View Full Version : Chael Sonnen Juices
vakker
19-09-2010, 12:56 PM
http://www.sherdog.com/news/news/CSAC-Sonnen-Positive-for-PEDs-at-UFC-117-26978
and he still didn't win!
MMASTAR
19-09-2010, 01:13 PM
over 85% of UFC fighters juice. Whats wrong with using some deca to help with the joints? or some HGH to heal up an ijury faster? or some test to help stay sane while trying to diet and train the hardest you ever have at the same time? see nothing wrong with gear in sports, if they over do it they end up a negative, but moderate dosages can help keep a body healthy, which is important when your body is your money maker. There is far more gear in profesional aports than any of us thinks.
dang no wonder it seemed he had alot of gas in every round!
vakker
19-09-2010, 03:51 PM
over 85% of UFC fighters juice. Whats wrong with using some deca to help with the joints? or some HGH to heal up an ijury faster? or some test to help stay sane while trying to diet and train the hardest you ever have at the same time? see nothing wrong with gear in sports, if they over do it they end up a negative, but moderate dosages can help keep a body healthy, which is important when your body is your money maker. There is far more gear in profesional aports than any of us thinks.
retard post of the year.
you think all the fighters use deca, highly detectable and detectable up to 18 months?
who gives a **** if you think its right or wrong, its the point that he was caught.
rob66679
19-09-2010, 07:52 PM
over 85% of UFC fighters juice. Whats wrong with using some deca to help with the joints? or some HGH to heal up an ijury faster? or some test to help stay sane while trying to diet and train the hardest you ever have at the same time? see nothing wrong with gear in sports, if they over do it they end up a negative, but moderate dosages can help keep a body healthy, which is important when your body is your money maker. There is far more gear in profesional aports than any of us thinks.
I agree that most UFC athletes are probably on something, and only the ones stupid enough to use something like Deca ( Like Sonnen ) get caught.
I don't think its OK though, a fighter on AAS is no different than a fighter who loads his gloves. You really think they're juicing to heal an injury faster or using some test just for a mental advantage?
They're ****ing using AAS to get an advantage in the ring or cage WHEN THEY FIGHT. You think Sonnen putting up a fight like that had nothing to do with him being on the juice?
You think you don't have an advantage when you fight a guy who's clean?
All I see here is someone trying to minimize and justify their own use..... I don't have a problem with AAS in bodybuilding or powerlifting, or just for normal guys doing it for kicks in the gym.
I do have a big problem with it in combat sports though....... It defeats the whole warrior mentality and mutual respect that fighters should have for each other.
I wonder if this was the reason he was so confident going into the Silva fight....he must have had some "guru"telling him he could beat the test in some manner.Why would he be using deca?Either that or these small gloves really are having an effect...:)
It was elevated levels of test.
evoke
21-09-2010, 01:14 PM
I agree that most UFC athletes are probably on something, and only the ones stupid enough to use something like Deca ( Like Sonnen ) get caught.
I don't think they have confirmed what Sonnen was using.
"Dodd did not state which banned substance was red-flagged, but with a clean drugs-of-abuse scan it is clear the positive test was for a performance-enhancing substance. " -sherdog
Otherwise, yea, I agree.
This really sucks, cause Silva-Sonnen 2 would be a great fight.
natenator
21-09-2010, 01:41 PM
I don't think AAS helped him in the fight that much.
Silva doesn't become a subpar fighter just because Sonnen used a little gear.
http://www.sherdog.com/news/news/CSAC-Sonnen-Positive-for-PEDs-at-UFC-117-26978
and he still didn't win!
whatever.. he beat the shit out of silva for 5 rounds and made him look like a bitch.
I don't think they have confirmed what Sonnen was using.
"Dodd did not state which banned substance was red-flagged, but with a clean drugs-of-abuse scan it is clear the positive test was for a performance-enhancing substance. " -sherdog
Otherwise, yea, I agree.
This really sucks, cause Silva-Sonnen 2 would be a great fight.
Elevated testosterone levels.
vakker
21-09-2010, 06:50 PM
whatever.. he beat the shit out of silva for 5 rounds and made him look like a bitch.
yeah because getting choked out really makes you a stud. did you see Silva's face? no damage.
you are a bitch for backing a loser after they lost.
rob66679
21-09-2010, 07:34 PM
whatever.. he beat the shit out of silva for 5 rounds and made him look like a bitch.
The drugs made him look like a bitch........ And Silva's not the one that tapped either.
As far as AAS not helping him.....Cmon Nate...... If it even helps MLB guys improve their power numbers by 1/3, whats it gonna do in a sport as physical as MMA? Silva was subpar, or he looked subpar against a guy on some juice?
natenator
22-09-2010, 09:24 AM
The drugs made him look like a bitch........ And Silva's not the one that tapped either.
As far as AAS not helping him.....Cmon Nate...... If it even helps MLB guys improve their power numbers by 1/3, whats it gonna do in a sport as physical as MMA? Silva was subpar, or he looked subpar against a guy on some juice?
Silva was sub par that night. Sonnen had a better game plan than everyone else Silva has ever faced. He was willing to take a shot or 10 to roll with his game plan. It was executed to perfection.
Gear doesn't do that. Unless dropping abombs and strong androgens I just don't see AAS being a huge component in MMA to the point where you make a world class fighter look average at best.
We've all see what a well executed game plan does to opponents and what a poor game plan can do as well.
slick rick
22-09-2010, 10:53 AM
It seems like the majority of guys testing positive are fighters that you wouldn't really suspect are on AAS. Tim Sylvia, Stephan Bonnar, Josh barnett, Sonnen is in excellent shape but by appearance not as ripped as allot of UFC fighter. Shawn Sherk being one of the exceptions.
Big D
22-09-2010, 11:31 AM
I agree with Nate,
I cant see how AAS can make you a better fighter, does it allow you to see all the punches come in slow motion ? lol
i'm on AAS and I can tell you i still suck at fighting. my lil sister can probably kick my ass.
evoke
22-09-2010, 12:03 PM
It seems like the majority of guys testing positive are fighters that you wouldn't really suspect are on AAS. Tim Sylvia, Stephan Bonnar, Josh barnett, Sonnen is in excellent shape but by appearance not as ripped as allot of UFC fighter. Shawn Sherk being one of the exceptions.
Probably because people who got caught are new to gear.
And experienced users know how to time their cycles and mask gear properly.
:)
yeah because getting choked out really makes you a stud. did you see Silva's face? no damage.
you are a bitch for backing a loser after they lost.
The only thing kept your boy silvia in the fight long enough to actually fluke out at the end just barely in the nick of time, was his coconut skull.
The gear allows them to train harder without getting burned out.
natenator
22-09-2010, 01:46 PM
The gear allows them to train harder without getting burned out.
Bullshit.
I use gear and I BUST ASS in the gym and I get burned out when dieting for a show. Energy levels plummet, strength goes down (the closer I get to show time); focus and concentration is virtually nill, etc. I'm not training anywhere near as hard as these guys do for a fight and I still get major burnt out near the end.
Even bulking I get burnt out.
They're burning out regardless of geared up or not.
Big D
22-09-2010, 02:04 PM
No disrespect but some of you mke it sound like being on gear turns you into superman,
O-Train
22-09-2010, 04:49 PM
No disrespect but some of you mke it sound like being on gear turns you into superman,
Obviously your gear is bunk...:moon
Big D
22-09-2010, 05:47 PM
Obviously your gear is bunk...:moon
haha touché
Bullshit.
I use gear and I BUST ASS in the gym and I get burned out when dieting for a show. Energy levels plummet, strength goes down (the closer I get to show time); focus and concentration is virtually nill, etc. I'm not training anywhere near as hard as these guys do for a fight and I still get major burnt out near the end.
Even bulking I get burnt out.
They're burning out regardless of geared up or not.
Nate,it is well known that the body will wear down with too heavy a load or not enough calories,and test levels will drop.Replacing with 250-300 mg weekly insures you stay ok,and apparently these levels won't cause you to flunk the test.I would imagine they can get away with even more short stuff along the way.
No disrespect but some of you mke it sound like being on gear turns you into superman,
Not on 250-300mg weekly.
natenator
23-09-2010, 11:07 AM
Nate,it is well known that the body will wear down with too heavy a load or not enough calories,and test levels will drop.Replacing with 250-300 mg weekly insures you stay ok,and apparently these levels won't cause you to flunk the test.I would imagine they can get away with even more short stuff along the way.
250-300/week WILL have you posting positive it use it continued and sustained over a duration unless of course it's esterless.
You think 250-300mg week of test is enough for a fighter to recouperate from their training? I take 750mg usually along with another compound like EQ or Deca and I still don't recover as well as you make it sound and as I stated I am not pounding my body nearly half of what these guys are with their training and cardio. Am I recovering better than without? Absolutely but not to the level that you seem to make it seem.
250-300/week WILL have you posting positive it use it continued and sustained over a duration unless of course it's esterless.
You think 250-300mg week of test is enough for a fighter to recouperate from their training? I take 750mg usually along with another compound like EQ or Deca and I still don't recover as well as you make it sound and as I stated I am not pounding my body nearly half of what these guys are with their training and cardio. Am I recovering better than without? Absolutely but not to the level that you seem to make it seem.
Yeah,kinda sorta,but they are not usually 50+ pounds over natty and pushing hard for more.
bigtavi8
23-09-2010, 04:58 PM
I no im bumping an old thread but nates comment on burnout and gear was one of the truest things heard on these boards in a while. Whether training for a show, MMA, sports etc gear will def help your recovery to a point. But when ur training truly insane and evertything is firing on all cylinders u will eventually burn out.
Gearing up can cover bad training habits.Training natty for the first couple of years should teach an athlete what they can handle.BJ Penn seems to understand that time off when you need it is important,and the results prove it.Others call him lazy.Anyhoo,Nate,St has mentioned that those amounts can slide by.I would guess that Sonnen mixed esters.
rob66679
24-09-2010, 09:39 PM
Gotta disagree with all the guys saying that juicing doesn't help athletic performance....... in fighting anyways...... that would make MMA the only sport on earth that juicers would not benefit from.
At the very least Sonnen would have elevated levels of red blood cells, which would have increased his endurance and thus his performance. The other half of that is elevated test is the only thing he tested positive for, doesn't mean thats all he was taking.
Does AAS help people avoid punch's? Maybe not, but its the exact same analogy that Mark MacGuire used when he said AAS doesn't help you hit a round ball with a round bat....... maybe not, but when you do hit it it goes a lot further and what would have been a long fly ball becomes a homerun.
The numbers speak for themselves.
Victor Conte did a great post on another board regarding what he was giving Shane Mosely, and speculated what Manny Pachaio is likely taking, and how exactly how a fighter will benefit from AAS.
In his opinion the biggest benefit would be increased endurance.
Sonnens performance was due in part to his non-stop pace.
Gotta disagree with all the guys saying that juicing doesn't help athletic performance....... in fighting anyways...... that would make MMA the only sport on earth that juicers would not benefit from.
At the very least Sonnen would have elevated levels of red blood cells, which would have increased his endurance and thus his performance. The other half of that is elevated test is the only thing he tested positive for, doesn't mean thats all he was taking.
Does AAS help people avoid punch's? Maybe not, but its the exact same analogy that Mark MacGuire used when he said AAS doesn't help you hit a round ball with a round bat....... maybe not, but when you do hit it it goes a lot further and what would have been a long fly ball becomes a homerun.
The numbers speak for themselves.
Victor Conte did a great post on another board regarding what he was giving Shane Mosely, and speculated what Manny Pachaio is likely taking, and how exactly how a fighter will benefit from AAS.
In his opinion the biggest benefit would be increased endurance.
Sonnens performance was due in part to his non-stop pace.
Agree.They wouldn't be using if they didn't feel it helped.Pachaio seems to have more than endurance though.Besides smart feet.
grifter
24-09-2010, 10:50 PM
I agree that most UFC athletes are probably on something, and only the ones stupid enough to use something like Deca ( Like Sonnen ) get caught.
I don't think its OK though, a fighter on AAS is no different than a fighter who loads his gloves. You really think they're juicing to heal an injury faster or using some test just for a mental advantage?
They're ****ing using AAS to get an advantage in the ring or cage WHEN THEY FIGHT. You think Sonnen putting up a fight like that had nothing to do with him being on the juice?
You think you don't have an advantage when you fight a guy who's clean?
All I see here is someone trying to minimize and justify their own use..... I don't have a problem with AAS in bodybuilding or powerlifting, or just for normal guys doing it for kicks in the gym.
I do have a big problem with it in combat sports though....... It defeats the whole warrior mentality and mutual respect that fighters should have for each other.
For what it's worth, ancient fighters/gladiators apparently used different herbs/fruits/and animal parts to have a physical or mental advantages over their opponents. So is that any different really than fighters using AAS today?
Some warriors have better weapons, faster fire power, so do they have an unfair advantage?
Regardless these guys who are ''using" still have to train as hard as "clean" fighters. Also larger muscle may hinder fighters in their flexibility and aerobic level as bigger muscle needs more oxygen to sustain the workload.
There are pros and cons to using in the combat sports, everyone is looking for some kind of edge or advantage. If it works for them...good
rob66679
25-09-2010, 07:37 PM
For what it's worth, ancient fighters/gladiators apparently used different herbs/fruits/and animal parts to have a physical or mental advantages over their opponents. So is that any different really than fighters using AAS today?
Some warriors have better weapons, faster fire power, so do they have an unfair advantage?
Regardless these guys who are ''using" still have to train as hard as "clean" fighters. Also larger muscle may hinder fighters in their flexibility and aerobic level as bigger muscle needs more oxygen to sustain the workload.
There are pros and cons to using in the combat sports, everyone is looking for some kind of edge or advantage. If it works for them...good
I don't know how the IOC decides what compounds are OK and what are not, but I guarantee you that the chemicals that athletes have access to today are a lot stronger than any time in history. It's different because a guy on herbs is not going to be anywhere near the level of a guy on a chemists regiment. And the clean guy is still clean, so the gap is even bigger.
Yeah guys on AAS train just as hard, probably harder..... just like Bodybuilding or Powerlifting... otherwise whats the point... I never said it was an easy way out, I'm saying its an unfair advantage.
If a guys using the right compounds, at the right dosages, and training in the right sport specific way, then larger muscles probably are not going to hinder..... Cmon lol..... actually making the argument that AAS hinders athletes? Pretty much every fighter I've seen test positive didn't gain any weight, and a lot of those didn't even look good..... James Toney and Josh barnett are prime examples.
I understand that people have been looking for an edge since the beginning of time, I just really hate it when guys on AAS portray themselves as natural superhumans when they had help.
We can look at old tapes of Ali or Babe Ruth and we know they were natural, 50 years from now we will never know about a lot of these guys. Their ego's are so ****in big ( Clemens or Bonds ) that they will lie and risk jail before they admit they cheated.
I know its the times we live in, but I still don't like liars or cheaters.... not supposed to be what sports all about.
Sonnen gets the boot for his conviction on money laundering charges.
rob66679
08-01-2011, 10:52 PM
Sonnen gets the boot for his conviction on money laundering charges.
I saw he got a reduced sentence for ratting out everybody else that was involved too.
What a class act he is.
Praetorian
09-01-2011, 10:03 AM
85% of UFC fighters using some sort of performance enhancement is on the low side to be honest. It like the Olympics...its not who is using its who gets caught.
P
rob66679
09-01-2011, 09:55 PM
85% of UFC fighters using some sort of performance enhancement is on the low side to be honest. It like the Olympics...its not who is using its who gets caught.
P
I agree with you completely.
You'd be surprised how many people will vehemently defend Pachaio in the boxing forums though. I really think some people don't want to use their heads sometimes.
I agree with you completely.
You'd be surprised how many people will vehemently defend Pachaio in the boxing forums though. I really think some people don't want to use their heads sometimes.
So what apparently is he doing that the other guys are not?Maybe he just has a really hard head?He does put a lot into his punches.Isn't his footwork considered really good?
mouth
11-01-2011, 01:15 PM
I think I've agreed with everything rob66679 has said. Nice job!
Also, wasn't Chael Sonnen running for the republican party in the states? I'm guessing THAT career is over.
rob66679
11-01-2011, 05:49 PM
So what apparently is he doing that the other guys are not?Maybe he just has a really hard head?He does put a lot into his punches.Isn't his footwork considered really good?
IMHO most fighters are on something, so I guess hes just got better access to better drugs than everybody else lol.
I think the biggest thing about Pachaio is how he's taken his power with him as he's moved up in weight, nobodys ever been similar IMHO.
Most guys move up and try to outquick and outpoint bigger guys, Pachaio is walking through bigger guys beating them down.
Most guys his weight, at his age are in decline. He's gotten dramatically better, punch output has gone way up, faster than ever.
rob66679
11-01-2011, 05:52 PM
I think I've agreed with everything rob66679 has said. Nice job!
Also, wasn't Chael Sonnen running for the republican party in the states? I'm guessing THAT career is over.
Thanks.
I don't get out enough in the winter lol, so I sit around making long ass posts....
Yeah I saw Sonnen was talking about it, what a complete meltdown he had.
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