Full Blood Work-Up & Physical - Need Advice

[hellfish]

Just got a full physical done and full blood work up. Everything is great, all levels are normal except my test. Its 4.8. I'm 33, haven't been on a cycle in 2 years, I do feel healthy, strong and in good shape, not lethargic, concentrate well, all seems good, but libido has been sinking the past year.

Does this sound like HRT is in my future? Is this low test level a natural thing at my age?

I see the doc tomorrow to discuss. Any advice from you guys that have been there would be appreciated. And I can't say I'm opposed to HRT at all LOL!

[L3]

free test or bound test? what is the reference rage, 4.8 as a number doesnt really mean anything.
LH & FSH levels?

[hellfish]

They just told me 4.8 as the test level, not specific to free or bound. They said normal was between 10-30. I didn't ask about LH or FSH, they said everything else was normal though.

[big_luse]

Thats very low. I was like 13 and my doc hooked me up. Everyones ideal state is different though. What alot of people dont know is that when your body has low test, your SHBG and albumin also will drop and in some cases your end up with approxmatley the same amount of free -test regardless of your total test.

But yeah, Id suggest running a PCT and seeing where you end up or getting on TRT.

[big_luse]

^reference range in Canada for Total tst is approx 10-30
reference range for free test is 25-100
(units im not sure)

[hellfish]

The said range was 10-30 so it must be total test. Damn, I'm a 6 year old girl.

[Old-Dog]

Family doctors aren't concerned if you have the test levels of an 80 year old man, as long as that number falls within range of what medical standards dictate as healthy. Trust me, who knows what your normal range could be, maybe you used to have a natural level of 14-24. Not 4.8. So, it would suggests your low.

You can contest this by simply requesting further bloodwork to investgate your low test levels and would like to be refered to a endocronologist(Hormone specialist) which is in your rights as a tax paying civilian.

I had the same bloodwork and mine came back 2.8 out of a range of 4-200. As long as you aren't zero doctors wouldn't prescribe you a tictac.

Now, if they felt as though it were low, the best you would get is a monthly supply of "Andriol" which is a testostrone gel suspended in a gel cap.(Oral)

I hated that shitty lil gel cap so, I prescribed my own meds by adding a cycle of HCG, Clomid and 2000mg of Tribulis daily. For 3 weeks. When I had finnished that my balls were massive. I then jumped on 2 weeks of arimidex after that to ensure I had destroyed any free estrogen floating around.

I went back to my doc, got retested...My natural test went up 30 points!!!

I felt great and had no issues with my health from that point.

This is only my story, not a suggesttion on what to do.

[hellfish]

Just got off the phone with the docs office, they said the test was for total test, and they did not do LH or FSH. I assume that may be a next step?

Is there anything I do or don't want to say that may influence his decisions on HRT for me? I'm going to be honest with him, tell him my history, I've been working out for a long time, but have never dove heavy into juice, may have 4 mid sized cycles to my credit over a period of 10 years. I do feel that a therapeutic dose of test would benefit me, libido wise, and may even result in some better day to day life stuff. Is there an argument to make for the "give it a shot and see" side of things?

[Old-Dog]

Why should you hide that you trained hard and used some gear.

Stupid crack heads and other low lifes come crawling in doctor offices for help and "GET IT"!

So, be honest with your MD, explain to him the situation. He won't give you anything more than andriol, so your best bet "if your not getting lead to your pencil" would be;

Try 250mg cyp(1ml) injection once a week for the next 4-6 weeks.
Also, do a 2ml shot of Vit B12 and try some trib.

This will not only add some lead to you pencil but will improve your overall mood and well being. If you can afford it, get hold of some GH and run 3iu per day as well. That GH does wonders.

Good luck.

[big_luse]

*Correction* "Old Dogs doctor" wil only prescribe adriol. Many canadian GPs prescribe Cyp and Enth. Just because you family doctor is ignorant to TRT doesnt mean every doctor is. As I said, I was 13 (10-30) and was given Enth. Fortunatley my doctor isnt some pencil neck, and we both came to the conclusion that positives outweighed the negatives for my lifestyle.

[Kilburn]

ya, that's sooooo low. lol. on cycle mine was 65, lol.

[Old-Dog]

Then your Doc is solid. However, I have tried to hustle gear from walk in clinics and docs for years bro, it aint that easy

[hellfish]

Saw the doc today for the follow up, took about 30 seconds, showed me the results on paper, asked about my general overall feeling. I said I fell pretty good except I am kind of tired and do have a lower sex drive at times. He wrote me a script for androgel for 3 months. I asked about prices cause I don't have a drug plan. He said he didn't know but if it was to expensive he would change it to injects if they were cheaper. I went to the pharmacy, it was $160 per pump for the gel, $30 a vial for depotest or delatestryl, so they faxed the doc, he's changing it and I pick it up tomorrow.

[Mr Ontario]

are you planning on having kids?

[hellfish]

No, I'm not. Don't jinx me LOL!

[Mr Ontario]

just checking..it would aid people in helping you with a protocol. Ya,,the andriol capsules are crap..you need like #10 a day for them to work properly..the gel is expensive. Injections are more cost effective for sure.


No, I'm not. Don't jinx me LOL!

[hellfish]

Yeah its a good question and one I considered. But as this is a first step to see if it helps, maybe in 3 months I'm all good and stay good, then the children thing wouldn't be of much concern, however, if this is a longterm thing, and I change my mind about kids, thats a whole different kettle of fish.

[Mr Ontario]

Reason I mentioned it is that as you get older....using artifial test HRT will affect your own sperm count. you need to be artificial test free.

Maybe a good protocol of hcg/clomid/aromasin would better first before using the test to see if that would bump it uo naturally.


Yeah its a good question and one I considered. But as this is a first step to see if it helps, maybe in 3 months I'm all good and stay good, then the children thing wouldn't be of much concern, however, if this is a longterm thing, and I change my mind about kids, thats a whole different kettle of fish.

[Old-Dog]

Mr. O...Would you suggest using a post-cycle therapy program for this fella.

I know a couple IU of HCG and some clomid could help him out.

With some Trib and a some vitamin B and of course if he can afford 2iu of GH per day.

I had the same problem once, it's what I did and it was very helpful.

That gel or gel pills were fricken useless. Sorry Bro.

[hellfish]

I'll discuss that with my doc. But its not like I just came off cycle and am low because of that, I haven't touched anything for a long time, and have noticed a natural decline in energy and sex drive. Does that make sense? Would PCT still be relevant in this case?

And I was also thinking this: since my LH wasn't tested, what if that was the cause? Would it not then be more of a pituitary issue? Hence the test treatment is just filling in the gaps and not necessarily treating the source. I guess what I'm wondering is does test therapy help in getting things going naturally on its own or does it suppress further?

[big_luse]

Just add a pinch of HCG twice a week throughout - that will keep the Leydig + sertoli cells functioning and allow your loads to have swimmers in them.

[Mr Ontario]

Better yet...find a nice young NEW woman...that should get your sex drive up and you energy :) worse comes to shove grab some Viagara :)

[Mr Ontario]

A buddy gave this to me once for such a thing! i'm sure it can be fined tuned as well.

Wk 1: 1500iu of HCG 2x per week (mon, thurs), 25mg of Aromasin per day
Wk 2: 1500iu of HCG 2x per week (mon, thurs), 25mg of Aromasin per day
Wk 3: 1000iu of HCG 2x per week (mon, thurs), 25mg of Aromasin per day
Wk 4: 1000iu of HCG 2x per week (mon, thurs), 25mg of Aromasin per day
Wk 5: 100mg of clomid per day, 25mg of Aromasin per day
Wk 6: 50mg of clomid per day, 25mg of Aromasin per day
Wk 7: 50mg of clomid per day, 25mg of Aromasin per day
Wk 8: 50mg of clomid per day, 25mg of Aromasin per day
Wk 9-10: 25mg of Aromasin per day




Mr. O...Would you suggest using a post-cycle therapy program for this fella.

I know a couple IU of HCG and some clomid could help him out.

With some Trib and a some vitamin B and of course if he can afford 2iu of GH per day.

I had the same problem once, it's what I did and it was very helpful.

That gel or gel pills were fricken useless. Sorry Bro.

[Old-Dog]

Aromasin, is a hard to find product.

Is there something else you could sub that for?

[hellfish]

Well I picked up my script today: