Gyno issues, need advice

[Thorgrim]

OK, so here's the deal. I am going into the fourth week of my first cycle test-e 500mg per week. I noticed my nipples starting to get puffy about 10 days ago. 8 or 9 days ago I started to take Nolva 40mg for 3 days then down to 20mg a day since then and adex 0.5 mg a day although now I've bumped it up to 1mg a day.

I'm a little perplexed and worried since I have not seen any improvement. The nips have actually gotten a bit worse in the last 10 days even though I am taking nolva and adex.

I am fairly certain the Nolva is real. The adex I am a bit uncertain but I did drop a lot of water weight since I started taking it. I can't figure out why the gyno is getting worse? I suppose the adex could be real but under-dosed.

I did start taking HCG 250IU 2x a week but I already was starting to get puffy nips before this. Could this dosage of HCG be contributing to the gyno problem? Drop the HCG maybe?

How long does it normally take to see results from nolva and adex? Should I give it a bit more time? I am contemplating ending the cycle but that might make things even worse. I am also thinking of getting letro or something really strong and human grade for sure to deal with this.

Suggestions. I'm not really sure what to do at this point, the last thing I want to get is gyno.

[waderow]

you guys and your HCG.....

HCG aromatizes like crazy. You dont need it anyways

[z83]

^^ what he said

keep HCG between last shot / pct while running an AI

if the nolva is GTG, it will help...give it a few days (nolva saved my ass a few times)

letro is REALLY good too

good luck

[Thorgrim]

Well, I read through HCG profile again and I found this.


(5). It appears that the use of human chorionic gonadotropin in a small number of users has resulted in some men developing gynecomastia that is not related to their estrogen levels or increased levels of prolactin, the most obvious causes of gynecomastia in steroid users. Rather, in a very small minority of users it seems that the increased amount of circulating luteinizing hormone or the human chorionic gonadotropin itself can interact with these receptors in the breast tissue causing a reaction resulting in the development of gynecomastia (5). It is unknown at this time the actual mechanism by which this is accomplished, but it does appear to occur frequently in a small number of men. As well there is no known method to combat this side effect in men who experience it, leaving the only option to treat this effect the cessation of human chorionic gonadotropin administration altogether. Fortunately it appears that when this is done the gynecomastia that has developed begins to dissipate rapidly and becomes unnoticeable within a matter of days or weeks in the majority of cases.

This might explain why the Nolva and Adex seem unaffective. I could be one of those rare people.

I was starting to get puffy nips before the HCG though.

I guess the first step here is to eliminate the HCG and see if that helps. If it doesn't then I guess I will know the problem lies elsewhere.

[jmaker]

My training partner got really puffy/itchy nipples and within just three or four days on Letro it was gone. I've posted in the past what Letro will do to your libido, but if your wrestling with gyno this may be one of your best options.

[GYMBRAT]

you guys and your HCG.....

HCG aromatizes like crazy. You dont need it anyways

x2

[MMASTAR]

WTF... im about to start my first cycle and have HCG on hand.. so many diffrent opinions on this shit..

[PdH]

At 500 mg a week all you need is Nolva when necessary. Why are you taking adex at that level? You do need some estro for proper functioning and growth. Also, a little extra water is a good thing on a bulk. You're turning what should be a very simple cycle into something somewhat complex. KIS

[MMASTAR]

god i love my new avatar...

[PdH]

god i love my new avatar...

I quite like it too. :)

[Ritch]

WTF... im about to start my first cycle and have HCG on hand.. so many diffrent opinions on this shit..

Sure is, confusing as ****...

[GYMBRAT]

god i love my new avatar...

I f'ing love it toooo!

[MMASTAR]

ok so who follows what hcg protocall?? throught cycle, or just between last shot and pct or not at all?? and why?

[PdH]

Between last shot and PCT because it works just fine. I don't think it's necessary to use HCG throughout a cycle unless your using massive dosages for long periods of time. Simply put, for a standard 16 - 20 week cycle, why use what you don't need to.

[MMASTAR]

so your thinking like 250mg e3d kinda thing?

[PdH]

500 - 1000 e3d depending on compounds used. Higher with Deca use.

[cog]

Didn't Gustavo mention somewhere that he uses throughout cycle?

[PdH]

Yes I believe he does.

[pw154]

I've never had gyno before I did my last cycle with HCG in it and I've ran most compounds out there in moderate doses. Now if I take even a small amount of HCG (300iu) the gyno will flare up.

[waderow]

HCG aromatizes badly
you can desensitize leydig cells with prolonged use
its not necessary, as you can just use it during PCT

all SOLID reasons to not use it during cycle....

never really seen a good reason to use it during, besides some guy saying "its best not to shut the nards down bro".... but BUT they are shut down regardless.... waste of money, and have fun with your bitch tits

[dremen]

I had puffy nips big time, but then i started running masteron the puffy nips went away with in a week. Was very happy with just that result:)

[gmoney]

wow. sucks to see you're having gyno issues on just 500mg of test/week. kind of discouraging. hopefully it gets better when you cut the hcg.

[Thorgrim]

At 500 mg a week all you need is Nolva when necessary. Why are you taking adex at that level? You do need some estro for proper functioning and growth. Also, a little extra water is a good thing on a bulk. You're turning what should be a very simple cycle into something somewhat complex. KIS

I was taking the nolva for 6-7 days with no improvement before I upped the dose of adex. I didn't really think the hcg could have been a problem until I reread the profile and noticed that it gives some people gyno without aromatization.

I'm going to stop the hcg and hopefully that is the problem and the gyno subsides. If that is the case I will taper off the adex and just run a bit of nolva for the remainder of the cycle. I don't want to have to run the adex or the nolva if I don't have to but at this point I am more worried about the gyno issue then missing out on a few pounds of muscle.

[Thorgrim]

wow. sucks to see you're having gyno issues on just 500mg of test/week. kind of discouraging. hopefully it gets better when you cut the hcg.

Yeah, it's kind of discouraging. I was up 8 pounds in the first three weeks before I started the adex. Now running it I've dropped a bit of water and lost a pound or two.

I'm just really hoping it is the hcg, will make things a lot easier. In hind sight running hcg during cycle is probably something I should have waited to do until at least my second cycle. It just looked really good on paper and some guys run it throughout their cycles with no problems and say that it helps later on with having a smooth PCT. Plus who actually wants their balls to shrink, even if it is temporary? However it does complicate things a bit because when you start to run into problems with sides it is harder to figure out what the problem actually is.

As a side note I haven't really had any other sides. A bit of extra water retention but nothing crazy and no acne.

[cog]

I take a little extra Aromasin right after(small)HCG applications.

[Thunderstruck]

I just finished my 15 weeks of 500mg/week of test-e, at the 6 week mark I started to get puffy nips as well, and my face started to fill out a bit due to water retention. Anyhow I got myself some UG Letro 2.5mg, 50 pills. I started taking that every day until the end of the cycle. The puffy nips are completely gone, and my face dropped the water. I did notice after a couple weeks of being on the Letro that I lost a few pounds, probably water, but gained it back by the end of the cycle. Also my sex drive definitely has gotten lower since being on Letro, can still perform just not as interested in sex !! I'm sure it'll return to normal as I complete my PCT.

[dremen]

I just finished my 15 weeks of 500mg/week of test-e, at the 6 week mark I started to get puffy nips as well, and my face started to fill out a bit due to water retention. Anyhow I got myself some UG Letro 2.5mg, 50 pills. I started taking that every day until the end of the cycle. The puffy nips are completely gone, and my face dropped the water. I did notice after a couple weeks of being on the Letro that I lost a few pounds, probably water, but gained it back by the end of the cycle. Also my sex drive definitely has gotten lower since being on Letro, can still perform just not as interested in sex !! I'm sure it'll return to normal as I complete my PCT.

Wow bro you were taking the 2.5mgs of letro ED, damn bro i was under the impression 1mg/EOD was more then enough to get rid of puffy nips.

So your nips were puffy and now there small again like before you touched gear?

[Thunderstruck]

Yup, they're back to normal, even if I push on them I get no pain or soreness. Perhaps the 2.5 ED was more than enough, but it sure cleared it up. However, I guess that could explain the big drop in sex drive. I was a lot hornier before taking the Letro that's for sure.