Trying to understand effects on tendons/ligaments for next cycles?

[pblade]

I have read previously how some steroids have properties to increase collagen production eg. deca, eq, even hgh. I am just trying to get ideas prepared for a next cycle because I am trying to understand some concept over the effects on my tendons/ligaments from the rapid muscle gains. I first had planned to stack with deca just due to the collagen increasing properties, since I will be bigger and notice more gains next cycle I would be worried about my tendons/ligaments so I want them to be able to withstand my extra mass. However if I considered swapping deca for tren next cycle, how would I prevent any issues for my tendons/ligaments and avoid having them more prone to injury. Would my body generally strengthen my tendons/ligaments gradually when I gain more mass? For example, will my tendons/ligaments already get stronger while I maintain the muscle mass for my next cycle? or how would I go on about prepping my body for next cycles without getting injured due to the increased muscle mass on my tendons/ligaments to prevent them from snapping?

[budthespud]

If you're worried about tendon/ligament strength, I would incorporate resistance exercise that utilizes a stability ball. I don't know exactly what they're called , but most gyms have one of those stability balls that are cut in half and secured to a flat platform. Try doing lunges, 1 legged squats and stiff-legged deadlifts . Of course you'll have to significantly drop your poundages.
As far as chemical assistance, I'd go with EQ. Of course HGH is the preferred choice if money isn't an obstacle. Deca is great to sooth the joints , but the excess water weight can counter any benefit from this. Also, if you run Test with EQ (which you should do) keep the Test dosage fairly low (200-250 mg) . Anything greater starts to have a diminshed return as far as the ligament /tendon building properties that EQ provides. The trade off is that your cycle won't have as much of a kick.
You see........everything has a cost/benefit ratio !! YOU have to decide what it is that YOU want !

[bartoli]

How does EQ work to build tendons?

[chan_ho_nam]

How does EQ work to build tendons?

(originally posted by AnimalMass)

While injecting test increases protein synthesis by roughly 50 times, depending on dose and time, most bodybuilders forget that it will reduce collagen synthesis by more than 50% -- more like 80%, giving you the collagen synthesis rate of a senior citizen. Since collagen makes up tendons, bros are very prone to injury if they continue to lift very heavy, unless they cycle off T and let their collagen synthesis get back to normal. It's like having the skeletal muscle of a gorilla with the tendons of a very old man.

Winstrol increases collagen synthesis. It will give you bigger tendons. However, your body compensates for this by making them more brittle, weaker, and more prone to injury. I can't tell you how many bros work out anaerobically and become injured while on winstrol. Guys who lift in the 1-5 rep range while on winstrol, to baseball players who sprint all out from a stationary position -- winstrol should be the LAST drug they choose. Most of them like winstrol because they don't get the weight gain from it but it is very detrimental to bros who train for any sport anaerobically. Tendons tear easily on it.

Also, the drugs I mention increase collagen synthesis while also increasing collagen cross-linking integrity, making for a much stronger tendon.

Winstrol, on the other hand, will dramatically increase collagen syn, but ironically it decreases collagen cross-linking integrity, thus making a much weaker tendon.

You can plan a cycle of AAS which will increase collagen synthesis and skeletal muscle growth at the same time. The key is the drug(s) you choose.

Deca, Equipoise, Anavar, and Primobolan will ALL increase skeletal muscle while at the same time dramatically increase collagen syn and bone mass and density, leaving you with a substantially reduced chance of becoming injured than if you choose to use AAS like sus, cyp, or enth.

While testosterone will increase bone mass and density, even at supra-physiological levels, the result is weaker tendons due to inhibition of collagen syn.

To plan a cycle where the goal is to increase skeletal muscle mass/strength while at the same time increase joint/tendon/ligament strength, enough to keep up with the dramatic increase in skeletal muscle, you must choose drugs like Eq, Deca, Anavar, or Primo as the base of your cycle. Testosterone and its esters can be added to your cycle to keep levels within a 'normal' physiological range (ie, 100-200 mg/wk) but must not go above this. Since drugs like eq, deca, anavar and primo will reduce endogenous, natural levels of test, these levels may be maintained with exogenous test in the 100-200 mg/wk range. Test at this dose will not inhibit collagen syn, but paradoxically, will help increase it. It is when exogenous testosterone is used > 200 mg/wk that collagen syn is inhibited.

Deca @ 3 mg/kg a week(about 270 mg/wk for a 200 lb male) will increase procollagen III levels by 270% by week 2. Procollagen III is a primary indicator used to determine the rate of collagen syn. As you can see, deca is a very good drug at giving you everything you want -- an increase in collagen syn, an increase in skeletal muscle, and increases in bone mass and density. The one thing it does not give you is wood.

Primobolan, @ 5 mg/kg, will increase collagen synthesis by roughly 180% -- less than deca and equipoise but still substantial.

Equipoise @ 3 mg/kg will increase procollagen III by approximately 340% -- slightly better than deca.

Oxandrolone has over a hundred studies documenting its effectiveness at treating patients needing rapid increases in collagen syn to enhance healing.

These drugs have longer half-lives than most other AAS, so this should be considered when timing your post cycle Clomid use. Here they are:

Deca: 15 days Equipoise: 14 days Primobolan: 10.5 days

Anavar has a half-life of only 8 hours so it should not pose a problem.

GH is probably the most remarkable drug at increasing collagen synthesis. It increases collagen syn in a dose dependant manner -- the more you use, the more you will increase collagen syn. It has also demonstrated this ability in short and long term studies. From what I've read, hGH at 6 iu/day increased the collagen deposition rate by around 250% in damaged collagen structures. This result indicates that the increased biomechanical strength of wounds to collagen structures treated with biosynthetic human growth hormone was produced by an increased deposition of collagen in the collagen structures.

Eq, primo, anavar, and deca are all good -- they increase several biomakers of collagen syn -- ie, type III, II, I, procollagen markers. GH just seems to do so most dramatically.

Use of any of these drugs @ supra-physiological levels with a maintenance dose of test will increase collagen syn while at the same time increase skeletal muscle mass. Skeletal muscle mass gains will not be as dramatic as with large testosterone doses but you have to weigh the risk/reward basis for yourself. Also, these drugs do not satisfy the libido like testosterone, but that is not the point of this thread. It is only to demonstrate that you can increase skeletal muscle and collagen syn at the same time with certain AAS -- the decision is up to you.

[j-dub]

(originally posted by AnimalMass)

While injecting test increases protein synthesis by roughly 50 times, depending on dose and time, most bodybuilders forget that it will reduce collagen synthesis by more than 50% -- more like 80%, giving you the collagen synthesis rate of a senior citizen. Since collagen makes up tendons, bros are very prone to injury if they continue to lift very heavy, unless they cycle off T and let their collagen synthesis get back to normal. It's like having the skeletal muscle of a gorilla with the tendons of a very old man.


good find

[Memo]

So If I understood well a cycle for rehabilitating a injury would be something like:

1-18 250mg/week Test
1-16 350mg/week Deca
4-10 60mg/ED Anavar
4-6ui/ED HGH Before & After cycle

I have a nagging hip from to many Judo throws on my right side, Maybe something like that with Active release and some Physio could fix my hip joint.

[pblade]

That is the same reading I went over that explained the collagen production by those steroids. However something I am trying to understand is, let's say I take deca to help strengthen my tendons/ligaments and my body will be able to withstand the extra muscle mass more efficiently. How about when I discontinue the deca use and get off cycle, do my tendons/ligaments degrade back the state they were in before I started deca because there is no further collagen increasing properties from cycling deca? I want to learn for the future the more cycles I do that may not even include those steroids like test/tren for example has no collagen increasing properties, shall i really worry about easily snapping my tendons/ligaments? Or what can i start incorporating so my body will be able to withstand the more mass I put on my body?