They will help lockout yes... I've since stopped doing these and favor benching to boards for lockout strength.

[Praetorian]

I would agree with Steve on the BF issue..i doubt you are under 11%. Most guys under estimate BF % by up to 5%. As well as Steve said getting your numbers up on the bench takes time and you also have to be lifting correctly and be using a program that is optimized to add strength and size if that is what your goal is. If you want big numbers you have to think in terms of years not months or weeks. If you are getting stuck at 225lbs floor presses are not the answer. Perfect your technique and make sure your routine allows for adequate recovery between heavy days. You cannot go heavy every bench day and expect continual strength increases. I also agree you should work on moving weights in the 4-8 rep range and not doing 1RM too often.

P

[Primal]

Thanks Steve and Prae, you guys could be right about the bf%.. I'm just going based on the fact that I can still see my abs barely and that I hold fat around my abs very well. So I could be higher I suppose. Mostly the reason I feel bloated Steve is that it is very hard for me to maintain this weight! My metabolism is going like a furnace! For example, today I had two ground beef wraps (whole grain tortilla, handful of ground beef, tomatoes and lettuce with a dash of salsa and low fat cheese) for meal #3 and the next hour after my class my stomach was rumbling, so I had to run out to subway and get a foot long unplanned! It's been like this for a few weeks now, every hour and a half to two hours I'm eating a meal.

I am really taking what you say to heart Prae, I am training in the 4-8 reps usually. But unfortunatley that's usually just with 185 lbs... I feel like I've been stuck too long at these certain weights for too long though you know what I mean? I know you guys say that I need to focus on years instead of months but I feel like I haven't moved up in bench press weight as much as I should be. I am just really trying to overload my chest a lot in hopes that it will grow faster or that my numbers will increase (which I hope will grow my chest too) with the 1 rm.. basically this all comes down to me being impatient and wanting results too quickly and I keep trying new things and my 1 rm to keep pushing it.

What is the average time it takes for size and strength to go up do you guys think? I've been able to do 185 lbs and such for over a year now. The only big difference is I've finally found a grip that gets me a great contraction and feel in my chest so I guess it's something... I don't know...

-Primal

[steve_d]

What is the average time it takes for size and strength to go up do you guys think? I've been able to do 185 lbs and such for over a year now. The only big difference is I've finally found a grip that gets me a great contraction and feel in my chest so I guess it's something... I don't know...

-Primal

Good question, and way too many variables to get a good answer. One big factor is how trained you are, and how much variance you have within yourself. Everyone is different and just to give you an example. My wife had our first baby, she took almost a year off the gym completely between the time she was pregnant and after giving birth. Within a day or two back she was hitting numbers she always had. She's been like this always. Strength doesn't really go too much. Myself, a completely different story. At that same time, I also took ~ a year off. I was benching 3 plates for reps, and when I returned, I was hitting 205 for about 8. Pathetic numbers in comparison. The strength came back in about 2-3 months, where I returned to my previous. Basically each week I would add 15 pounds to my max. Muscle memory is a good thing.

However, even in short periods of time off (a month for example), I can easily lose 40-50 pounds off my big lifts. This isn't just weight training. Back in my endurance days, I would be the slowest guy on the bike, or in the pool at the beginning of the season, but give me a few months of training and I improve like no one else.

All of this to say that everyone is different. Some people have a bigger potential to improve than others, just in the same way that some of the ifbb pros have genetics to gain like mad with good training and supplements vs. others who struggle just to gain 2 pounds in a year. It might be 5 years before your benching 2 plates for reps, given you've been stuck at 185 for a year.

I forget, but how old are you and how long have you been training consistently? Many people will see the biggest gains in the first year or two. After that, there isn't a specific amount of time where it takes to notice improvements. The improvements at that point will simply fluctuate with how you are feeling. If you're a powerlifter, your lifts tend to be correlated with the least injured part of your body. You might have a period of a few months where your squats suck, but you have a good consistent few months of benching, and those go up, then vice versa. Again, just more variables at play. The seasoned athletes/bodybuilders will either have very gradual increases or spikes at different points in their training / diet / bulk / cut, etc. I am stronger when I am a bit heavier, but the goal is that with each time I get lean, or fatter, that I am stronger than the last time I was lean or bulked. It certainly is a never-ending process.

One trick I've always used, which allows you to always feel as though your improving is this: For example bench:

Mark down a rep # that is your own PR for each weight on the bench (ex, 150 up to 200 in increments of 5). You'll have 11 records to break. Each bench day, pick the one you think is easiest to break. If you bench every 5th day, that's almost 2 months of records to break. That means you only need to improve by 1 rep every couple of months. ex:

150 - 15
155 - 14
160 - 12
165 - 12
170 - 11
175 - 9
180 - 8
185 - 5
190 - 4
195 - 3
200 - 2

If the above were you bests, then it would appear obvious that one record you might go for is 160x13, since you've already done 165 x 12. If you then get 14, you might go for the 155 weight next week. and so on. It's just a matter of looking at your own numbers and seeing patterns and finding what makes sense to try to accomplish. Your first couple of month will be spent setting your starting points of course. After a year or two, the low weight rep ranges might start getting too high to work with, so you start adding in new weight ranges (ex. 205, 210, and so on) - at least when you start thinking you can get it for a few reps that is. Although I've had a 1RM on my lists, I just rarely go for it.

[Primal]

Wow, I would love to have the muscle memory that your wife has Steve! I'm like you, if I take a week off I lose some weight to my lifts or I can do the same weight but I can't do as many reps. I am 19 years old, been training since August 3rd 2012. My birthday is in late July so I started just after I turned 17. I'm 6"4 currently as of today 201 lbs and a complete ectomorph. I should mention that while my incline bench has improved only slightly, my flat bench as shot up like crazy. A few months ago I was just barely able to do 225 lbs on the flat bench and now I'm doing 235 for up to 5 reps with my max being at around 250 lbs... so this is why I am trying to improve my incline bench, I feel if my flat bench can go up this drastically then I want my incline to go up as well!

That's a really cool method! It sort of sounds like a rep scheme that my friend told me about except with a few changes. It's called the '50 few' or something like that I forget the name... anyways the goal is to always hit 50 reps in a certain amount of sets that you plan for that day (this is mostly a high rep method but I've been told that it can be used for down to 20 reps or something like that). So if I wanted to get 50 reps on the flat bench for example I'd try to bang out 185 lbs for 15 reps, take a break, then 155 for 25 and then 135 for the remaining last reps. The point being that you set benchmarks for the certain weights and then try to surpass them rep wise on your way to 50 reps. Once you surpass them, you mark down the new reps that you got for that weight (lets say I got 155 for 26 reps this time) and use it as a benchmark the next time. So eventually, you move to your bigger numbers and slowly break them and keep progressing up starting with your small numbers first if that makes any sense at all? It sort of sounds similar to your method but except in this one you're always trying to hit the 50.

But I see what you mean, the biggest point is to document and benchmark where I am at and make slow progressions through breaking PR's through maximal reps, right?

-Primal

[steve_d]

Wow, I would love to have the muscle memory that your wife has Steve! I'm like you, if I take a week off I lose some weight to my lifts or I can do the same weight but I can't do as many reps. I am 19 years old, been training since August 3rd 2012. My birthday is in late July so I started just after I turned 17. I'm 6"4 currently as of today 201 lbs and a complete ectomorph. I should mention that while my incline bench has improved only slightly, my flat bench as shot up like crazy. A few months ago I was just barely able to do 225 lbs on the flat bench and now I'm doing 235 for up to 5 reps with my max being at around 250 lbs... so this is why I am trying to improve my incline bench, I feel if my flat bench can go up this drastically then I want my incline to go up as well!

That's a really cool method! It sort of sounds like a rep scheme that my friend told me about except with a few changes. It's called the '50 few' or something like that I forget the name... anyways the goal is to always hit 50 reps in a certain amount of sets that you plan for that day (this is mostly a high rep method but I've been told that it can be used for down to 20 reps or something like that). So if I wanted to get 50 reps on the flat bench for example I'd try to bang out 185 lbs for 15 reps, take a break, then 155 for 25 and then 135 for the remaining last reps. The point being that you set benchmarks for the certain weights and then try to surpass them rep wise on your way to 50 reps. Once you surpass them, you mark down the new reps that you got for that weight (lets say I got 155 for 26 reps this time) and use it as a benchmark the next time. So eventually, you move to your bigger numbers and slowly break them and keep progressing up starting with your small numbers first if that makes any sense at all? It sort of sounds similar to your method but except in this one you're always trying to hit the 50.

But I see what you mean, the biggest point is to document and benchmark where I am at and make slow progressions through breaking PR's through maximal reps, right?

-Primal

Yes the point is that each day you can 'break a record' by setting up many records to break - rather than always trying to do 175 for as many reps as you can (for example)... If you always pick the same weight, even if you are progressing, its impossible to gauge, since day 1 you might be able to hit 12 reps, but then the next day 12.05 reps, which is still 12 reps. By the time you can actually hit 13 reps, you'd have set many many records at other weights. Plus, if you are having a crappy day, you can just select one of the 'easier' PRs to break.... Doing this method, I've even set 2 PRs in 1 day, (ie having enough gas in the tank after the first set to break an 'easier' PR on the next.)

[Primal]

Yes the point is that each day you can 'break a record' by setting up many records to break - rather than always trying to do 175 for as many reps as you can (for example)... If you always pick the same weight, even if you are progressing, its impossible to gauge, since day 1 you might be able to hit 12 reps, but then the next day 12.05 reps, which is still 12 reps. By the time you can actually hit 13 reps, you'd have set many many records at other weights. Plus, if you are having a crappy day, you can just select one of the 'easier' PRs to break.... Doing this method, I've even set 2 PRs in 1 day, (ie having enough gas in the tank after the first set to break an 'easier' PR on the next.)

Wow, sounds like a good method to me! For sure going to use this method, thanks for the help Steve!

-Primal