Warrior diet

[Talo]

My next diet is going to be this one. I've* been reading a great book called Iron Addict's Principles of Fat Loss by Wes Silveira. It's not a book about one specific diet type but many. He has done them all and has had 1000's of clients use atleast one or more ( including myself ) When I was with him I did the TCD ( Timed Carb Diet ) with some great sucess. Wes has recently passed , but before doing so thankfully he was able to write his knowledge on dieting down.

The warrior diet is one that has interested me for awhile , but I never really new anyone that could explain it to me . Wes has done it himself and mentions that it is one of the easier diets to follow if your the type of person that doesn't get too*hungry during the day.

Wes did not create this diet , but he did modify it for strength trainers. Ori Hofmekler was the one who first introduced this diet and he also*wrote Maximum Muscle, Minimum Fat.

The idea of this is to eat very lightly throughout the day, and then having a large "feast" at night. This goes directly against modern dogma that eating heavily at night will make you fat ( there is some truth to that if you starve all day then stuff your face at night ) When you have only had a few small snacks throught the day , this "feast" has plenty of* space to fill as it replenishes carb stores and fulfills protein synthesis needs.

What's the key ? First, this diet works in a very counterintuituve way. During the day when you under-eat , you run on sympathetic nervous system mode. You'd think overall energy levels would be poor on such small quantities of food thoughout the day , but eating that way shifts your nervous system into sympathetic mode AKA "fight or flight" and energy levels are high.

Growth hormone output also stays high throughout the day, which helps with fat loss, C-AMP levels and the elevation of other fat burning chemicals. Then at night when you eat heavily you switch to parasympathetic nervous system mode and your body regenerates.

The diet is based on 20 hours of under-eating and four hours of basically all the clean food you want. If you truly do the under-eating phase properly, it's hard to eat enough clean food to do much damage. If you eat a bunch of crap then you will have issues.

Ori does suggest wieght training and aerobics training , but the training he suggests is quite a bit different than what the average bodybuilder or powerlifter does, and protein turnover requirements can cause a hard training athlete to be catabolic during the under eating phase.

Wes's Diet Example :

Meal one , two and three ( under 180 lbs can go with 7g of each* and women can go with 5g of each )

10g of EAA's

10g of BCAA's

10g of glutamine

3g of taurine

15 min later

25g of casein, whey*or egg protein

4g fish oil

1 cup blueberries, blackberries or strawberries ( every other day switch berries to veggies )*

THE FEAST

*

Salad - LOTS

olive oil based salad dressing

Brown rice ( 2 cups )

whey, casein or egg protein ( 25 g )

sweet potato ( 4oz )

flax or olive oil ( 1 tablespoon )

Butter ( 1/2 tablespoon )

Top Sirloin or chicken or fish* ( 8 oz )

Cookies ( 2 )

Total 1661 cals

Three to Four hours later have 50g of protein* and a cup of plain yogurt.

Training days - skip one meal and have EAA's and glutamine before the workout , 30 g of BCAA's during the workout and 50-60 g of Waxy maize , 50g of protein after the workout.

ORI's Version of the diet

*

Meal One

Whey protein

fish oil

blueberries ( 1 cup )

meal two

Plain yogurt - 1 cup

fish oil - 4 g

blueberries - 1 cup

meal three

whey* - 35 g

fish oil - 4g

blueberries - 1 cup

The Feast

*

Salad - LOTS

olive oil based dressing

brown rice - 2 cups

whey protein - 25g

sweet potatoe - 4 oz

butter - 1/2 tablespoon

top sirloin , chicken or fish - 8 oz

Meal before bed

Whey / casein - 50g

As you can see the diets are different. Wes has more of a muscle saving / feeding meals than Ori does , but the feast is the same. Personally I think I will do a hybrid between the two because Wes has a lot of supplements and that could get expensive. Maybe one day Wes then one day Ori or maybe Meal 1 and 3 will be Wes and Meal 2 will be Ori ? Either way , i've got some time to think about it and get everything ready. I thought this would be a perfect diet to do over the holidays and into the New Year because its usually what happens - small snacking with a big meal . Just have to manage the treats and if I want to have a piece of pie or some ice cream after dinner I will . Then main thing will be to control the 3 small "meals" so that my body becomes anabolic and takes in all the good clean food. If I can get myself down to 8-10 % body fat by April that is a good thing .

[JacktheThriller]

I have read a little on the Warrior diet and firstly take a look at pictures of Oli he is a scrawny man. I think this diet will produce a scrawny man out of you. His principles of the diet refer to Roman Warfare where soldiers would go all day without really eating much and then have a big meal at night (if they were lucky) lets remember that the average roman soldier was 5'4 - 5'7 and 150-160 pounds. Certainly this diet can work for a fat dude who has no interest in maintaining muscle mass but for a bodybuilder/powerlifter this diet looks insane. The diet takes advantage of denying yourself all day and then feeding until you feel sick at night and hopefully you dont eat more calories in that one meal than you burned that day. Why try something new that could potentially be very catabolic for you when there are proven diets out there that work for the bodybuilder/powerlifter type.

[Acer]

CALORIES IN, CALORIES OUT

+ RIGHT MACRO + MICRO NUTRIENTS DENSE FOODS

= Getting in Shape.


It doesnt matter that you fast 20 hours or Eat every 3 hours.

All that count is the above.

[natenator]

Sounds like a pretty terrible diet on paper.

I'd rather stick to keto personally,its easier and less complicated.

[Praetorian]

CALORIES IN, CALORIES OUT

+ RIGHT MACRO + MICRO NUTRIENTS DENSE FOODS

= Getting in Shape.


It doesnt matter that you fast 20 hours or Eat every 3 hours.

All that count is the above.


calories in calories out is nonsense...this has been refuted so many times i cant believe people still post this. As for daily fasting...yes you may lose weight but you will drop muscle and overall your body fat wont change much. There are fasting protocols some which John Berardi has been researching however they arent always what they appear. People fast already ...its called sleeping...most fast protocols just extend this period a few hours but they also use supplements such as BCAA's to maintain muscle and they only run this fast once per week...so it is not a daily regiment. People need to realize that the human body hasnt evolved much in the last few thousand years...why...because that is a blip on the evolutionary clock....change requires millions of years. Thus we still thrive on the same diet we had back then and the human body composed of billions of fat cells is a very very efficient fat storing machine. Not only can fat cells expand 100 fold they can also increase in number to sustain long fasts which occurred between hunts. That is how we have survived as a species...survival of the fittest is actually survival of the fattest. However when it comes to changing body composition or athletic performance we need to use a different approach.
P

[Talo]

Ori was an endurance athlete while Wesly was a powerlifter / bodybuilder. Wed does say that this is the one diet that he has the least experience with , but he was on it for 6 months with great success maintaing strength and size.

Personally I've got more reading to do , but the one thing I love doing is sampling diets on myself rather than listening to people when they say it will or will not work. Maybe it will and maybe it won't , but the only way I will know is if I give this a good shot.

What do I have to lose ? Muscle ? , strength ? bah I can get that back in time. And who knows maybe it will work and if it does then great.

I've tried many different diets over the years ( half carb , TCD , keto, paleo, ) but never this one and I think if I was to do it more wesley's way then that will be the best chance of maintaining as much muscle and strength as I can. Also im sure if i was doing this for 6 weeks and found things to go for a shit then I would stop it that way I wouldn't be in to bad of shape.

Just adding the the resume with this one :)

[Praetorian]

Talo check out TNation and search articles by John Berardi...he has a more scientific approach to the fasting diet as he was worked with many athletes using it...it should be more beneficial to you in terms of maintaining muscle and strength.
P

[Talo]

Will do ! I've actually just received his 80 page e-book from a friend that was going to try it out. I just haven't had a chance to open it yet as I spend more time on my phone then the computer.

From what I understand it's a 16/8 based fast. I will give it a read to get the full details though and im sure I will try it one day :)

[JacktheThriller]

CALORIES IN, CALORIES OUT

+ RIGHT MACRO + MICRO NUTRIENTS DENSE FOODS

= Getting in Shape.


It doesnt matter that you fast 20 hours or Eat every 3 hours.

All that count is the above.

Quite authoritative for someone with 7 posts on this board lol

[natenator]

Quite authoritative for someone with 7 posts on this board lol

since when it post count indicative of knowledge? If that was the case, #8 would seem as though he had a PhD :yeah

[jack_krauser]

since when it post count indicative of knowledge? If that was the case, #8 would seem as though he had a PhD :yeah


lmao

[Thorgrim]

I've done the 16/8 fast for 2 months before. My experience was that it got me quite lean and I maintained my muscle mass but I would only use as a cutting diet. Even though I was cutting I was having a hard time eating all my food in 8 hours (2400cal). Don't think I could eat enough to bulk on a intermittent fasting diet. I like the idea of using it once a week to give your body a bit of a rest from all the food and frequent meals and I think an occasional fast could up-regulate insulin sensitivity and protein utilization.

[#8]

since when it post count indicative of knowledge? If that was the case, #8 would seem as though he had a PhD :yeah

I do have a PhD bud....a pretty huge.....*cough*

lol

Coming from you dude thats rich! Your post count is nearly twice mine and youre still a skinny fag!! Just joshing. I post a lot, but I say very little...its part of my charm :)

[Acer]

Im not saying to eat a Big meal of 2000 Calories 1 time per day.


But 3 meals spread out evenly with the Right FATS, Right protein and good fibrous carbs(Veggies) (Brocoli) has indole carbinole(Spelling) That lower bad estrogen and help getting leaner. Add some Shakes with Fats and you can build a decent physique with low bodyfat.

Protein:Eggs,whey,Fish,Lean Meat(turkey,chicken)

Fats:egg yolks,EVOO,almonds,almonds butter,Salmon, Omega 3 fish oil.

Carbs:Fibrous veggies and clean starch.

You can get in serious condition with this. with the right Macro for your body type(More fat ,more carbs) for some.


If you give your body Enough GOOD Nutrients(Micro nutrients) and you add Cardio and Bodybuilding workout you can get into good Condition(Low bf) while maintening muscle mass.

Im not a scientist, its just how the body works. Give it Good Foods in the right amount(MACRO) for your body type and add lifting + cardio and your good to go.

Im not a fan of Dairy products( More than 75% alduts are intolerant to Lactose) it create a Reaction sometime where your body will Hold Water and your defenition will diseapear. Whey Isolate is a good substitute.Paleo is good but you must find the right MACRO for your bodytype. Some With Fats higher,Some with Carbs Higher.

with consistency , anyone can achieve their goals.

[JacktheThriller]

So Acer your saying if I eat right, do cardio and train I will get lean? I always thought HFCS and transfats combined with low activity was the key to getting lean lol

[Talo]

Started this ****ing diet today. I'm going to try and give it a good enough shot to say yeah or nay. Either way I will know.

Today meal 1 2 and 3 are done

10g BCAA's
10g EAA
10g Glutamine

15 min later
25g whey / casein mix
4g fish oil

Big Meal coming up at around 5 or 6 pm - Lean hamburger , brown rice , salad , 25g whey and maybe some pasta.

Few times through out the day I felt hunger , but nothing too bad. I think tomorrow or the next day will be worst. Wes does say to have Waxy maize after the workout and I didn't do that because I don't have any.

[Thorgrim]

Started this ****ing diet today.


Try not to sound so enthused. :p



Do you have any idea what the totals come out to?

When I did the diet I was way smaller then I am now and I still lost a good amount of fat at 2400 total cals. I would have 50 grams casein after the main meal before bed instead of more whey. I had some BCAA's throughout the day but no oil or protein otherwise.

[Talo]

Yesterday I took in aprox 2300 cals. Today I will be aming for closer to 3000 cals. Getting in another protein shake and some more fish oils , plus a bigger meal as I was light on the carb side.

I too went with a higher casein count before bed - aprox 40% whey ( iso ) and 60% casein.

[Talo]

What is interesting and totally counter intuitive is I am working out on an very empty stomach and only having eaten 300-600 or so total calories dependent on when I workout. I THOUGHT energy would suck--it's great--very productive workouts and feeling strong. I understand what is happening as this type of diet switches the nervous system to sympathetic mode and all systems are ready to rock as compared to stuffing your face all day and being in para-sympathetic mode.I AM having 10 grams of EAA's as soon as I start, and then 30 grams of BCAA's during the workout, but it is still started and basically run on a very empty stomach. Once finished I have some Glutamine and Green Tea :)

Happy so far. The proof will be if it proves to be catabolic or not in the long run. More work and time needed to tell.

[Thorgrim]

Cool thanks for the update.

[Talo]

Nearing the end of my third week of this I will be making an adjustment from the 20/4 to a 16/8 fast with 2-3 larger meals instead of 1 large meal.

Yesterday was a day of re-feed as I had a decent size breakfast , lunch and dinner with some shakes and candies in there. The major thing that I noticed was after every meal I had to go the washroom. Nothing was staying in :) I'm thinking that since I've gone almost 3 full weeks without eating during the day my digestive system did a reboot and was working much better. Which I don't mind at all !

Today will be my last day of fasting for 20 hours before either making the switch to a 16/8 ( might as well jump into it ) or just going about the day as normal as possible until the New Year.

My weight has not changed - 231 is my morning weight (as of yesterday) 235 today after the all-day feeding. I feel that if I was to do more exercise I would have lost about 5lbs ( at least ) during this test. I only worked out twice a week and that was basically all upper body- Very little cardio and NO squats or deads and I know that those missing ingredients was a major cause in not losing weight.

I wasn't so concerned with dropping pounds as I was with looking a bit better - In the end (very short life) my skin is much tighter and cleaner, my sex drive increased, my moods were fine (first few days were a bit rough) energy and strength did not drop much either , but I think it would if I stayed on this much longer.

I don't think I will do this again unless I can get ALL aspects done perfectly. There was a weekend where I only fasted for 16 hours instead of 20 and ate more than I should have.

Maybe I should go 4 weeks min and max of 8 with this , but it’s not going to happen.

[ketovixen]

I'm doing the warrior diet right now, keto style. :)