Winny and tren gyno

[Dzilla]

ive done search after search and i cant find a definite answer as to if winny actually does prevent gyno from tren....any input will be greatly appreciated

[ezturbo]

No. It won't. broscience.

[OrangePeel]

You need letrozole or cabergoline for progesterone induced gyno from tren


good read for AI's and serms and so on.

[canadianmuscle0803]

^indeed.

[OrangePeel]

Go down to the progestins, and you'll find what you need man. I have never used Winstrol for this, but have heard that it works with preventing. To get rid of or blast out some prog gyno you need letro or caber.

[canadianmuscle0803]

letro wont make tren gyno go away.. only caber will.

[OrangePeel]

I have been told by many that letro will reduce progesterone induced gyno from tren.

[canadianmuscle0803]

I have been told by many that letro will reduce progesterone induced gyno from tren.

hmm, never heard this before.. any research to back this up?

[OrangePeel]

Here was one of the articles for letro reversing gyno.

Here's the cut and paste of the original.......long read but good info.

I am posting this thread to help answer all of the questions regarding gyno prevention and reversal, the use of letrozole and other anti-e’s. I will go over everything in very simple easy to understand language. Also we are talking about estrogen gyno here, not progesterone (but using letro will stop progesterone related problems as well since it inhibits all estrogen anyways). Progesterone gyno will be enlargement of your nipple area, the actual aereola, not a lump under it.

Let me make this first point very clear, as I state in my signature this is from my personal experience, so whether you agree with it or not is your own issue. I have helped many people with gyno and it has worked just fine for them as well.

To first understand why you are doing what you are doing I am going to go over a few things and a few definitions:

SERM – Selective estrogen receptor modulator. These drugs work by binding to the estrogen receptors and flooding them in a sense, making it difficult (but not impossible by any means) for estrogen to bind to the receptors and thus prevent the onset of estrogen related side effects.
Most common forms: Tamoxifen (Nolvadex), Clomiphene (Clomid)
AI – Aromatise Inhibitor. These drugs work by inhibiting the aromatization of estrogen. This means that in effect AI’s prevent androgens from converting to estrogen, again, making it difficult (but not impossible) for estrogen to reach receptor sites.
Most common forms: Anastrozole (l-dex, a-dex), Exemestane (aromasin), Femera (letrozole). For our purpose of reversing gyno we are interested in Letro.

Letro and your sex drive:
Letrozole will suppress your sex drive. This is another reason why it is so important to act on preventing gyno as soon as possible. Since we all know that Test should be run in every cycle this will cancel out the effect of sex drive suppression.

Running letro to prevent gyno:
If you decide to run estrogen protection while on cycle (and I suggest you do unless you are aware that you do not require it), you can run either a SERM or an AI. Letro will be the most powerful AI you can use, it will inhibit 98+% of estrogen using a dose as low as .25mg and even lower. This is why I suggest you do not use a dose higher than .50mg while on cycle just trying to prevent estrogen related side effects.

You will want to start running the letro approximately 2 weeks before you begin your cycle to allow it to fully stabilize in your blood. I have often heard the argument that letro takes up to 60 days to stabilize, I don’t know if I buy into this for the reason that I have reversed gyno after using letro for only 1 week. Still to be safe I recommend starting it before your cycle as stated above.

If you do decide to run letro there is absolutely no need to run another AI or SERM. Do not make the mistake of thinking more is better. Think of it this way; if letro is preventing the conversion of androgens to estrogen than there is no estrogen, what would the purpose of a SERM be when there is no estrogen to bind to the receptors? Nolva will only take away from the effectiveness of letro.

This brings me to my next point. Do not listen to anyone who tells you to bump up your nolvadex to 60+mg ED if you get gyno. I have no idea where this idea started but I have seen it suggest far too many times recently. Nolvadex will do nothing to reverse your gyno…let me make that clear IT WILL DO NOTHING FOR GYNO. If you are running nolva as your anti-e and start to develop gyno than sure you can bump the dosage a small amount to try to prevent it from progressing further, but letrozole must begin ASAP.

It is very important that you begin taking letrozole immediately, the longer your wait the more risk you take in not being able to reverse it.

How do I know if I have gyno?
If you have developed gyno you will have a lump behind your nipple. It will be fairly hard, and it will be tender to touch.

Running letro to reverse gyno:
I am going to go over the three different scenarios which people could fit into. Remember regardless of what scenario you are in it is important that you begin taking the letro ASAP.

1. Already using an anti-e aside from letro.
2. Already using letro @ a dose of .25mg or .50mg ED.
3. Not running any estrogen protection.

1.
Day 1: .25mg Letro + anti-e*
Day 2: .50mg Letro
Day 3: 1.0mg Letro
Day 4: 1.5mg Letro
Day 5: 2.0mg Letro
Day 6: 2.5mg Letro **

2.
Day 1: .50mg Letro
Day 2: 1.0mg Letro
Day 3: 1.5mg Letro
Day 4: 2.0mg Letro
Day 5: 2.5mg Letro **

3.
Day 1: .50mg Letro
Day 2: 1.0mg Letro
Day 3: 1.5mg Letro
Day 4: 2.0mg Letro
Day 5: 2.5mg Letro **

*Regardless of the anti-e you are using it is important to still use it for the first day you begin letro as the letro will not have taken any effect and you by no means want your body to be without any protection when gyno is already prevalent.

** You will remain at this dose until gyno symptoms subside. Once you believe your gyno is gone it is important to stay at this dose for another 4-7 days to ensure all traces are gone. I recommend people with a bf% over 15 stay on for a week as it may be harder to judge completely whether the lump is completely gone. Once this period is over it will be important to taper letro down slowly rather than coming off it completely. Regardless of which manner you tapered up your dose you will all taper down in the same fashion.

Day 1: 2.0mg
Day 2: 1.5mg
Day 3: 1.0mg
Day 4: .50mg***
Day 5: .25mg
***You can remain at this dose or go down further to .25mg. It is really up to you at this point. They are both very common maintenance doses as an anti-e while on cycle. Personally I have stayed with .25mg and never had a problem.

Letro and the estrogen rebound:
With your estrogen being completely inhibited there is a definite estrogen rebound as your body tries to re-stabilize the testosterone:estrogen balance. We can prevent this rebound effect by supplementing further with another AI or SERM. So, I suggest that when you are coming to the end of your cycle you will more than likely be using Nolva in your PCT so just make sure that you begin taking nolva the last day you are going to take your letro and then continue on as you would with regular PCT.

This now leads us into the question of reversing gyno while not on cycle. There are a few things to remember here. You have already waited longer than you should have, and your sex drive will be shot. You can use tribulus or another natural test booster to help you in this scenario but I can’t guarantee the effectiveness. Just follow gyno reversal protocols 2 or 3. When coming off again you must taper and begin using nolvadex to prevent any rebound effect that may occur.

How much nolvadex should you use if you are not going into PCT and running this off cycle? I suggest starting at 20mg ED for a week and then lowering it to 10mg for another week and then coming off completely.

[OrangePeel]

Have seen this post on a couple other boards, just googling letrozole gyno, but had discussion with a couple of guys who have been using and advising on the use of letro for these reasons for years.

[waderow]

^^^ prolactin related gyno from tren is not the same thing as estrogen related gyno

you need dostinex (cabergoline)

[OrangePeel]

^^^ prolactin related gyno from tren is not the same thing as estrogen related gyno

you need dostinex (cabergoline)

Yes, as said, but he is asking about TREN related gyno, which is progesterone.

[gustavo77]

I have been told by many that letro will reduce progesterone induced gyno from tren.

Letro will do nothing to lower PROLACTIN... "Tren gyno" is caused by increased prolactin...this can cause the nipples to become hard, swollen and even lactate. It is very different than estrogen induced gyno in that no lumps, or permanent tissue will form...there may be significant swelling of the glands and this in turn can cause people to think that lumps or "breast buds" forming...but the swelling will subside once prolactin levels normalize.

Now if one is taking highly aromatizing steroid such as test, d-bol or deca with tren then they may indeed get symptoms of both estrogen related gyno and Prolactin induced gyno... and in this case, treatment would be both a prolactin antagonist (caber) AND an AI such as letro.

[ezturbo]

I have been told by many that letro will reduce progesterone induced gyno from tren.

Yea, okay, well theres still the problem of prolactin. Which will only be solved by dostinex. Progesterone and estrogen gyno causing lumps and boobies as apposed to your body making tissue to lactate caused by prolactin. You need both letro and caber on hand to be sure your not going to **** up.


Yes, as said, but he is asking about TREN related gyno, which is progesterone.

**** bro, there is two types of tren gyno. Both cause tissue formation. Dont be giving your 'solid' information without knowing the truth. You obviously have read one article, and your sticking with it.

[gustavo77]

**** bro, there is two types of tren gyno. Both cause tissue formation. Dont be giving your 'solid' information without knowing the truth. You obviously have read one article, and your sticking with it.

Actually tren only can cause one type of "gyno" and that is prolactin induced...in order for ANY tissue to form in males, estrogen/estrodiol must be above normal range and tren does not increase estrogen.

[ezturbo]

Actually tren only can cause one type of "gyno" and that is prolactin induced...in order for ANY tissue to form in males, estrogen/estrodiol must be above normal range and tren does not increase estrogen.

Unless your running test aswell or dbol or whatever. And in that case the progesterone caused by tren, plus all the extra the aromatising test cus tren took over the receptors, can cause regular gyno.

Ive always wondered, whos that in your avy gus. Those arms are something else.

[Dzilla]

ive been reading that winny will bind to the prolactin receptor so as to keep the tren from binding and causing gyno....thanks guys

[gustavo77]

Unless your running test aswell or dbol or whatever. And in that case the progesterone caused by tren, plus all the extra the aromatising test cus tren took over the receptors, can cause regular gyno.

Ive always wondered, whos that in your avy gus. Those arms are something else.

I agree with you, check out my post, post #13 above yours.. ;)

That is Dorian Yates bro...pretty cool i pic i think. Not the average Pro BB pic...

[gustavo77]

ive been reading that winny will bind to the prolactin receptor so as to keep the tren from binding and causing gyno....thanks guys

There is some research that shows winny can lower or compete with progesterone, not sure about prolactin though. That said, i know guys who were on test, tren, an AI and winny and they still got prolactin "gyno"....they all used cabaser to treat it.

[shivsean]

Here was one of the articles for letro reversing gyno.

Running letro to reverse gyno:
I am going to go over the three different scenarios which people could fit into. Remember regardless of what scenario you are in it is important that you begin taking the letro ASAP.

1. Already using an anti-e aside from letro.
2. Already using letro @ a dose of .25mg or .50mg ED.
3. Not running any estrogen protection.

1.
Day 1: .25mg Letro + anti-e*
Day 2: .50mg Letro
Day 3: 1.0mg Letro
Day 4: 1.5mg Letro
Day 5: 2.0mg Letro
Day 6: 2.5mg Letro **

2.
Day 1: .50mg Letro
Day 2: 1.0mg Letro
Day 3: 1.5mg Letro
Day 4: 2.0mg Letro
Day 5: 2.5mg Letro **

3.
Day 1: .50mg Letro
Day 2: 1.0mg Letro
Day 3: 1.5mg Letro
Day 4: 2.0mg Letro
Day 5: 2.5mg Letro **

.


No one needs this much Letro. Letro can take up to 2 weeks to reach a desired blood serum level from repeated dosing. The cummulative effect of 2.5mg ED of Letro when it catches up is overkill.

I have great results using as little as .25mg ED of Letro to eliminate gyno - but you have to let the drug build up in your system.

At 2.5mg ED you won't feel anything below your waist...

[theboss]

letro wont make tren gyno go away.. only caber will.


i have a friend who loves tren...and uses letro to control the gyno...he swears it works for him.

and know of other people who use winny for it..... i myself do not seem to have a problem with gyno thus far....knock on wood.

[Dzilla]

ill probably use all of it , deca has never gave me bitch tits at all, and if the winny doesnt work ill stop immediately. and for me no need to ad test, never get deca dick and my libido stays through the roof, i gues im lucky....any suggestions on how to use what i have....10ml of deca 300, 20 ml of tren acetate 100mg, 100 winstrol 50mg tabs,and 100 50mg clomid