The Case for Raw Milk

[#8]

The case for raw milk

Karen Selick, National Post · Dec. 27, 2011 | Last Updated: Dec. 27, 2011 3:09 AM ET

Raw-milk crusader Michael Schmidt finally got to meet with Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty last month after a 37-day hunger strike. But the Premier told him the government had no plans to change the law to legalize raw milk sales, and that it would rely on the best advice of medical experts.

But what is the best advice of medical experts? Perhaps the better question is what is it today - as anyone who closely follows medical news knows, what's considered healthy one week is often feared, or dismissed, the next. Forty years ago, for example, women were told to perform a self-exam every month to check for breast cancer. Last month, experts retracted that advice: Breast self-exams "have no benefit and should not be used."

Dramatic reversals of expert opinion like this are not unusual. Decades ago, approximately 90% of children underwent tonsillectomies; now, only 20% do. Today tonsils are recognized as important organs in children's immune systems. Prior to 1994, experts at the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) forbade health-food marketers Durk Pearson and Sandy Shaw from putting this statement on fish oil supplements: "Consumption of omega-3 fatty acids may reduce the risk of coronary heart disease." Pearson and Shaw challenged the FDA's ruling in court, and after seven years of litigation, the FDA finally capitulated.

During those seven years, a million Americans suffered suddendeath heart attacks, some of which might have been prevented if consumers had been given the information that is now considered established science. Health Canada's website, for instance, now says consuming omega-3 fatty acids may have not only cardiovascular benefits, but also beneficial effects on diabetes, depression, cancer, lupus, asthma and rheumatoid arthritis.

Sometimes the about-face comes much more quickly. The drug Avastin was approved by Health Canada for treating breast cancer in February of 2009, but approval was withdrawn last month, because its side effects include the increased risk of death from heart attacks and strokes.

Politicians may find it convenient to sidestep difficult issues by deferring to "the experts." But nobody on Earth is more expert than the individual at answering the crucial question that arises repeatedly in every person's life: What risks am I willing to accept?

Statisticians can tell us the risk associated with skydiving, smoking cigarettes, travelling by airplane or driving a car. What they cannot tell us is whether any particular individual should prefer to accept or reject the risk of those activities. Each individual must consider, and balance, the variables they deem important: How pleasurable will this be? How frightened will I be? How necessary is this? How much will it cost? What alternatives are there? Only the individual is sufficiently expert in each of those areas to reach the proper conclusion for their specific case. If one person decides to travel by airplane while another decides to travel by car, neither of them is wrong. Their values and preferences simply lead them to accept different risks.

Government experts testified at Michael Schmidt's trial that drinking raw milk can expose people to the risk of sickness or death from various pathogens. The people who wish to drink raw milk, or to feed it to their children, are well aware of these risks - the publicity surrounding Mr. Schmidt's prosecution guaranteed that. But the risk of death is actually quite low: No one has died from drinking raw milk in the United States in the past 11 years, even though sales are legal in 26 states.

On the other hand, a study of 8,334 school-aged children in Germany, Austria and Switzerland was published in the Journal of Allergy and Clinical Immunology in August, 2011. It reported that children who drank raw milk were less likely to have asthma and allergies than those who drank pasteurized.

Asthma kills approximately 500 Canadians annually. It is not irrational for parents to want to minimize the risk of asthma for their children. And many people have observed from personal experience that they, or their children, cannot digest pasteurized milk, but have no trouble digesting raw.

So every individual can weigh the risks and decide what he is willing to accept. Some will choose pasteurized, some will choose raw. Neither group is wrong.

What Premier McGuinty fails to understand is that the real experts will speak for themselves, one by one. If expert opinion is to govern, individuals should be free to implement the advice prescribed by their own unique expertise about their own unique circumstances and risk tolerance.

- Karen Selick is the litigation director for the Canadian Constitution Foundation and is Michael Schmidt's lawyer.

[#8]

Has Dalton McGuinty actually done anything helpful to anyone other than his cabinet friends and government sucking sponges since he has been elected multiple times? How does this piece of shit keep winning elections? It is mind boggling.

[ironwill]

Raw milk is the shiznit, bestt bb food out there....bar none....

[Thorgrim]

This issue really pisses me off.

The government is fine with drugs like acetaminophen being sold over the counter. Even though it is responsible for many deaths every year. But a willing seller of raw milk is breaking the law by selling it to a willing buyer? Even though there are basically no deaths recently caused by raw milk and there are plenty of other foods that are still available on food shelves every year that have killed people recently. Free country my ass.

In Michael Schmidt's case he is getting the shaft. Goes to court and wins and the government appeals? Retries him and finds him guilty, what kind of BS is that?

[natenator]

Has Dalton McGuinty actually done anything helpful to anyone other than his cabinet friends and government sucking sponges since he has been elected multiple times? How does this piece of shit keep winning elections? It is mind boggling.Really getting tired of your double-talk mouthing.

I have no love affair for McGuinty but your lover boy Harper is ****ing this country like you wouldn't believe. The mark of a politician can only be felt once he's out of office but Harper is doing his best to make sure his mark is felt in the present and for 20 years to come.

You come here and spout off about McGuinty and others but Harper being the **** up that he is, you say nothing. Real thinkers of independent thought call a spade a spade.

[#8]

Ya, the country is really in shambles because of Harper's policies. You spout off about Harper like is Hitler in the 21st century, but really all I see is him holding this country together in a time many, many others are falling apart. He runs the country with an MA in economics and has kept our head above water.

What has he done that is so bad for you to get your panties in such a bunch about all the time? Considering who the options are running against him, who do you suggest we elect? Seeing as you are the all knowing political and economics expert, who of the running candidates would be the BEST option?

McGunity tried to initiate Sharia Law in Ontario. That alone is worth him being kicked out of office in my opinion.

[#8]

Seeing as I posted this in the Nutrition section, Id like to bring it back to the milk post. Does anyone in here actually have access to raw milk? Those who live outside Ontario, how easy is it to get?

[natenator]

Ya, the country is really in shambles because of Harper's policies. You spout off about Harper like is Hitler in the 21st century, but really all I see is him holding this country together in a time many, many others are falling apart. He runs the country with an MA in economics and has kept our head above water.

What has he done that is so bad for you to get your panties in such a bunch about all the time? Considering who the options are running against him, who do you suggest we elect? Seeing as you are the all knowing political and economics expert, who of the running candidates would be the BEST option?

McGunity tried to initiate Sharia Law in Ontario. That alone is worth him being kicked out of office in my opinion.

On ipad so typing not easiest but will respond to last part for now.

There were no better alternatives than harper which is why i voted for him and so we could stop this minority gov't bullshit.*

Ahh screw it, i'll type it out spelling be damned.

Harper:

Whopping deficit increases
Increase in public service (read: size of government) since he took office
Lack of transparency (which he rallied against as the opposition)
Senate appointments despite railing for senate reforms - can't beat'em may as well load it in your favour eh?
Bloated cabinet
Pushing personal ideology (proven crime reduction, cost reducing facilities like insite in favour his crime policies)
MP muzzling forcing Defacto Party discipline
Attempting to implement a single securities regulator (thank god the courts denied)
Railed against many things in opposition that he now favours as majority
Wants to end the CHA (http://www.hilltimes.com/news/2011/04/21/opinion-harper-says-he-supports-canada-health-act-but-past-evidence-suggests-otherwise/27848)

The list goes on and on.*

I am not political or economic expert in the least (neither is Harper for chrit sakes, take a look at his employment history - career politician basically. Just necause you study somethimg doesnt make you an expert at it, that takes actually doing - something academics fail to understand) but what i am not is a blind follower. You bitch other politicians for the same things that your beloved harper does. Either you hate it across the board or your a hypocrite - that's my issue.

Of course McGuinty sucks. They all suck. But you want to know why McGuinty keeps getting elected? Because the other choices suck worse. Hudak was an empty shirt (i should know i've consulted for the dipshit). John Torey, I thought was the guy but he had zero platform - just ran on a platform of "i'm not McGuinty" (same strategy as Hudak, btw).

Harper elections are the same thing - there's no one else worth voting for.*

So back to my point: you're a hypocrite :)

[#8]

I never claimed to be an expert at anything, but I do understand that choices must be made and you can never satisfy everyone. I think all things considered he is doing a MUCH better job than anyone else would have in his shoes, especially another ultra corrupt Liberal.

I would have thought an "Im not McGunity" platform, although not much of a platform at all, would have been enough. It was enough for me anyway.

Im hardly a hypocrite. I agree with almost all of the decisions Harper has made since being elected. Nice of you to cut and paste some of his failures though. Good on you.

[natenator]

I never claimed to be an expert at anything, but I do understand that choices must be made and you can never satisfy everyone. I think all things considered he is doing a MUCH better job than anyone else would have in his shoes, especially another ultra corrupt Liberal.

I would have thought an "Im not McGunity" platform, although not much of a platform at all, would have been enough. It was enough for me anyway.

Im hardly a hypocrite. I agree with almost all of the decisions Harper has made since being elected. Nice of you to cut and paste some of his failures though. Good on you.

There only one cut and paste (the link).

I actually keep tabs on what's going on. Of course it was enough of a platform for you since you're a blood sheep bahhh bahhh bahh.

LOL at the curruption comment. All political parties are currupt, even your beloved harper but you don't care about that because Harper is a reformer err conservative. Yeah, no hypocrite there. Bahhhhh bahhhhhh bahhhhh

[Sean Summers]

I do. Give me a shout and I'll get you hooked up.

[massabsamurai]

I do. Give me a shout and I'll get you hooked up. In Toronto? The reason I ask id because I contacted a bunch of farms on eat wild and none of em sell it :/

[#8]

There only one cut and paste (the link).

I actually keep tabs on what's going on. Of course it was enough of a platform for you since you're a blood sheep bahhh bahhh bahh.

LOL at the curruption comment. All political parties are currupt, even your beloved harper but you don't care about that because Harper is a reformer err conservative. Yeah, no hypocrite there. Bahhhhh bahhhhhh bahhhhh

LOL

Youre post sounds rather BAM-tastic. Yeah were all sheep being pushed herd by herd. Youre far smarter and keep up with current events which makes you way ahead of the curve. I still dont understand why you are so angry at life and the world seeing as you seem like a relatively successful guy.

Boohoo, the guy you elected to office is actually still in power and doing the things he said he was gonna do. How terrible of him! You need to lighten up a bit nate the hate. Maybe have a beer or seven and relax.

Back to milk talk please.

SS I emailed you.

[ironwill]

I am looking in BC, van island for raw milk, if anyone knows, pls share........Damn, i love the stuff.....:fwave

[GYMBRAT]

I am looking in BC, van island for raw milk, if anyone knows, pls share........Damn, i love the stuff.....:fwave

gimme a day or so I'll get ya hooked up duder

[Praetorian]

I do. Give me a shout and I'll get you hooked up.

Hey Dan can you send me the info...been looking to try it for awhile.
Thanks,
T

[Sean Summers]

I can help guys out but you'll have to come to London. I'll have to introduce you to my "source" LOL and you can go from there. We only meet on Mondays. Sorry but I don't remember the price but I wasn't crazy. She also sells lots of other goodies....aged cheese (made from real milk)...etc. You'll also have to bring some type of glass jar with a lid - Mason jar, pickle jar...etc. Basically you leave your jar, get some milk in her jars, then the next week you get your jars filled and then repeat...

[natenator]

What i find amusingly funny is that when confronted you throw up smoke bombs to avoid having to debate an issue because you have no leg to stand on. You asked what my issues were and i told you and instead of countering with intelligent thought you spin a web, waved a wand, proofed up some smoke and tried to make like we didnt notice you ran from the discussion. This is your typical m-o though. You can dish it out well but not take it well when challenged.

For the record, this whole discussion was brought on by your second post rhetoric about McGuinty, being pissed at him 'taking care of his friends' while in office just as Harper (and every politician does and will continue to do) yet you don't seem to mind the double standard too much now do you?

I'll end it here as i've made my point and clearly demonstrated how you roll when confronted by intelligent thought on your hypocritical rhetoric. So respond all you want in return cause you'll be talking to a ghost :)





LOL

Youre post sounds rather BAM-tastic. Yeah were all sheep being pushed herd by herd. Youre far smarter and keep up with current events which makes you way ahead of the curve. I still dont understand why you are so angry at life and the world seeing as you seem like a relatively successful guy.

Boohoo, the guy you elected to office is actually still in power and doing the things he said he was gonna do. How terrible of him! You need to lighten up a bit nate the hate. Maybe have a beer or seven and relax.

Back to milk talk please.

SS I emailed you.

[#8]

Ya more hate speech, blah blah blah dude. If you compare spineless McGuinty to Harper youre obviously a lot less intelligent than I thought you were. I have a hard time accepting any member of parliament who merely wishes to pander to new immigrants and consistently sells out native Canadians in the process to continue winning the vote. Youre so in the know it intimidates me. I bow before your glorious presence. I wonder if you have ever even read a book on political theory, globalization, or international relations or if all of your immense political knowledge all comes from news media. I tend to see a bigger picture at work, I dont think you comprehend it. You use a lot of condescension and personal attacks in your messages because you are fairly immature in my opinion. Even if I am a hypocrite, Harper is doing a better job than anyone else, and McGuinty is still a piece of shit. I think my point is proven.

Anyhoo...

Looking forward to trying some of this milk.

[Praetorian]

I can help guys out but you'll have to come to London. I'll have to introduce you to my "source" LOL and you can go from there. We only meet on Mondays. Sorry but I don't remember the price but I wasn't crazy. She also sells lots of other goodies....aged cheese (made from real milk)...etc. You'll also have to bring some type of glass jar with a lid - Mason jar, pickle jar...etc. Basically you leave your jar, get some milk in her jars, then the next week you get your jars filled and then repeat...

Hmm thats a bit too far for me to do on a regular basis...i think I may have a source just north of Toronto...still investigating..thanks Dan!

[tiramisu]

Raw milk from a dairy that i new i could trust would be wonderful. From one that I don't the risk is significant hence the over regulation.

[Sean Summers]

the risk is significant hence the over regulation.

Someone better tell that to all the milk farmers and their children....oh yeah and the Mennonites too. Geesh....

[Talo]

I thought Reid's dairy ( Oshawa ) sold raw, no ? Been a long time since ive been there though.

[Thorgrim]

Raw milk from a dairy that i new i could trust would be wonderful. From one that I don't the risk is significant hence the over regulation.

The over regulation is so that the big dairies can monopolize the market and and the supermarkets can have a staple that people buy every week, bringing people in to buy all the other processed crap that they shouldn't eat. Ever wonder why the milk and eggs are always at the back of the supermarket? So you have to walk through the isles of high margin shelf stable crap. If there wasn't all the regulation then any farmer with a cow and a bucket could be in business and when his customers came for milk and eggs they would probably buy some produce too.

Governments and big business don't want to de-centralize food production they want to centralize it. Control the food control the people.

The health risks of raw milk they spout off about all the time is just the cover story. The proof of this is all the other dangerous ( like the acetaminophen I mention in my first post) and poisonous crap that they have no problem allowing big corporations to produce and sell to the public.

[goatman]

NO SOURCE TALK ON THE FORMS

hahah JK,

what are the benefits to raw milk is this something we want to replace our milk consumption with? I'm guessing it would be high fat like a homo milk?

Any one have a source in MB PM me lol

[TT Eric]

Whole, unprocessed foods is always better. Some believe you could live on it alone as it contains all we need (?). There is trace amounts of naturally occurring hormones and growth factors that is said to have healing properties, making your immune system stronger, lots of fully intact enzymes (around 60 I think) it gives a break to the body by having all enzymes needed to be self digesting without taxing the body. Like grass-fed beef, it has 3-5x more CLA, lactose intolerant people are suppose to be able to digest it easily since the original enzymes are still in and not been processed out, pasteurization is destroying all bacteria and enzyme. Basically raw milk is still alive and kicking. And of course, milk (raw or not) has all the essential amino acids we need.

My grand-dad was a milk man and my father, uncle/ants were drinking raw milk at the source.

Now, if only I could find a place that have RAW milk from grass-fed cow near Ottawa...

Eric

[Praetorian]

Here is some info on raw milk and some links to where to find it as well as organic and grass fed beef, poultry , pork etc
P

http://www.raw-milk-facts.com/index.html

http://www.realmilk.com/where-other.html#can

http://www.eatwild.com/products/canada.html#ON



Not All Raw Milk Is The Same!


How can that be? It all comes from cows, right? Yes, but that's where the similarity ends. The truth is, there are actually two types of raw milk here in America: the one meant to be consumed directly from the cow, and the one that absolutely must be pasteurized first due to the conditions under which it was produced.

The ideal raw milk is taken straight from animals fed only fresh, organic, green grass, rapidly cooled to somewhere around 36-38 degrees F., and bottled. That's it. No processing, just filtration, and cooling. Most milk produced today undergoes some form of processing before it reaches the consumer.

Diet is a major factor in the quality of raw milk. Studies have shown that over-feeding starchy grains can affect the acidity of the cow's stomach environment and change fat and nutrient levels (1,2).

Raw milk from cows fed a large component of grain is just not as optimal a food as grass-fed and lacks many of milk's self-protective properties. Milk like this, potentially more easily contaminated, should be tested regularly, as should all raw milk, for that matter.

Many non-grass foods (such as soy and alfalfa) contain compounds that mimic the actions of the female hormone, estrogen (3). While these can cause cows to produce more milk than they normally would (and thus increase profit per animal), some studies have called into question possible impacts on animal health and nutrient content of the milk.

Cows are ruminants, with a complex digestive system designed to break down cellulose, a type of structural sugar indigestible to humans, and other substances found in the cell walls of grasses and other green plants they're likely to encounter while grazing.

Prior to the advent of organized agriculture about 10,000 years ago, there simply weren't fields of grain growing wild, upon which animals could munch. As mentioned above, a heavy starch load of grain can alter the usual conditions in a cow's rumen (stomach) and affect the composition of its milk.

Milk from grass-fed cows has amazing properties, one of which is the presence of naturally produced antimicrobials in solution (5). Another is the production of a beneficial fatty acid known as CLA, short for Conjugated Linoleic Acid (6,7).

Countless studies have shown that CLA has many potential health benefits. For comparison, grain-fed cows have as little as one fifth the CLA in their milk as grass-fed (8).

Some raw milk can make you very, very ill. Drinking milk destined for the pasteurizer before it's sterilized can be like playing Russian roulette, but with ALL the barrels loaded. Why? Mainly because cleanliness standards are far lower for milk which will eventually be heat treated.

In large operations, there simply isn't enough open pasture land to contain and grass-feed hundreds of animals, so they're often confined in manure-laden pens.

Supercows, bred for hyperactive pituitary glands or injected with stimulant hormones (such as Posilac) produce an elevated quantity (as high as 13 gallons) of milk daily, leading to inflamed teats. This condition, known as mastitis, pumps high numbers of white blood cells, or pus, into the milk (9).

Supercows don't live nearly as long as naturally bred animals- perhaps they're lucky in that respect...

Add the potential of toxic drug residues, antibiotics, larvicides (10), pesticides (11,12), fertilizers and heavy metals (13) and you have quite a witches brew. Many of the outbreaks of food related illnesses blamed on raw milk can be traced to just such product somehow bypassing the pasteurization process.

You can see why humans have no business consuming raw milk produced by the large factory farm complexes that dominate the industry today. It's simply not safe for human consumption before it's processed.

The role of unclean raw milk in human illness is undeniable. Knowing that not all raw milk is the same is the first step in knowing which questions to ask when you seek it out for yourself and your family. In the following clip, Dr. William Campbell Douglass sheds more light on how to inform yourself about raw milk and nutrition.

[goatman]

Here is some info on raw milk and some links to where to find it as well as organic and grass fed beef, poultry , pork etc
P

http://www.raw-milk-facts.com/index.html

http://www.realmilk.com/where-other.html#can

http://www.eatwild.com/products/canada.html#ON



Not All Raw Milk Is The Same!


How can that be? It all comes from cows, right? Yes, but that's where the similarity ends. The truth is, there are actually two types of raw milk here in America: the one meant to be consumed directly from the cow, and the one that absolutely must be pasteurized first due to the conditions under which it was produced.

The ideal raw milk is taken straight from animals fed only fresh, organic, green grass, rapidly cooled to somewhere around 36-38 degrees F., and bottled. That's it. No processing, just filtration, and cooling. Most milk produced today undergoes some form of processing before it reaches the consumer.

Diet is a major factor in the quality of raw milk. Studies have shown that over-feeding starchy grains can affect the acidity of the cow's stomach environment and change fat and nutrient levels (1,2).

Raw milk from cows fed a large component of grain is just not as optimal a food as grass-fed and lacks many of milk's self-protective properties. Milk like this, potentially more easily contaminated, should be tested regularly, as should all raw milk, for that matter.

Many non-grass foods (such as soy and alfalfa) contain compounds that mimic the actions of the female hormone, estrogen (3). While these can cause cows to produce more milk than they normally would (and thus increase profit per animal), some studies have called into question possible impacts on animal health and nutrient content of the milk.

Cows are ruminants, with a complex digestive system designed to break down cellulose, a type of structural sugar indigestible to humans, and other substances found in the cell walls of grasses and other green plants they're likely to encounter while grazing.

Prior to the advent of organized agriculture about 10,000 years ago, there simply weren't fields of grain growing wild, upon which animals could munch. As mentioned above, a heavy starch load of grain can alter the usual conditions in a cow's rumen (stomach) and affect the composition of its milk.

Milk from grass-fed cows has amazing properties, one of which is the presence of naturally produced antimicrobials in solution (5). Another is the production of a beneficial fatty acid known as CLA, short for Conjugated Linoleic Acid (6,7).

Countless studies have shown that CLA has many potential health benefits. For comparison, grain-fed cows have as little as one fifth the CLA in their milk as grass-fed (8).

Some raw milk can make you very, very ill. Drinking milk destined for the pasteurizer before it's sterilized can be like playing Russian roulette, but with ALL the barrels loaded. Why? Mainly because cleanliness standards are far lower for milk which will eventually be heat treated.

In large operations, there simply isn't enough open pasture land to contain and grass-feed hundreds of animals, so they're often confined in manure-laden pens.

Supercows, bred for hyperactive pituitary glands or injected with stimulant hormones (such as Posilac) produce an elevated quantity (as high as 13 gallons) of milk daily, leading to inflamed teats. This condition, known as mastitis, pumps high numbers of white blood cells, or pus, into the milk (9).

Supercows don't live nearly as long as naturally bred animals- perhaps they're lucky in that respect...

Add the potential of toxic drug residues, antibiotics, larvicides (10), pesticides (11,12), fertilizers and heavy metals (13) and you have quite a witches brew. Many of the outbreaks of food related illnesses blamed on raw milk can be traced to just such product somehow bypassing the pasteurization process.

You can see why humans have no business consuming raw milk produced by the large factory farm complexes that dominate the industry today. It's simply not safe for human consumption before it's processed.

The role of unclean raw milk in human illness is undeniable. Knowing that not all raw milk is the same is the first step in knowing which questions to ask when you seek it out for yourself and your family. In the following clip, Dr. William Campbell Douglass sheds more light on how to inform yourself about raw milk and nutrition.


Thanks for clearing that up before some bros go and start sneaking onto farms and milking cows and getting sick.

Do you need a "source" for raw milk to, I heard there were some farmers here in MB where you could buy milk from but they got shut down. Ill have to do some investigative work out here.

I have noticed since moving to the prairies I see lots of livestock and they look free range. Nothing like what you see in the documentaries. Ill have to stop at some farms when the weather warms up and see what they have for sale!