Covering your 'bases'

[Want2lift]

It seems like every list now has not only test base but tren and nandrolone base as well. I would like to hear reviews with lab names on who has used what and how it worked. I see some labs claim it flows thru a slim pin, is this true? Does it clump up? How long pre workout are you pinning this stuff? Are you pinning sub Q or IM? I've seen one that is 75mg tren base and 75mgs test base. Sounds awesome to me. Thinking of adding this in pre workout next time I blast. Advantages over suspension?

[natenator]

It seems like every list now has not only test base but tren and nandrolone base as well. I would like to hear reviews with lab names on who has used what and how it worked. I see some labs claim it flows thru a slim pin, is this true? Does it clump up? How long pre workout are you pinning this stuff? Are you pinning sub Q or IM? I've seen one that is 75mg tren base and 75mgs test base. Sounds awesome to me. Thinking of adding this in pre workout next time I blast. Advantages over suspension?


No lab talk

[Want2lift]

Right, what I meant was no lab specific talk, just general conversation!

[cog]

What list?From one of the guys on TNation that thinks 750 mg of test weekly is HRT?

[scottlove]

What list?From one of the guys on TNation that thinks 750 mg of test weekly is HRT?It isn't?

[cog]

^^^
Yeah right lol.Along with 50 mg ace E3D.

[Want2lift]

I've seen test base, tren base and nandrolone base as well as combinations if them. If you ask me, a little tren base pre workout sounds like a hell of a time.

[cog]

Test suspension pre workout.

[Praetorian]

Test should be the base of any cycle whether you are gaining or leaning down. Nandralones, tren, EQ etc are in addition to test and are not considered a base as they do not provide the same effects. The idea of using a strong androgen pre workout is outdated at best and will never lead to more gain then a standard well planned cycle...that is a newbie idea. The entire idea of exotic stacks and specific drugs taken during this time or that again is newbie talk and irrelevant to superior growth. If you cannot attain significant growth on a test base combined with an anabolic your attention should not be directed towards the cycle it should be directed at what is failing ie your training and diet. Taking gear is like adding high octane racing fuel to a formula 1 car...the problem being if the driver sucks and doesnt have a high level of skill attained from experience and knowledge as well as genetic potential then the fuel is not going to propel the car into the pole position...it will flounder at the back of the pack just like most guys who take gear and then say i could look like Ronnie or Dorian etc if I took 5g of test of week....sorry no you could not!!

P

[tex]

ive never seen esterless tren or deca but i have tried test suspension from several lines and i gotta say that the vet version of the suspension was awesome.....looks like milk and it pins smooth a ****....id pin it daily mixed with some tren a.... 50/50 mix had me growing and aggressive as hell.....

(no lab names for the ug cuz of the rooles but the vet grade was univet)

[Want2lift]

I think you misunderstood Prae, I'm talking about ester less compounds. Tren base, test base, nandrolone base. Of course these could never be used as the 'base' for a cycle, u would have to pin several times a day. But as a pre workout boost, an ester less compound would be great I would think. I don't imagine it would do much for adding mass long term, just make for some great work outs.

[Praetorian]

Ah i thought you meant as a base. Esterless compounds are pretty much useless for BB purposes. This is the main reason why esters are used in the first place. Even pre workout the body will attenuate to the effects and they will not be sustained over time. As well there are better more effective compounds then esterless...is tren ace vs test suspension...ta will out produce suspension hands down because of the androgenic level.

The other issue is if your gains are not where they should be 9 times out of 10 it has nothing to do with gear and everything to do with training and diet. I can take any client give him the most basic cycle and optimize his diet and training and he will out perform all the guys worrying about exotic stacks etc.

P

[cog]

^^^^
True but suspension preworkout for a squat session and you will get two more reps possibly for a 5 rep predicted poundage.Same reason mma guys use it before an untested match.

[Want2lift]

So Cog, you would think that the added strength from the suspension would be of benefit by creating more hypertrophy? ( extra reps, muscle working harder then normal). More hypertrophy=more growth??

But for the most part these compounds are used for a boost rather than actual muscle development.

[Praetorian]

^^^^
True but suspension preworkout for a squat session and you will get two more reps possibly for a 5 rep predicted poundage.Same reason mma guys use it before an untested match.

If that's happening then you really need to question your training. If you look at what Westside guys are using for training ...its very basic stuff ie test and deca. The pre-workout injection idea is antiquated and does not result in any long term increases in muscle or strength. Guys in MMA or boxing or PL for that will use fast acting androgens for a fight or met yes...BUT they fight or compete only a few times per year that is a completely different concept then training day in and day out.

P

[cog]

So Cog, you would think that the added strength from the suspension would be of benefit by creating more hypertrophy? ( extra reps, muscle working harder then normal). More hypertrophy=more growth??

But for the most part these compounds are used for a boost rather than actual muscle development.

Provided you can recover,if you work harder it should accelerate your growth.

[cog]

If that's happening then you really need to question your training. If you look at what Westside guys are using for training ...its very basic stuff ie test and deca. The pre-workout injection idea is antiquated and does not result in any long term increases in muscle or strength. Guys in MMA or boxing or PL for that will use fast acting androgens for a fight or met yes...BUT they fight or compete only a few times per year that is a completely different concept then training day in and day out.

P

What affects my training is working in construction pounding pegs,using a shovel where the machine can't reach,tieing rebar and such.In the winter I am often more rested if I wasn't moving snow most of the night.If I am well rested I get a better workout.Suspension here and there.....not every day,helps if you have a goal in mind,usually a squat goal is what I would use it for.Deca is not for me,my wife can't take the pounding.:)I would use 30-50 mg,some people use a fair bit more.

[Praetorian]

Not saying to use deca, that was just an example. But overall gains in the long term will not be accelerated by suspension use..a simple cycle will provide maximum gains if diet and training are optimized. As I said if it made a huge different the elite guys would be doing it and they arent..because at that level its not about gear its about training...changing gear is a minor minor adjustment...training is a huge adjustment, thus the gains you can see are much larger relatively.

P