HIT Training

[Socially_Inept]

any believers/followers? I've never been a hardgainer so I've never looked tried it, but have been looking into it recently. I figure I'd see what some people's opinions are on it, I'm cutting right now so I won't be able to try it for a while.

[Ritch]

any believers/followers? I've never been a hardgainer so I've never looked tried it, but have been looking into it recently. I figure I'd see what some people's opinions are on it, I'm cutting right now so I won't be able to try it for a while.

This is my domain. First book I read on this topic was P.O.F. position of flexion and goes by the hit philosophy. You basically do 3 exercises per bodypart. 2 sets each. One compound, one stretch type movement and one where you hold peak contration on it. Volume was never my thing. On most muscle groups you get the job done with 6 sets. Rep range from 6-12. Each muscle group trained once a week. As a matter of fact now that you`re cutting it would be a great time to try it. People overtrain as it is and when cutting your recuperation is shit especially when natural, so to me HIT is the way to go. Please don`t tell me you believe high reps are good for cutting...

[Timbo89]

The biggest part of cutting is gonna be your diet man, You can still train heavy, hell dorian use to train heavy straight through till competition. If you got your diet down, you can still train heavy. as dorian said about the subject "we put the muscle on and we're gonna keep it on"

[Socially_Inept]

no i dont believe i nthe high reps for cutting philosophy. i do a very typical split right now, hit each bodypart once per week with on average 6-9 sets each depending on the size of the muscle, thats not counting warmups. i tend to stay heavy while cutting to maintain strength. diet isnt a problem for me, ive been able to keep a pretty clean diet, drop weight relatively consistently and not lose muscle. i just find after a couple of weeks of training i need time off to rest cause i feel so worn out, so maybe it would be worth trying out.

how about a split like this:
day 1 (mon/thurs) - chest/shoulders/back
day 2 (tues/fri) - quads/hams/bis/tris/forearms

because id be hitting everything twice a week the volume would obviously be pretty low, most likely 1 exercise per bodypart. id also be using the 5x5 approach. any suggestions?

[Ritch]

^^^ That looks more like a DC type workout split. 5X5 training is a tough one, and for a cutter, I`m not sure it`s the best idea. You say you feel drained after a couple of weeks training. I can easily relate to that. Usually after the third week I may do a light week where I train eveyrthing lighting fast and use about 1/3 of my weight and shoot for 20 reps and cut the overall volume in about half. It basically feels like a long warm up and is tough to stick with the program. Then 4 more weeks or so of training, and then I take a week off. Basically every 8 weeks or so a week is taken off with a light week in the middle of the cycle.

[Socially_Inept]

^^^ That looks more like a DC type workout split. 5X5 training is a tough one, and for a cutter, I`m not sure it`s the best idea. You say you feel drained after a couple of weeks training. I can easily relate to that. Usually after the third week I may do a light week where I train eveyrthing lighting fast and use about 1/3 of my weight and shoot for 20 reps and cut the overall volume in about half. It basically feels like a long warm up and is tough to stick with the program. Then 4 more weeks or so of training, and then I take a week off. Basically every 8 weeks or so a week is taken off with a light week in the middle of the cycle.
so then stick with the split, but just drop the 5x5? should i just do the standard 3x6-8 then and save the 5x5 for when im bulking?

[Ritch]

so then stick with the split, but just drop the 5x5? should i just do the standard 3x6-8 then and save the 5x5 for when im bulking?

When you say the standard 3x6-8, how many exercises do you plan on doing per body part?

[Socially_Inept]

When you say the standard 3x6-8, how many exercises do you plan on doing per body part?
probably 1 or 2, as an example

day 1 - incline bench, lat pull downs, db military press, deadlift
day 2 - squat, leg curl, calf raise, bicep curl, skullcrusher

[Ritch]

probably 1 or 2, as an example

day 1 - incline bench, lat pull downs, db military press, deadlift
day 2 - squat, leg curl, calf raise, bicep curl, skullcrusher

As you know volume is an individual thing but when you do 4 exercises or even 5 on day 2 looks to me 1 exercise is enough because your total sets wil be 12 and 15. When you repeat the same muscle groups later on in that week, I`d change the exercises, if not, change the rep scheme. This type of program is odd to me because you`re leaving some gas in the tank for the next workout, something I`m not used to doing, but you mentioned your present training is similar to what I`m doing now and you`re looking for a change, so this to me seems like the next logical step.

I mention leaving gas in the tank because if you train the piss out of your biceps, when you train back again that week, your strength will suffer, same for doing triceps, then a few days later training chest. Something like this I take it will take you a little while to get used to seing what intensity is right for you.

[bottleneckblooz]

I follow the "Super High Intensity Training" principles, also known as S.H.I.T.:D

[Ritch]

I follow the "Super High Intensity Training" principles, also known as S.H.I.T.:D

Can`t believe I never thought of that, lol!

[Socially_Inept]

As you know volume is an individual thing but when you do 4 exercises or even 5 on day 2 looks to me 1 exercise is enough because your total sets wil be 12 and 15. When you repeat the same muscle groups later on in that week, I`d change the exercises, if not, change the rep scheme. This type of program is odd to me because you`re leaving some gas in the tank for the next workout, something I`m not used to doing, but you mentioned your present training is similar to what I`m doing now and you`re looking for a change, so this to me seems like the next logical step.

I mention leaving gas in the tank because if you train the piss out of your biceps, when you train back again that week, your strength will suffer, same for doing triceps, then a few days later training chest. Something like this I take it will take you a little while to get used to seing what intensity is right for you.
yeah that makes sense, i guess after running that split for little while i'll learn a thing or two about volume and what i can handle.

im taking the next week off cause im out of town but when i get back im gonna try that split out. im also going to cut out HIIT cardio cause it drains the shit out of me and stick to low/mid-intensity for 20-30 minutes/session.

thanks for the input, its counter intuitive to me to get results from dropping volume but we'll see how it goes.

[O-Train]

yeah that makes sense, i guess after running that split for little while i'll learn a thing or two about volume and what i can handle.

im taking the next week off cause im out of town but when i get back im gonna try that split out. im also going to cut out HIIT cardio cause it drains the shit out of me and stick to low/mid-intensity for 20-30 minutes/session.

thanks for the input, its counter intuitive to me to get results from dropping volume but we'll see how it goes.

I can almost guarantee it's counter intuitive because it's what you've been taught/learned. Not because you sat down and really took some time to think about it.

Why does a muscle grow? It grows to avoid being damaged. You force your muscles to grow by inflicting damage. Volume is a completely irrelevant factor on it's own. You need to beat that out of your head. Too many people get caught up with sets/reps/volume without thinking about what it is they are actually trying to accomplish. Or what kind of an effect the training is having on their body.

Volume is only good if you absolutely cannot push yourself hard enough to inflict the same amount of damage with less volume in a shorter period of time.

Or lets even look at the amount of weight a person lifts. Lets say you have a skinny little turd trying to bench 315 with a 2'' ROM. It's not like his muscles are saying: "Holy shit, this is 315, I better get huge". Muscles don't give a shit how much something weighs. They are interested in force ouput, muscle fiber recruitment and damage.

Or if you have one guy benching slow/controlled and another guy with his back arched, moving the bar explosively with a quick movement. If those two guys look the same they probably won't be moving the same amount of weight. Or if they are lifting the same weight they probably won't look the same. Because they are using different stimulus to achieve different results.

So when you are designing a program think about what it is you want to accomplish. Then think about what you will need to do to force your body to adapt. If you want big thighs and you arn't limping to the water fountain after working quads then you need to re-think things (for example).

That's my rant for the day.

[St]

I like the Dorian Yates style of training been doing it since 1996.

[Bowlcut]

I like the Dorian Yates style of training been doing it since 1996.

How many warmup sets do you do before you big ones?

[Ritch]

Volume is only good if you absolutely cannot push yourself hard enough to inflict the same amount of damage with less volume in a shorter period of time.

.

That is so true. When I hear guys say they do 4 exercises 4 sets each for chest and watch them train, their sets are not the same as the low volume high intensity guy. But like Mike Mentzer said " Volume is a bit like sun tanning. Some can stay out in the sun for a few hours and not get burned but some go out for 40 minutes and do". Something along those lines...

[Socially_Inept]

I can almost guarantee it's counter intuitive because it's what you've been taught/learned. Not because you sat down and really took some time to think about it.

Why does a muscle grow? It grows to avoid being damaged. You force your muscles to grow by inflicting damage. Volume is a completely irrelevant factor on it's own. You need to beat that out of your head. Too many people get caught up with sets/reps/volume without thinking about what it is they are actually trying to accomplish. Or what kind of an effect the training is having on their body.

Volume is only good if you absolutely cannot push yourself hard enough to inflict the same amount of damage with less volume in a shorter period of time.

Or lets even look at the amount of weight a person lifts. Lets say you have a skinny little turd trying to bench 315 with a 2'' ROM. It's not like his muscles are saying: "Holy shit, this is 315, I better get huge". Muscles don't give a shit how much something weighs. They are interested in force ouput, muscle fiber recruitment and damage.

Or if you have one guy benching slow/controlled and another guy with his back arched, moving the bar explosively with a quick movement. If those two guys look the same they probably won't be moving the same amount of weight. Or if they are lifting the same weight they probably won't look the same. Because they are using different stimulus to achieve different results.

So when you are designing a program think about what it is you want to accomplish. Then think about what you will need to do to force your body to adapt. If you want big thighs and you arn't limping to the water fountain after working quads then you need to re-think things (for example).

That's my rant for the day.
you make some really good points, it easy to forget the fundamentals sometimes

im going out of town this week on business so im going to try some full body workouts cause im really not sure if i'll be able to squeeze more then 1 or 2 workouts in, i'm going to have to focus on maintaining a high intensity to get things done

[kloan]

Can someone please clarify quickly for me...

What's volume and what's high intensity? In terms of weight vs reps, speed or amount of sets... etc.

Thanks :)

[Bowlcut]

Can someone please clarify quickly for me...

What's volume and what's high intensity? In terms of weight vs reps, speed or amount of sets... etc.

Thanks :)

The REAL definition of intensity is what % of the weight corresponds to a 1RM. So benching at 90% of 1RM is high intensity while 60% is not.

Volume is usually defined as the total number of sets plus reps (sum of the load) in eastern Europe methodology.

[St]

How many warmup sets do you do before you big ones?

For the first bodypart 2 sets,then 1 sets for every exersice after that.

[MoooBaby]

.

[Drummer]

The biggest part of cutting is gonna be your diet man, You can still train heavy, hell dorian use to train heavy straight through till competition. If you got your diet down, you can still train heavy. as dorian said about the subject "we put the muscle on and we're gonna keep it on"

The only time i lighten up is when im cutting estrogen right back. Other than that, I lift to fail by 7 most of the time, except for a couple muscles.

~D~

[Drummer]

also, its hard to train heavy and long with a cutting diet without overtraining and getting all broken down.

~D~