2010 Canadian National Figure, Fitness & Masters Championships OFFICAL THREAD

[MuSuLPhReAk]

This will be the official thread for the discussion of the show so we won't be jumping everywhere. There is no official person at the show for updates but we'll put up news as we get it. All the CBB mods are in the show this year. Clicking the Nationals Banner will take you directly inside the official thread.

Good luck to everyone.

The results will be organized in another thread for easier reference. Link below. Discuss in this thread and not the other one please.

2010 CBBF Canadian National Figure & Fitness Championship Results (http://www.canadabodybuilding.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14081)

[ms_moneypenny]

good luck everyoen!!! sweeet dreams of carb-ups!

[Mr.Freeze]

good luck to all CBB competitors :flagC

[hommes]

good luck to every participant in this years contest.

[z83]

I can't stop hitting F5 :popc2

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Dryvrgrl and 69Challenger sending you all a big smile :)

[mlynds]

All the best to all competitors. Ali and me would ve loved to be there to watch. She definitely wants to compete again.
Good luck everyone, keep us all posted. This forum was excellent for the bodybuilding nationals updates. To hear that my friend Santana went pro pretty much the same time it happened was amazing!! Great job.
Lynds

[Dryvrgrl]

Hi everyone!!
Ok.. so i shrank myself down to make fitness shrt and there were 9 girls in my class.. and every one of them a national athlete! eeppp
Tall had 4 girls.. should have stretched LOL... would have been 5th at nationals!
Miss Silly who posts on here did an AMAZING routine! she is top 3
Avril was called out on that stage FOREVER!!! Id say shes top 5 in a class of over 20!!
TPay is top 5
I don;t know who else is here! I can't recognise Ange mind you I am not wearing my glasses alot and cant recognise my own kid either... so ANGE!! stop me in the hall!!

I am quite certain im near the bottom! BUT I had some victories!!
-I weighed in at 120 POUNDS!!! Yeah baby!! 7 pounds of muscle in a year and a half!!
-My daugher told me she is proud of me!!:) BIG WIN!!
-I ate a peanutbutter marshmallow cake square
and I am not christened as a National Fitness Athlete!

Proves to me thast the route i want to take is Bodybuilding... watch for me in the next 5 yeas at nationals as a FBB!!

[ms_moneypenny]

Way to go Coco..and everyone else who stepped on that stage today!! looks like I better get my ass in gear if dryvrgrl is switching to bodybuilding!!

[Praetorian]

Well its baffling to say the least. Im usually pretty good at picking where I stand with the call outs but right now I have no idea. 8 guys in the Master heavy class...everyone looking pretty good as well. I had the first callout...then we all went back....they called out 5 guys and went through all the poses. Then they called out myself and two other guys, went through a few poses then back. Then they called everyone to the front some poses and thats it.
IMO I think they will give the win to Chris...just my gut feeling. Myself well I came in my best ever...hardest, leanest...nice shape, decent size so I am happy...place wise no idea....I could be second or I could be sixth...well have to wait and see.
P

[OPA Girl]

Muscle Insider pictures. Got to run. I'm late!!

[OPA Girl]

Here. The women are so beautiful.

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Figure Short
1 - Jennifer Kaye
2 - Lauren Jacobson

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Figure Tall
1 - Emily Zelinka
2 -
3 - Sherry Fisher

[ms_moneypenny]

Fitness short

1- Jody Boam
2- Amanda Woods
3- Dallas Vickell

Fitness Tall

1-
2- Sharla Cowling
3_

Figure Masters
1- Maria Marone
2-
3-

That's all I've got

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Fitness Short
1 - Jodi Boam

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Fitness short

1- Jody Boam
2- Amanda Woods
3- Dallas Vickell

Fitness Tall

1-
2- Sharla Cowling
3_

Figure Masters
1- Maria Marone
2-
3-

That's all I've got

Thanks. Added them in the results thread. If you hear anything else, post up :)

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Intermission now.

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Bikini Overall - Justine Munro (IFBB Pro Card)

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Fitness Overall - Jodi Boam (IFBB Pro Card)

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Best Fitness Routine - Renee Berard
She also took her class which is Fitness Tall

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Women Master Lightweight
1 - Maria Mikola
2 - Sharon Mould
3 - Michelle Kennedy

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Women Grandmaster
1 -
2 - Sandra Mcleod
3 -

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Men Grandmaster
1 -
2 -
3 - Shevon Nelson

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Women Master Heavyweight
1 -
2 - Janeen Lankowsky (also best poser award)
3 -

[guest5]

heavyweight masters
1. Jody wald
2. Janeen Lankowski
3. Dawn Alison

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Maria Morrone wins figure overall and new IFBB Pro

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Men Master Lightweight
1 -
2 -
3 - Pirooz Varasteeh

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Correction above, it was lightweight results

Men Master Heavyweight
1 - Chris White (also best poser award)
2 -
3 -

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Jody Wald new IFBB Pro

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Chris White New IFBB Pro

[Delt King]

Chris White IFBB pro congratz

[shawnjohn]

who won light weight mens masters?

[69challenger]

Well, finally home after a long day...and WHAT A DAY it was!!! I competed in figure masters...there were 21 girls and (based on callouts), I'm guessing I finished 6th or 7th!! It was an honour to stand beside those ladies on the National stage and a day I will not forget! What a friggin' BLAST! Now off to bed:)

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Great pic of the bikini, fitness and figure winners

Justine Munro - Jody Boam - Maria Morrone
22319

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Well, finally home after a long day...and WHAT A DAY it was!!! I competed in figure masters...there were 21 girls and (based on callouts), I'm guessing I finished 6th or 7th!! It was an honour to stand beside those ladies on the National stage and a day I will not forget! What a friggin' BLAST! Now off to bed:)

Congrats 69C. Looking forward to seeing some of your contest pics.

[tiramisu]

I keep hitting the refresh hoping for more pictures but I'm guessing everyone is eating cake and pizza at this point.

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Ya, it'll probably continue a bit more after the After Party and throughout the day tomorrow. It's time for the competitors to party a bit after the long contest prep.

P.S. Heard Dryvrgrl won a one handed pushup contest against a complete stranger (guy) :D

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Ted Trush on the left, Matt Grzeskowiak center, Dan Kennedy on the right.

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Men Master Heavyweight

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Got almost all the women top 3. Men info still lacking :/

Here is the link to the organized results
http://www.canadabodybuilding.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14081

Please remember that these are NOT the official CBBF results. There can be an error in them. Probably not but it can happen ;)

Again if you know of any placings, let us know in THIS thread and I will update the other one to keep things organized.

[Dryvrgrl]

Here. The women are so beautiful.


thanks sweetie!!
Im in the second pic you posted, I have all my ink covered up and am wearing a blue suit... with no glasses on!!! and no pigtails!!

[Andre Gregoire]

Chris White has insane looking arms!

Ted has a great back and Dan great quads from those pics. Good showing guys.

[MuSuLPhReAk]

thanks sweetie!!
Im in the second pic you posted, I have all my ink covered up and am wearing a blue suit... with no glasses on!!! and no pigtails!!

Hopefully we can get some better pics of you. Gotta make you a profile and all soon :)

[Praetorian]

First off Id just like to congratulate Chris White on his win and getting his IFBB Pro card...well done Chris! He looked absolutely phenomenal and nobody was touching him last night.
That being said I am very happy with how I looked and the package I brought to the stage. I was the heaviest guy in the show (as far as I know... the only guy I am not sure about was Dan Kennedy he may have been heavier...he'll have to confirm that) as well I as one of the hardest and most shredded guy in the class. I put a tonne of work and time into this show and the judging inconsistency is just very frustrating. Its tough to go back and regroup not really knowing what the judges are looking for year to year. I know i brought my best last night and I feel I can get even better....So I am taking some time off, going to pamper SC for all her help and then make a plan to bring the best ever package to Cleveland next year at the North Americans. I know its a very tough show and I have my work cut out for me but that will only drive me further.
Id like to thank SC for her complete and utter support, Dave Palumbo for his total faith in me and ultimate prep coaching...by far the best on the planet bar none!! I am going to take some pics this morning just to give you guys an idea where I am condition and size wise...its been a great ride since 96 my very first competition and I am moving on to putting all my efforts into the NA.
I also wanted to say congrats to Tpay (Todd) who looked great and had a stellar third place finish....the guy defied the odds and pulled it off...well done brother.
Bodybuilding has been a passion for me for the last 25 years and I am working with many clients as well as a Pro who is getting ready for the Detroit Pro 202 class. This will be an exciting show and hopefully will lead to bigger and better things in the future for BodyAthletica.
Like Arnold said...I'll be back!
P ;o)

[MuscleRush]

Very well said “Praetorian”! I think the pictures speak for themselves when it comes to your conditioning on stage yesterday. I hate to say this but seeing how people were compared and the results yesterday kind of made me worry about that we put all that work and dedication in prepping for the Nationals and we don’t get judge and get compared fair and square. If the judging committee would somehow provide enough details on what they look for and how they compare the Athletes. I think that would give us some idea about the reasons behind our placing.

[ange_d]

It was great to meet a few of you this weekend!
I had a great time, looks like a placing somewhere between 7-10 for me. I was in the second call out. I could not have been happier with my physique or performance. Steve posted some pic's in my journal.

Congrats to all!

Link to log
http://www.canadabodybuilding.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18579

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Very well said “Praetorian”! I think the pictures speak for themselves when it comes to your conditioning on stage yesterday. I hate to say this but seeing how people were compared and the results yesterday kind of made me worry about that we put all that work and dedication in prepping for the Nationals and we don’t get judge and get compared fair and square. If the judging committee would somehow provide enough details on what they look for and how they compare the Athletes. I think that would give us some an idea the reason behind where we place.

Hey, let me officially welcome you to CBB. Good to have you here.


And Prae, you have to post that back double bi in the hotel room. That pic is insane.

[Praetorian]

Hey, let me officially welcome you to CBB. Good to have you here.


And Prae, you have to post that back double bi in the hotel room. That pic is insane.

This one?
P

[MuSuLPhReAk]

YUP :)

[ironwill]

Ted Trush on the left, Dan Kennedy on the right.Brenny Lees hubby Matt in the centre...Man he has improved a lot over the yrs....
Great job prae and Seansummers....You guys look great...

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Brenny Lees hubby Matt in the centre...Man he has improved a lot over the yrs....
Great job prae and Sean summers....You guys look great...

Damn, you're right. I didn't even recognize him. Fixed it up. Thanks IW.

[Praetorian]

Pics taken this morning.
P

[fitnessbyzara]

Not sure where I placed, but I was called out in the morning top 5 for first call-outs.

I had a great time and will now concentrate on the next show for me which is the IFBB North Americans this weekend in Cleveland...Probably last show of the year.

Everyone looked great! ...and I did get the chance to finally say hello to Avril..will post some photos soon


:)

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Congrats Zara. Looking forward to seeing some pics of you. Nothing much as of yet out there. Check out second vid though :)

Some vids:

Figure Tall Lineup
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=llysfdb6udM

Bikini Short
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egPPc1q-fAQ

Bikini Tall Finals
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4cLBUr-iXC8

Figure Tall Call outs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaKu0PeitU0

Figure Tall Top 3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ShC1DLxdI60

Figure Tall Finals (2 Piece)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQBCTlGwDCk

Figure Overall
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0f-GRXYx_U

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Fitness Tall winners:
Noelannah Neubauer - Rene Berard aka Miss Silly - Sharla Cowling

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Junior Mr. Canada is Patrick Gregoire

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Men Master Middleweight ??
1 - Andrew Dudka
2 -
3 -
4 - Mike Mahaney

Not sure what to call this class. Seen it referred to as the 187 and under but the categories from the cbbf website would classify it as lightweight. Going to leave it off the results thread for now until I can get more info.


# Junior Women’s Bodybuilding (Open Class) must be younger than 21-years on date of event.
# Senior Women’s Bodybuilding

* Up to & incl 55kg (Light Weight Class)
* Over 55kg (Heavy Weight Class)

# Master Women’s over 35-years (Open Class)
# Grand Master Women’s, over 50-years (Open Class) Only provided at the CBBF Canadian Bodybuilding Championships!


# Junior Men’s Bodybuilding (Open Class) must be younger than 21-years on date of event.
# Senior Men’s Bodybuilding

* Up to & incl 65kg (Bantam Weight Class)
* Up to & incl 70kg (Light Weight Class)
* Up to & incl 75kg (Welter Weight Class)
* Up to & incl 80kg (Light Middle Weight Class)
* Up to & incl 85kg (Middle Weight Class)
* Up to & incl 90kg (Light Heavy Weight Class)
* Up to & incl 100kg (Heavy Weight Class)
* Over 100kg (Super Heavy Weight Class)

# Master Men’s Bodybuilding, 40 – 49-years
* Up to & incl 80Kg (Light Weight Class)
* Over 80Kg (Heavy Weight Class)

# Master Men’s Bodybuilding, 50 – 59-years (Open Class)
# Grandmaster Men’s Bodybuilding, 60 & over (Open Class)

[fitnessbyzara]

Here's a link to a youtube video of the Bikini Short ladies...I'm #135

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egPPc1q-fAQ

[Brennylee]

Congrats to all who competed in this show. Everyone is a champion for competiting.

Matt was obviously the lightest of the group at 200lbs (too heavy for the light masters)He was in shape and was conditioned but he was the smallest of the group. We know that he was at his best and gave it his all, so we're happy. As Prad said, pics will tell the rest of the story.

Prad, you looked incredible as did Sean Summers...we wish you both much success in your efforts down the road. Prad, The North Americans is an amazing show. Perhaps we'll see you down there in 2011 :)

[ScorpioChiq]

Very well said “Praetorian”! I think the pictures speak for themselves when it comes to your conditioning on stage yesterday. I hate to say this but seeing how people were compared and the results yesterday kind of made me worry about that we put all that work and dedication in prepping for the Nationals and we don’t get judge and get compared fair and square. If the judging committee would somehow provide enough details on what they look for and how they compare the Athletes. I think that would give us some idea about the reasons behind our placing.


I agree 100%. Not to take away from any athletes, but .... it seemed like there were a number of placings both yesterday and in Saskatoon that appeared unpredictable and inconsistent. The judging should be based on conditioning, symmetry and overall physique from front to back. :fback

[Praetorian]

Congrats to all who competed in this show. Everyone is a champion for competiting.

Matt was obviously the lightest of the group at 200lbs (too heavy for the light masters)He was in shape and was conditioned but he was the smallest of the group. We know that he was at his best and gave it his all, so we're happy. As Prad said, pics will tell the rest of the story.

Prad, you looked incredible as did Sean Summers...we wish you both much success in your efforts down the road. Prad, The North Americans is an amazing show. Perhaps we'll see you down there in 2011 :)

Thanks Brennylee....that's the plan....I am officially retired from competing in Canada...the inconsistent judging, disorganized events, and politics just tells me its time for a change. I will do the NA exclusively from now on.
P

[ScorpioChiq]

Thanks Brennylee....thats the plan....I am officially retired from competing in Canada...the inconsistent judging, disorganized events, and politics just tells me its time for a change. I will do the NA exclusively from now on.
P

I'm SO pumped for this!!

[loutfi]

congrats to Chris White. Fantastic shape, beautiful line !!

[gettinbigger]

congrats to all cbb competitors, chris white certainly looked incredible and damn, did anyone check his ID? he doesn't look anywhere near 40.

thanks for the candid shots praetorian, those mid-section veins are off the hook/wicked/sweet/nasty/dope or whatever the cool kids say these days!

[Praetorian]

congrats to all cbb competitors, chris white certainly looked incredible and damn, did anyone check his ID? he doesn't look anywhere near 40.

thanks for the candid shots praetorian, those mid-section veins are off the hook/wicked/sweet/nasty/dope or whatever the cool kids say these days!

My pleasure....by the way Chris is a super guy....we spoke backstage in the pump up room and I congratulated him prior to going on stage at the night show. He is very humble and a super nice guy and totally deserves the win...he looked incredible and his posing was a thing of beauty. We will be seeing him at the Toronto Pro show next year guys....be prepared!! He will make a great Canadian Pro!!
P

[OPA Girl]

What a great show.

[OPA Girl]

Some more

[OPA Girl]

From a friend

[OPA Girl]

A few more.

[OPA Girl]

And a few more again

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Complete official results are up.

2010 CBBF Canadian National Figure & Fitness Championship Results (http://www.canadabodybuilding.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14081)

[Sean Summers]

I am in full agreement with Prae on his one. His thoughts pretty much sum up some of the things I wanted to say. Total BS all around. Hey I'm not saying I should have won but when fat beats out cuts there is something wrong. So for future reference if you are a Heavyweight you will need to come in round and full - no marks for shredded glutes. There are other pointers I have but will remain silent. Not sure what is up with the head judge - total bitch - if she isn't bitching you out then it's some other short man syndrome character flaw. Retirement will be good.
SS

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Yaay, a good shot of Dryvrgrl :)

22543

[MuSuLPhReAk]

BTW, Miss Silly (member here) kicked some serious butt in the Fitness Tall class. Won the class and got the best routine award. Big congrats to you Miss Silly. She is the middle one in the first pic on this page.

Also a congrats goes out to Maria Mikola who took her class. You looked great Maria. Miss you around here. For those who don't know her, she's the second pic on this page. Red bikini number 83.

Last but not least, a congrats to the new Canadian IFBB Pro's.
Chris White
Jody Wald
Justine Munro
Jodi Boam
Maria Morrone

Hope to see you all do some pro shows in the future.

Prae, SS, 69C, Drvrgrl, Ange_d and the rest that I cannot think of right now, you are all winners in my book. A true inspiration to all of us watching you.

[natenator]

I am in full agreement with Prae on his one. His thoughts pretty much sum up some of the things I wanted to say. Total BS all around. Hey I'm not saying I should have won but when fat beats out cuts there is something wrong. So for future reference if you are a Heavyweight you will need to come in round and full - no marks for shredded glutes. There are other pointers I have but will remain silent. Not sure what is up with the head judge - total bitch - if she isn't bitching you out then it's some other short man syndrome character flaw. Retirement will be good.
SS
LMAO.

Never have I ever heard you diss placing OR a person before. For you (Or Prae) to do that it must have been pretty bad.

[Miss Silly]

thanks musclephreak!! I was surprised about the routine for sure LOL all the routines were so amazing. Some killer gymnastics too (i do not have ANY gymnastic skills whatsoever LOL) so it's nice to see that the judges were interested in something that wasn't all flips and tumbling LOL (still, if i could do that, i would ;-P) because i think many girls are scared to try fitness because they don't have a gymnastics background.

Dryvrgrl---great pic!! omg you are a total riot. So fun to meet you! And i love your physique and routine!!!

[Brennylee]

Miss Silly, I think you should post up your routine for all to see. I loved it!! You definitely deserved it!

[physique]

thanks musclephreak!! I was surprised about the routine for sure LOL all the routines were so amazing. Some killer gymnastics too (i do not have ANY gymnastic skills whatsoever LOL) so it's nice to see that the judges were interested in something that wasn't all flips and tumbling LOL (still, if i could do that, i would ;-P) because i think many girls are scared to try fitness because they don't have a gymnastics background.

Dryvrgrl---great pic!! omg you are a total riot. So fun to meet you! And i love your physique and routine!!!

Congrats sexy. i too would like to see your routine. put it on youtube and put a link on cbb for us.

see ya in a few weeks

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Ya Super Mario!! :D
(half of you reading that will probably have no clue what I'm talking about unless you see a pic)

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Some nice pics.

[Prisoner#22]

I am in full agreement with Prae on his one. His thoughts pretty much sum up some of the things I wanted to say. Total BS all around. Hey I'm not saying I should have won but when fat beats out cuts there is something wrong. So for future reference if you are a Heavyweight you will need to come in round and full - no marks for shredded glutes. There are other pointers I have but will remain silent. Not sure what is up with the head judge - total bitch - if she isn't bitching you out then it's some other short man syndrome character flaw. Retirement will be good.
SS

Conditioning only wins you points if your physique is equal to your fellow competitor here in Canada.

Size is the trump card. If you are noticelble bigger in the right places than your competitor, then it doesn't matter what your conditioning is. Rob Belise found that out in 2006 when Darrin Tomy won the Masters and the procard which nobody felt he deserved in light of his condition he was in.

It is what it is though. This is bodybuilding not dieting.

In the States Symetry and aethetics are also taken more into acount as there is also a symetry round that is judged right! There you will win points if you have a prettier physique than your opponent, even if he is bigger than you. That doesn't happen all too often up here.

Here its all bullshit. No symetry round, and just prejudging compulories are judged. It dilutes the sport. Why even bother having a finals???? Its just stupid, hand the trophies out in the morning and be done with it.

I am in agreement with the others from my experience competing in the states I much prefer it there than here.

[Prisoner#22]

Congratulations to Tod Payette. He placed third and in my opinion, from what I know he has A LOT of room to grow and get bigger this offseason.
He will be one of the favorites going into next years competition for the masters overall and the procard.

[MuSuLPhReAk]

And let's not forget he just came from a bad car wreck. Hats off to you Todd for going through with the show and placing in the top 3.

[MuSuLPhReAk]

A word to competitors that are reading here. If you want to use this site as a self-promoting tool, I encourage and welcome you to do so. I can do some but like to focus my energy on contributing members.

The viewership numbers for CBB are rather large and I'd like to use it to help the bb/fitness community.

Start a log/journal, post pictures, thoughts etc. Whatever you're comfortable with.

[Praetorian]

I am in full agreement with Prae on his one. His thoughts pretty much sum up some of the things I wanted to say. Total BS all around. Hey I'm not saying I should have won but when fat beats out cuts there is something wrong. So for future reference if you are a Heavyweight you will need to come in round and full - no marks for shredded glutes. There are other pointers I have but will remain silent. Not sure what is up with the head judge - total bitch - if she isn't bitching you out then it's some other short man syndrome character flaw. Retirement will be good.
SS

The judging was bad not only in the men's category but the women's as well. In bodybuilding there are specific criteria to follow...and yes I do agree size is the trump card...HOWEVER and you'll notice that's a big however....size is the trump card if its pealed size...not fat size. What is the point...I could have walked on stage at 245lbs and stopped my diet 6 weeks out....no problem there....so do i get rewarded with a a better placing for doing half the work? Chris won because he was big and because he was lean....I have no problem with that...he deserved it. Dan was an easy top five...shape, cuts, size...its called the PACKAGE....that's bodybuilding....no we shouldn't have guys winning just because they are lean or just because they have nice shape...you need to have it all...and you should be judged on ALL criteria.
As bodybuilders we work way too hard to be judged so inconsistently and without regard to the criteria specified.
I will compete again and I will bring a much improved package...bigger, harder, still striated glutes....but it will be at the North Americans.
P

[ange_d]

OK...everyone is going to hate on me for this post but I have had enough of the whining over a difference in one or two placings. I came 7th in my class, according to the scores I easily won the second call out and I could be posting on here about unfair it all is and that how could they know I was 7th when I wasn't even compared to the top 6 - but I won't. The judging is subjective in our sports, we all know that. We all tell others to compete for their own self improvement and satisfaction. Would finishing a place or 2 higher really have made a difference?

I don't want readers of this board to think this was a shitty, poorly judged show. The caliber of all the athletes was suburb. Let's give the organization a bit of a break.

I watched the masters show...the top 3 were bang on for sure.

[ironwill]

Opinions are such, everyone has one, and a good right to post them up.....
Why was the caliber of athletes suburb????
You mean superb??
No need to call an opinion whining....IMO...

[steve_d]

yes, I think she meant superb...I had Prae in 4th. Obviously that shows that the quality of athletes are superb. Prae looked awesome. No one would ever deny that. Just so happened that 3 looked even awesomer.

In my opinion, as I've said before on this board, is that there are 3 parts to the equation for ranking someone. Size, shape/symmetry, and conditioning. No one of those outweigh the other, and none trumps the other. Its simple, if two people are equal in shape and cuts, the bigger one wins. If two people are ties in size and shape, the rippeder one wins. Etc etc. Everyone knows that - nothing new. However, what makes it tough is when 1 has better shape, the other has better symmetry, and both are tied in size. Then who wins? Subjective. Then you have a case where 1 guy is bigger, but is not quite as ripped OR as symmetrical (1/3 yet still wins) - well, obviously if they are simply way bigger bit only a little off in the shape and cuts, then they have a better overall package. Thats how I lost the overall in sudbury. Dude outweighed me by 70 pounds. Sure I was more cut, and better shape, but that doesn't necessarily win a show.

I can't go into complete detail about why I think the judging was at least almost bang on in that class, but in Prae's case, I had him ahead of Leon Eastman which would have landed him in 4th. I don't like Leon's shape, and perhaps shape is something I would put my own bias towarrds when I would try to rank people. Looks as though perhaps size was the big factor in the majority of the judges on that panel.

As prae pointed out, he probably could have stopped dieting at 6 weeks out and placed the same. (Key word probably). But no one wants to take that chance. Come in the way you want to look.

[ange_d]

Opinions are such, everyone has one, and a good right to post them up.....
Why was the caliber of athletes suburb????
You mean superb??
No need to call an opinion whining....IMO...

Ok, maybe whining was a strong word. I take it back. The point of my post was for people reading this thread who weren't at the show to not get the idea that it was a poorly judged show. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and every judge is also entitled to their opinion...that is why they have 7 judges - hopefully the biases balance out to get the winner(s) - which I think they got.

[Praetorian]

Ok, maybe whining was a strong word. I take it back. The point of my post was for people reading this thread who weren't at the show to not get the idea that it was a poorly judged show. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and every judge is also entitled to their opinion...that is why they have 7 judges - hopefully the biases balance out to get the winner(s) - which I think they got.

Bodybuilding is judged on different criteria then figure. When it comes to bodybuilding its about consistency and in this show in both the men's and women's classes there was none...so yes for those who were not at the show the bodybuilding was very poorly judged...as for the fitness and figure it may have been spot on but I cannot comment on it because I did not see the results. This is not only my opinion it comes from many who watched the prejudging including provincial level qualified judges, IFBB Professional Bodybuilders, other competitors, promoters, and vendors.
I am the last guy to complain when it comes to placings....Ive competed for 14 years and haven't even voiced my opinion until now...but I just couldn't sit idly by when things get so far out of hand like this. I know every show someone got robbed blah blah blah...we have all heard it a million times...that's why I tend to leave things be and just work harder and improve. The problem here was that no matter what I would have done nothing would have changed...because they did not follow the criteria necessary where I did. That is the only reason I spoke up...I couldn't care less if i was 4th or 5th who gives a shit...I went to win and get a Pro card...unfortunately there is only one card and Chris was the better bodybuilder that night and I applaud him for it..well done.
P

[ScorpioChiq]

After X number of hours judging figure/fitness/bikini (let's face it, it was a HUGE show), it seemed to me that the judges had a hard time switching to bodybuilding and ended up going for abs and shoulders (and by default, size) more than conditioning. I would be so curious to see what would happen if we brought in a brand new panel of judges. IF the criteria is tight then it would reveal a similar placing. Regardless, you have two choices: give up and throw in the towel or put everything into coming bigger, better, harder and leaner next year. We choose the latter - and it will be at the NA's ;-)

I'm proud of Prae - he looked even 100 times better than his last competition and next year he will look even 100 times better than this year. Not to mention, six months ago he tore his bicep tendon off the bone and had to have surgery, rehabbed it and went on to compete on a national stage. Can't keep this baby down ;-) :hu

[steve_d]

After X number of hours judging figure/fitness/bikini (let's face it, it was a HUGE show), it seemed to me that the judges had a hard time switching to bodybuilding and ended up going for abs and shoulders (and by default, size) more than conditioning. I would be so curious to see what would happen if we brought in a brand new panel of judges. IF the criteria is tight then it would reveal a similar placing. Regardless, you have two choices: give up and throw in the towel or put everything into coming bigger, better, harder and leaner next year. We choose the latter - and it will be at the NA's ;-)

I'm proud of Prae - he looked even 100 times better than his last competition and next year he will look even 100 times better than this year. Not to mention, six months ago he tore his bicep tendon off the bone and had to have surgery, rehabbed it and went on to compete on a national stage. Can't keep this baby down ;-) :hu


GOOD POST. 100% agree about size of shows vs. judging becoming tedious. After 8 hours, writing down numbers can become boring. Although, the sad fact is that if that is true (which it likely is), they should not be judges. Judging is almost as fun as competing, and I think they should take pride in getting things as good as they possibly can. And that is to make sure each person gets the right place (not just the top 2). In my opinion, the judging was not as perfect as local/smaller shows because of 1 reason alone - the size of the show. They didn't have time to get it right. they had to go by initial impressions alone, and if you weren't in the call out, you weren't placing in those top spots even if deserved. This happened in a number of classes I watched. Where the top guy/girl of the 2nd call out was better than the lowest in the first call out. But with the size of the show, this was likely the only way they could do it.

I still have my opinions about judging in general and I really think I could implement a system that would eliminate bias almost completely, and give better results overall (the shows would take only slightly longer which is why they would not ever implement it).

It's easy as a judge to be swayed by where they position the athletes as well as the call outs...there should be no patterns. The judges should not have the slightest clue about what the other judges are thinking. It matters more than you'd think. Especially when things go by so quickly.

Also, good mentality, use it to fuel you for the next time. make it so that it isn't even a question next time.

[CC79]

Just wanted to say congrats to all of you who where at nationals, I had the pleasure of going with 69C and got a chance to meet a few of you and but a face to the name . You all should be proud of yourselves for all the hard work and effort you put into this .
I think you all rocked and did awesome !!

[fitnessbyzara]

I'm gonna chime in for the Bikini Short line-up, since I may be the only Bikini Competitor commenting on this thread.

I have one major disagreement with the Finals show for the Bikini competitors...they only had the top 3 come out instead of the top 5 like they did for every other category in the show. The standard 5 out for the night show, especially for Bikini, where overall presentation scoring is major in the category, should have happened. But it didn't and I don't know why they chose to do this only for Bikini?

I would have loved to come back out with the top 5. I placed 4th and my friends and family who came to watch the finals felt $50 wasn't worth it. I mean, usually if you're in first call outs only, then you pretty much sure that you'll be in the top 5 at night show finals...but apparently not for, and ONLY not for, the Bikini classes?!!?

Congrats to all the New Pros! :) NA's are next this weekend ;)

[tiramisu]

Personally I'm more annoyed that they've lumped masters bodybuilding with fitness,figure, and bikin. I'm sorry if it seems rude but if I'm going to the nationals for bodybuilding I want to hang out with the bodybuilders if I ever get to go either as a spectator or god forbid a competitor.

A judging panel that was focused on bodybuilding rather than fitness/figure/bikini would be an added bonus but that's just crazy talk.

[ScorpioChiq]

A judging panel that was focused on bodybuilding rather than fitness/figure/bikini would be an added bonus but that's just crazy talk.

I agree - two completely separate judging panels, or ideally two separate events. Fitness/figure/bikini is definitely a large enough show for it to run solo.

[Prisoner#22]

From the pics I saw, Leon Eastman didn't deserve to make the top 5. He had visable abdominal fat that you could hold between your thumb and forefinger quite easily. Anybody who comes to a national show that out of shape should not be rewarded in anyway by the judges whatsoever.

[Praetorian]

From the pics I saw, Leon Eastman didn't deserve to make the top 5. He had visable abdominal fat that you could hold between your thumb and forefinger quite easily. Anybody who comes to a national show that out of shape should not be rewarded in anyway by the judges whatsoever.

100% agree...I could have been in the same shape and walked on at 245lbs...now that would have been fun!
Good luck this weekend at the NA brother!
P

[fitnessbyzara]

I agree - two completely separate judging panels, or ideally two separate events. Fitness/figure/bikini is definitely a large enough show for it to run solo.


Totally Agree with you on this!! Also, I wrote this in response to someone on another thread here that I wanted to share regarding my thoughts on Bikini judging in the CBBF/IFBB


Quote:
Originally Posted by steve_d
that is the problem with a subjective sport, it is almost impossible for judges to all come to a consensus of what is best. In figure, fitness, bikini, I don't think there will ever be a set in stone judging criteria. One judge will always favor 1 thing compared to another. Not only that, it is a sport where 1 body type may look better lean, while another may look better softer. Depending on how you hold your fat, how much muscle you carry, etc etc. The girls need to simply come in the way they want to look, not the way they think the judge may favor - because you never know which judge will show up, and you'll never know what will be "favored"...Besides, most will look best leaner. The problem is coming in to dry (ie dehydrted, not carbed up properly). In fitness, figure, and bikini, you can be shredded yet learn to stand properly to not show that extreme muscularity. Some of the pros could hit a bodybuilding pose and blow your minds, yet they stand a certain way and look soft and feminine.

So True and well said. I trained and competed in figure (since 2002-winning 2nd at the Ontario's in 2003 and other regional top 3 placings since) long before I switched and started competing in Bikini at the Ontario Naturals '09 to placing 2nd at National Naturals, Laval 2010...

I agree that the basis on the Bikini Category judging criteria should still stem from a physique standpoint first (much to the same aesthetically/xfactor - athletic, with full sculpted athletic muscle and tight yet softer (not ripped) skin texture. Second would be the facial beauty and overall presentation and confidence on stage. I think that its important to let the Bikini class have good stage time to show their personality on stage. Their Bikini walk/presentation is like their routine, and it usually only takes 45 secs to let each girl do a T-Walk to show off their physique in their own way, just as other athletes get routine time. 45sec is fair in comparison, I believe.

This is how I envision judging should be for Bikini.

[steve_d]

I agree - two completely separate judging panels, or ideally two separate events. Fitness/figure/bikini is definitely a large enough show for it to run solo.

The national panel is basically similar year to year, and basically the same panel judges the bodybuilding nationals as the figure nationals. To qualify to be a national level judge, you have to test at national level. And since figure is so new, the national level judges have basically gotten to be national level judges by testing the bodybuilding shows of the past.

Obviously that is flawed in many ways - but it hurts the figure girls more than the bodybuilders since at least most of the panel are qualified based on proving themselves as good bodybuilding judges. There should be a seperate figure/fitness/bikini vs. bodybuilding panel for sure, at that level at least. But then there would still be the problem at local/procincial shows.

It's too bad - although it is what it is. I am quite sure they will be seperate events next year, but still, the national level judges for figure should strictly be high level figure/bikini/fitness athletes, or at least individuals who really have an eye for it and who follow the sport religiously. Same idea with bodybuilding judges, however I think that is basically true of most judges (ie, they follow bodybuilding religiously)

[steve_d]

[QUOTE=fitnessbyzara;396463]QUOTE]


Saw you on stage, you looked great! Really sux about how they did the night show without giving the top 5 like they did in the other categories! Wow! I wasn't aware they did that - a shame to say the least! Bodybuilding top 5 got to do their routine, figure top 5 were even judged for a round 3. Fitness got their routines done as well...Bikini should have been just the same.

[Brennylee]

The night show was such an organizational mess with the awards, they probably forgot to call all 5 out for Bikini.

Zara, you rocked the morning presentation! You could do seminars for that walk ;)

[BigGuns21]

Steve you've made some good points about the judging for sure. In a total unbiased world you probably would have won overall in Sudbury, but Kip being a super heavy was so imposing on stage he basically commanded attention, but was clearly there for Provincial qualifying only and was not peaked. Your symetry was good and you were the hardest physique in the show (but I was way bigger :P haha). And to be honest your calves were probably the same size as his! Adonus had Kip beat easily if his colour was better and he was a bit dryer, minor mistakes I'm sure he'll have rectified next year!
It's hard to really tell by looking at the pics and not being there, but it was evident that Chris owned the show. Eastman looked way too soft for his position personally, but I am no judge.
Unfortunately there is no such thing as an ubiased judge, this is human nature and it will never alter. I remember specifically in my first show one of the judges saying if you compete here next year and make improvements, we'll see those improvements you've made, they will stand out to us. This is probably a true statement, but totally wrong for a judge to do. This means when guys like Steve and I go to another town, no judge has seen what we've done throughout the off season, but may have their attention drawn to a particluar local competitor that has and cause a skewed view for proper judgement.
There is really only one solution, train your ass off and diet your ass off and make sure the judges can't ingnore what you've brought to the stage and hope its what it takes to win and even though we all want the 1st place don't forget the real victory should be a personal one that you have brought the best physique you possibly could to the stage and are constantly improving yourself.

[tpay]

Ok folks....

All I want to do is say thanks. Prisoner 22 for the vote of confidence, Prae for the kind words, Dryvergrl for just being the most awesome and supportive chick ever (yeah you should totally do bodybuilding),and everyone for their support.

This was a very tough year for me personally in many ways, the car accident being the final straw of sorts!

I was happy to be there and thrilled to place third in such a tough and talented class of athletes!

Congrats to all that took the stage!!!

Tpay

[OPA Girl]

:welldone

[steve_d]

Steve you've made some good points about the judging for sure. In a total unbiased world you probably would have won overall in Sudbury, but Kip being a super heavy was so imposing on stage he basically commanded attention, but was clearly there for Provincial qualifying only and was not peaked. Your symetry was good and you were the hardest physique in the show (but I was way bigger :P haha). And to be honest your calves were probably the same size as his! Adonus had Kip beat easily if his colour was better and he was a bit dryer, minor mistakes I'm sure he'll have rectified next year!
It's hard to really tell by looking at the pics and not being there, but it was evident that Chris owned the show. Eastman looked way too soft for his position personally, but I am no judge.
Unfortunately there is no such thing as an ubiased judge, this is human nature and it will never alter. I remember specifically in my first show one of the judges saying if you compete here next year and make improvements, we'll see those improvements you've made, they will stand out to us. This is probably a true statement, but totally wrong for a judge to do. This means when guys like Steve and I go to another town, no judge has seen what we've done throughout the off season, but may have their attention drawn to a particluar local competitor that has and cause a skewed view for proper judgement.
There is really only one solution, train your ass off and diet your ass off and make sure the judges can't ingnore what you've brought to the stage and hope its what it takes to win and even though we all want the 1st place don't forget the real victory should be a personal one that you have brought the best physique you possibly could to the stage and are constantly improving yourself.


Amen! Make yourself undeniable...Make it so that bias will not be enough to take away that trophy. That's my plan for next year. It will be the first time at nationals for me, no one will have seen me there before, but I want to stand out in the opposite way...as in: "who the hell is THAT guy?"

[steve_d]

Also, the thing about the bias from seeing you another year, is so true. I remember test judging and than judging a show basically months apart. The same people that competed in the 2nd show, you couldn't help but remember them, or notice them, because you recognize them. Its the same reason why friends and family always say "you got ripped off"...because when your brother or wife is on stage, you can't help but look at them twice as long as anyone else. You notice all the qualities they have, etc. Its nothing major, but when things are close, it sure has an effect.

Judges just need to realize this, and have a fresh mind always. This effect is HUGE in figure when you have 2 rounds, 1 piece and 2 piece. (3 rounds for nationals). You end up having the same people in the top call out each round because you remember what they looked like in 2 pieces. For me personally, I tried to have a fresh mind for the 2nd round when I test judged. I ended up having a girl come in 7th in a 1 peice when I had her 2nd in a 1 piece...I remember getting slack for that. But I wrote down in my notes exactly why this happened, and it truly is possible. (or at least it should be, or else get rid of the 1 piece).

So anyway, all this to say that bias can't be avoided - or at least its very hard to. I also feel placing individuals the same way all the time biases the judges towards the winner. Its kinda easy to notice someone when they are standing in the middle. And 90% of the time, a head judge will throw who they think the winner should be in the middle. Seems that will give that same "favoritism" bias. Not sure if this is the process at nationals, but at least its what I noticed at provincial and local shows.

[ange_d]

There is really only one solution, train your ass off and diet your ass off and make sure the judges can't ingnore what you've brought to the stage and hope its what it takes to win and even though we all want the 1st place don't forget the real victory should be a personal one that you have brought the best physique you possibly could to the stage and are constantly improving yourself.

Amen to that!
That's my plan...see you all next year!

[Andre Gregoire]

There is really only one solution, train your ass off and diet your ass off and make sure the judges can't ingnore what you've brought to the stage and hope its what it takes to win and even though we all want the 1st place don't forget the real victory should be a personal one that you have brought the best physique you possibly could to the stage and are constantly improving yourself.

100% agree, if you want to win the only way is to be vastly superior to everyone else in your class so there is no room for bias.


For me as long as I look better than my last showing and I don't place last I am happy.

[natenator]

even though we all want the 1st place don't forget the real victory should be a personal one that you have brought the best physique you possibly could to the stage and are constantly improving yourself.

Interesting that you're finally learning this ;)

Apparently you really can train a monkey...

[InToWin]

I felt the show was run well. I'm not a judge so I won't comment on placings but could only see 1 or 2 placings that would be off. Anyway I wanted to contribute to the posting as I've been reading here awhile.

[InToWin]

How do you post a picture?

[InToWin]

Testing

[InToWin]

Got it.

[Miss Silly]

Wow--beautiful photography by Glen E. Grant!!!!!

[69challenger]

There is really only one solution, train your ass off and diet your ass off and make sure the judges can't ingnore what you've brought to the stage and hope its what it takes to win and even though we all want the 1st place don't forget the real victory should be a personal one that you have brought the best physique you possibly could to the stage and are constantly improving yourself.

yes^^^

My goal going into this show was to MAKE top 15 in master's (always a big class). Standing backstage waiting to see if I was going to even get to compete was CRAZY!
Honestly, I have no complaints with how my catagory was judged...top 3 girls were amazing! I'm thrilled to have placed 7th and was proud with the package I brought to the stage (especially because I did it on my own).
Not sure what is next for me, I believe that to place higher, I would have to add at least 5-10lbs of muscle...those girls are BIG!! I don't know if that is something I want to do...I'm very happy with my physique at this point (on and off season).
All in all, the "National experience" was everything I thought it would be:)

[69challenger]

Me and DG:)

[Dryvrgrl]

LOL.. Great Pic 69!!

for the record.. I did an 80's inspired Jane Fonda kind of aerobics routine... i'm not really tacky into side ponytails and pink and green on a regular daily basis:yeah