Bulking up

[ddubs]

I am wondering if aanyone can help me with a few staples for a mass building diet? I am Pretty lean at 6'1 and 223 right now. Ive been told I need to bulk up alot before i can think about dieting to compete. So if anyone can through some advice my way it would be greatly appreciated

[MMASTAR]

Raise your calories so your 500-750 over maintanence and go from there, make sure you use clean food sources.

[Jazzy]

With your stats..you can calcule you BMR and after, if you want to put some mass...Eat more calories...i'll put the way that you can calculate your BMR:

BMR = 66 + (13.7 X pounds ins KILOS) + (5 X height in CM) - (6.8 X AGE)

Notes:
1 inch = 2.54 cm.
1 kilograme = 2.2 lbs.


multiply your BMR by one of these 5:

- sedentary, s: BMR X 1.2

- a little active (little exercices/sports 1-3 day/week) : BMR X 1.375

- moderate active (moderate exercice/sports 3-5 day/week) : BMR X 1.55

- very actives (hard exercises/sports 6-7 day/week) : BMR X 1.725

- very,very active (every day, hard exercice/sports & physical work ou 2X train per day) : BMR X 1.9

The BMR give you the numbers of calories you need daily to maintain you weight!


Things that are good for bulking are:

complex carbs, like brown rice, baked potatoes, oats, fruits

red meet, like horse, lean beef,etc

chicken breast,fish,turkey,tuna

fats, like almonds, cashews, olive oil, Oméga-3, and red meet again..because satured fats help to raise the level of testostérone in our body

Green vegetables

cottage cheese

whites eggs and eggs with yolk


there a lot of things!^^...but, that's the general!

[Shortdave]

The advice given in this thread is why so many people think you can only gain 10 lbs a year.



read this.

There was a time at the Old Westside gym where I couldn't gain weight to save my ****ing life.
There was this dude who trained there who could just put on weight like ****ing magic. He'd go from 198 to 308 and then to 275 and back down to 198. And he was never fat. It was amazing.
I finally asked him one day how he did it.

"You mean I never told you the secret to gaining weight? Come outside and I'll fill you in."

Now remember, we're at Westside Barbell. And this guy wants to go outside to talk so no one else can hear. Think about that for a minute. What the hell is he going to tell me? This must be some serious shit if we have to go outside, I thought.
So we get outside and he starts talking.

"For breakfast you need to eat four of those breakfast sandwiches from McDonalds. I don't care which ones you get, but make sure to get four. Order four hash browns, too. Now grab two packs of mayonnaise and put them on the hash browns and then slip them into the sandwiches. Squish that shit down and eat. That's your breakfast."

At this point I'm thinking this guy is nuts. But he's completely serious.

"For lunch you're gonna eat Chinese food. Now I don't want you eating that crappy stuff. You wanna get the stuff with MSG. None of that non-MSG bullshit. I don't care what you eat but you have to sit down and eat for at least 45 minutes straight. You can't let go of the fork. Eat until your eyes swell up and become slits and you start to look like the woman behind the counter."
"For dinner you're gonna order an extra-large pizza with everything on it. Literally everything. If you don't like sardines, don't put 'em on, but anything else that you like you have to load it on there. After you pay the delivery guy, I want you to take the pie to your coffee table, open that ****er up, and grab a bottle of oil. It can be olive oil, canola oil, whatever. Anything but motor oil. And I want you to pour that shit over the pie until half of the bottle is gone. Just soak the shit out of it."
"Now before you lay into it, I want you to sit on your couch and just stare at that ****er. I want you to understand that that pizza right there is keeping you from your goals."

This guy is in a zen-like state when he's talking about this.

"Now you're on the clock," he continues. "After 20 minutes your brain is going to tell you you're full. Don't listen to that shit. You have to try and eat as much of the pizza as you can before that 20-minute mark. Double up pieces if you have to. I'm telling you now, you're going to get three or four pieces in and you're gonna want to quit. You ****ing can't quit. You have to sit on that couch until every piece is done.
And if you can't finish it, don't you ever come back to me and tell me you can't gain weight. 'Cause I'm gonna tell you that you don't give a **** about getting bigger and you don't care how much you lift!"

Did I do it? Hell yeah. Started the next day and did it for two months. Went from 260 pounds to 297 pounds. And I didn't get much fatter. One of the hardest things I've ever done in my life, though.

[White-Tiger]

Was that Lee Priest by any chance? lol

[Ritch]

Was that Lee Priest by any chance? lol

Dave did that diet or something close to it and posted the before and after pics. I felt nauseous just reading how much food, not just food... Junk food he ate. His before and after pics are amazing. Must have been taking DNP, lol, because I consider myself an ecto, and eating like that would turn me into a fat piece of shit. But I think you get the message.

[Shortdave]

sorry, that was Dave Tate.

[White-Tiger]

Anyone got a link to those pics?
I can definately eat like that if I wanted to...huge appetite.
Might not be the healthiest way to get big, but if it's the fastest...I'll give it a try...lol.

[Ritch]

I think Dave made a log with it.

[Sandwiches]

I think Dave has beautiful eyes.

[bigtavi8]

my offseason staples are xlean ground beef by the lb, chicken breast, lots of oats, tuna, steaks, pasta, rice,lentils.

Dont concern yourself to much with all these formulas. Eat huge. Be huge. If you eat 50+grams of protein every 2 hours your body will grow no matter what metabolism you got.

Eat till you are stuffed and then double it.

[ddubs]

Thanks for all the tips I think im gonna try the pizza and chinese diet because ive tried the lean meats and clean carbs and im getting in shape but not massive. Thanks for all the wicked pointers!

[bigtavi8]

I know what your saying about the pizza and chinese but im telling you i used to think the same way. Eat a lot of food no matter what kind and you will get big. Pizza and chinese for example wont make you massive where you want it. Id try medium ground beef 1lb of it 4 times a day for the same price. And about 5 times the protein. Then you will have muscle mass instead of carbs and bloated belly.

[ddubs]

So along with the lean gb what type of carbs would you say i should focus on? Im eating yams and pasta daily should i stick with them and just increase the amount?

[Ritch]

1lbs of ground beef 4 times a day? I don`t know how you do that. That`s alot of protein per meal also. Any recipies you have to eat that much ground beef?

[JonnyO]

Eating like Tate described there is the dumbest thing you could do and go for it I guarantee you will turn into a fat piece of shit. Its bad advice and people reading that will get the wrong idea of how to get big and think all they have to do it eat shit all day. Getting big you need to eat copious amounts of food, but if you want to stay in decent shape, without getting too fat you keep it clean with timed carb cut offs, am cardio, etc. Divulge a bit to get the cals up there once in a while but trying to diet off months of eating McD's all day will take you forever and your gains wont be much more than where you left off.

[Ritch]

^^^ I wouldn`t disagree with that, but Dave pulled it off. I don`t see why he would bullshit about this. But the health aspects of it is what scares me the most.

[C-money]

Eating like Tate described there is the dumbest thing you could do and go for it I guarantee you will turn into a fat piece of shit. Its bad advice and people reading that will get the wrong idea of how to get big and think all they have to do it eat shit all day. Getting big you need to eat copious amounts of food, but if you want to stay in decent shape, without getting too fat you keep it clean with timed carb cut offs, am cardio, etc. Divulge a bit to get the cals up there once in a while but trying to diet off months of eating McD's all day will take you forever and your gains wont be much more than where you left off.

Agree 110 percent JO

[GYMBRAT]

^^^same here, did it both ways and the latter is NOT A GOOD IDEA!! You look big in a sweater and thats it thats all ;)

[Big D]

I did it, ate pretty much everything i can see, alot of fast food and junk.

I had to stop, I gained way to much fat, and i'm paying for it now. :(

[tiramisu]

There is only so much muscle that your body can synthesize. Lyle Mcdonald suggests that ranges from a maximum of .5 pound per week for a first year trainee

20-25 pounds year 1, 10-15 pounds year 2, 5-7 pounds year 3 are reasonable and 2-3 pounds in years 4+. That first year best gains of a natural athlete are not more than about .5 of a pound of muscle / week.

If you could put on .5 pounds of muscle a week and you ate perfectly you would likely put on around a pound of fat to go with this. 1.5 pounds per week of perfectish eating is about 750 calories a day over maintenance best case scenario.

So Iffen you get your protein and efa's then you need less than 750 calories a day surplus at a maximum.

If you are in year 2 or 3 the actual caloric excess drops significantly lower.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What’s My Genetic Muscular Potential? | BodyRecomposition - The Home of Lyle McDonald (http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/whats-my-genetic-muscular-potential.html)

General Philosophies of Muscle Mass Gain | BodyRecomposition - The Home of Lyle McDonald (http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/general-philosophies-of-muscle-mass-gain.html)

Bold claims vs. realistic expectations
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/mus...an-aragon.html


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Now on the other side of the coin I see DC debutantes regularily claiming the ability to add 20 pounds of muscle in 1 year as intermediate/advanced lifters.

If this is true and possible then it requires the 750 calorie excess on a daily basis.

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I have challenges understanding what the reality of adding muscle is. My personal experience has matched Lyle McDondald's statements in the first 2.5 years of training with good training, diet, aas. I gained more fat, 3:1 than I think is necessary to put on the muscle but my off season diet has been focused on making sure I never had too little. I'm pretty sure a 2:1 fat/muscle bulk is achievable with the inclusion of cardio.

I'd love to put on 20 pounds of muscle in year 3 but I think It's more likely that the number is going to be somewhat under 10. If 20 pounds of muscle were possible over a period of 50 weeks, it would likely require me to put on an addition 40 pounds of fat. That would put me around 22% bodyfat @ 260

The math while it is fun probably has nothing at all to do with reality and what is likely to be the true limit of my ability is about 10 pounds of muscle and 20 pounds of fat leaving me at 230 @ about 16%.

[Shortdave]

. If 20 pounds of muscle were possible over a period of 50 weeks, it would likely require me to put on an addition 40 pounds of fat. That would put me around 22% bodyfat @ 260



Would that 22% bf be worth it to you or not?

Obviously my weight gain views are different than most peoples on here because I never want to be under 10% bf as I generally perform better at 12-15%. That having been said, if being 22% would give me enough muscle and strength to bring my raw bench up over 500lbs I would do that in a heartbeat, maybe not a healthy heartbeat, but a heartbeat none-the-less.

[devo09]

lyle mcdonald is the man, with regular hormone levels his recommendations are definitely the way to go

[tiramisu]

Would that 22% bf be worth it to you or not?

Obviously my weight gain views are different than most peoples on here because I never want to be under 10% bf as I generally perform better at 12-15%. That having been said, if being 22% would give me enough muscle and strength to bring my raw bench up over 500lbs I would do that in a heartbeat, maybe not a healthy heartbeat, but a heartbeat none-the-less.

If I could get 20 pounds of muscle in a year, then yes indeedy I'd go to 260 @ 22%. It's not much uglier than I was at christmas this year.

That said what I sadly noticed this year, FOR ME was that my last 5-10 pounds, from about 225->235 were almost entirely fat. I just overflowed in the last month or so. I think that FOR ME that I could have put on less fat and an equal or slightly greater amount of muscle by not pushing the total calorie count quite so high. I managed 10 pounds of muscle with plenty of aas, consistent heavy training, lots of good food and plenty of recovery.

The reason I think I could put on slightly more muscle is that if I can add fat at a 2:1 ratio rather than the 3:1 ratio this year I can reduce the number of weeks that I am dieting with a calorie deficit.

[O-Train]

What I've noticed too (and this applies more to natural lifters). Is that your body just stops responding as well at higher bf%'s. I think that T levels decrease and your body just doesn't handle nutrients as well (specifically glucose). I'm thinking a persons overall sense of health and well-being is a good indication of how their body is functioning. When I'm kinda fat and lacking cardiovascular training (like I am now). I just don't feel like my body works as well.

Similar to what Lyle McDonald said in one of his articles. I found the best gains were when I was bulking up from a low bf%. Made great gains really fast but as I got higher bf% it became a case of diminishing returns.

[tiramisu]

I'm definitely increasing my cardio in offseason this year. Nothing crazy but 30 minutes 4 times a week walking kind of thing.

[C-money]

I'm definitely increasing my cardio in offseason this year. Nothing crazy but 30 minutes 4 times a week walking kind of thing.

thats what i did this offseanson tira.. i still put on good size and was veining out all offseason. two thumbs up from me!

[tiramisu]

What I've noticed too (and this applies more to natural lifters). Is that your body just stops responding as well at higher bf%'s. I think that T levels decrease and your body just doesn't handle nutrients as well (specifically glucose). I'm thinking a persons overall sense of health and well-being is a good indication of how their body is functioning. When I'm kinda fat and lacking cardiovascular training (like I am now). I just don't feel like my body works as well.

Similar to what Lyle McDonald said in one of his articles. I found the best gains were when I was bulking up from a low bf%. Made great gains really fast but as I got higher bf% it became a case of diminishing returns.

Seeing as I was on plenty of exogenous T and noticed the same thing I'm thinking it may have as much or more to do with insulin sensitivity. The system is all interrelated of course but exogenous test didn't save me from overflowing with fat at the end.