1st Cycle....Opinions Wanted!!!

[DEXTER DANO]

Good day Guys, just to start off, new to the site alot of awesome guys and info in here great to see. Here is the cycle what im gonna start in the new year... looking for opinons as it is my first cycle:
Week(1-10)500mg Test e 2x 250 Shots
Week(1-10)600mg EQ 2 x300 Shots
Week(1-4)25mg Dbol ED(Oral)
Week(6-10)25mg Winny ED(oral)
PCT
Week 12 40mg Nova ED
Week (13-16) 20mg Nova Ed

Is this enought for PCT???


Looking to add some good quality mass 15-20 Pounds. Im curently 6'1 215lbs around 12-14% BF. Usually get 2 workouts in a day 5-6 days a week. 45 minutes of cardio every morning, and 1hr of lifting in the evening.

Thanks for your inut guys.

[Canseco33]

Good day Guys, just to start off, new to the site alot of awesome guys and info in here great to see. Here is the cycle what im gonna start in the new year... looking for opinons as it is my first cycle:
Week(1-10)500mg Test e 2x 250 Shots
Week(1-10)600mg EQ 2 x300 Shots
Week(1-4)25mg Dbol ED(Oral)
Week(6-10)25mg Winny ED(oral)
PCT
Week 12 40mg Nova ED
Week (13-16) 20mg Nova Ed

Is this enought for PCT???


Looking to add some good quality mass 15-20 Pounds. Im curently 6'1 215lbs around 12-14% BF. Usually get 2 workouts in a day 5-6 days a week. 45 minutes of cardio every morning, and 1hr of lifting in the evening.

Thanks for your inut guys.

Just wondering your age too bro?

[DEXTER DANO]

27, been working out on a regular basis for 8-10 years now.....I feel like i peaked...lol

[theboss]

revised...you do know EQ is best run 15 weeks..and test should be run longer ??
save the EQ & winny for another cycle....keep it simple.

Week(1-12)500mg Test e 2x 250 Shots
Week(4-8)25mg Dbol ED(Oral)

PCT
Week 14 40mg Nova ED
Week (13-16) 20mg Nova Ed

post up your diet & workout sched.........i bet you are over training with 2 workouts a day.

[DEXTER DANO]

Monday: Morning-10K Run.......Evening Chest
Tuesday:Morning-Swimming 40 Minutes..........Evening Legs
Wednesday:Hockey(90 Mins)...........Evening Bi/Tri Workout
Thursday:5-10K Run............Evening Back Workout
Friday: No Cardio.........Mid Day; ALL Core/Abs/Lower Back
Saturday: No Cardio..........Evening Shoulders

Eating 5-6 Small Portions a day pretty picky on what i eat. 2500-3000 calories a day, 200-250 grams of protein, 150-200grams Carbs, Low sugar and sodium.

My goal is to drop some BF%, and lay on some quality mass as well.

[PdH]

Bulk or cut. Pick one. Way too much cardio and not nearly enough quality food.The paradoxical lean bulk through the use of gear is a fallacy. You'll be lucky to add 5 pounds on this protocol. :)

[Reaver.]

If this is your first cycle, you want to make the best of it. I say bulk and pack on as much mass as you can. Go big or go home! ;)

Its all about calories in vs. calories out, if your doing 10k runs twice a week and swimming in the week, with hockey and weight lifting, thats alot of calories burned my friend. If you truly want that 15lb - 20lb of mass you need to drop some of that cardio and up your calories, otherwise, eat even more calories to fill in for all that cardio.

[pseclint]

looks like a ton of cardio, careful to not overtrain.... eat a lot

I would run dbol and winny so close to eachother, maybe run the dbol for 6-8 weeks instead and save the winny....

[rob66679]

revised...you do know EQ is best run 15 weeks..and test should be run longer ??
save the EQ & winny for another cycle....keep it simple.

Week(1-12)500mg Test e 2x 250 Shots
Week(4-8)25mg Dbol ED(Oral)

PCT
Week 14 40mg Nova ED
Week (13-16) 20mg Nova Ed

post up your diet & workout sched.........i bet you are over training with 2 workouts a day.

This guy knows his stuff...
But.....
4 different compounds for a first cycle???????
The standard advice is usually Test only....... I almost got flamed for considering Dbol with test the first time....... 4 compounds?
I dunno bro.....

[PdH]

I thought it was standard knowledge that you only use test for your first cycle, for a number of reasons. Some are ok with a bit of dbol as well which should be fine, but 4 compounds is silly. What exactly are you hoping to attain with the eq and winny without a significant base and an understanding of sides?

It seems like there's this prevalent misconception that one can get huge and ripped in the same cycle if they use enough different compounds. Does this really make sense to anyone?

[rob66679]

I thought it was standard knowledge that you only use test for your first cycle, for a number of reasons. Some are ok with a bit of dbol as well which should be fine, but 4 compounds is silly. What exactly are you hoping to attain with the eq and winny without a significant base and an understanding of sides?

It seems like there's this prevalent misconception that one can get huge and ripped in the same cycle if they use enough different compounds. Does this really make sense to anyone?

I agree with you completely.
I did test only and had a great ride, and I got to see the affects of test all by itself. My second time time around will probably be the same.... Test E at 500/week. Compared to natural its a big kick in the ass.
Big time overkill IMHO.... Can't believe people didn't pick up on that its his first cycle.....Stick to test IMHO, if things go ****y you'll know WHICH compound is giving you problems.

[JonnyO]

Good day Guys, just to start off, new to the site alot of awesome guys and info in here great to see. Here is the cycle what im gonna start in the new year... looking for opinons as it is my first cycle:
Week(1-10)500mg Test e 2x 250 Shots
Week(1-10)600mg EQ 2 x300 Shots
Week(1-4)25mg Dbol ED(Oral)
Week(6-10)25mg Winny ED(oral)
PCT
Week 12 40mg Nova ED
Week (13-16) 20mg Nova Ed

Is this enought for PCT???


Looking to add some good quality mass 15-20 Pounds. Im curently 6'1 215lbs around 12-14% BF. Usually get 2 workouts in a day 5-6 days a week. 45 minutes of cardio every morning, and 1hr of lifting in the evening.

Thanks for your inut guys.

I think the cycle looks well thought out and good to go in my opinion. One thing though, is dont worry about numbers...such as the scale to determine your gains. If your gaining strength and look like your adding muscle in the mirror your doing well. Whats the point of gaining scale weight but not noticing much in the mirror, or gaining a bunch of shit weight?

I'd get some HCG for PCT as well.

Your going to have a hard time putting on weight even with AAs with that workout schedule of yours. Your a picky eater and only eating 2500-3000 calories a day??? Thats not even close to enough to maintain with that workout schedule your on right now bro! Your going to have to revise your nutritional approach before starting the cycle.

[JonnyO]

It seems like there's this prevalent misconception that one can get huge and ripped in the same cycle if they use enough different compounds. Does this really make sense to anyone?

Have you tried running test, tren, masteron, anavar, winstrol, Anadrol, T3, Clen and GH together at one time??:p

[PdH]

Have you tried running test, tren, masteron, anavar, winstrol, Anadrol, T3, Clen and GH together at one time??:p

No, seems a little much for a pro let alone a first cycle like that of the op and the majority of those I'm speaking of. :)

[PdH]

I think the cycle looks well thought out and good to go in my opinion.

You really think this is a good first cycle?

[cog]

Don't know about anybody else here but I find running just kills thigh mass.

[JonnyO]

You really think this is a good first cycle?

Yes I do. I'd lower the Eq to 400mg, but the Dbol and Winstrol doses are nice and low. Nothing overkill here. I see what you guys are trying to say, but IMHO make the best out of it when you can. But looking at his diet and training schedule I think it will be of waste all together.

[DEXTER DANO]

Thanks for the Input both good and bad. The training and diet i described was what i was intaking and doing now...i plan on up the caloric intake alot.. Also i think running the dbol first will give the cycle a good jump start and the little break before i start the winny which i think will get rid of some of the water retention and give me some good solid gains.. I only plan on doing 1-2 cardio sessions a week. And i was told to run the eq at equal or a lottle bit more then the test. I figured i was running 500mg of test and 600mg of eq would be perfect. Simple as well seeing the Eq is 300mg per ml.
Thanks Guys
Also what do you guys recommend im gonna do two injections a week on test, on the EQ should i split the injection as well do 1cc twice a week or just do the 2cc once a week??

[rob66679]

Yes I do. I'd lower the Eq to 400mg, but the Dbol and Winstrol doses are nice and low. Nothing overkill here. I see what you guys are trying to say, but IMHO make the best out of it when you can. But looking at his diet and training schedule I think it will be of waste all together.

4 compounds first time around isn't overkill?
The guys eating 3k cals a day and 4 compounds isn't overkill?
Scary.

[Reaver.]

If I were you, just front load test and start the Dbol week 4

[Chaps]

Good day Guys, just to start off, new to the site alot of awesome guys and info in here great to see. Here is the cycle what im gonna start in the new year... looking for opinons as it is my first cycle:
Week(1-10)500mg Test e 2x 250 Shots
Week(1-10)600mg EQ 2 x300 Shots
Week(1-4)25mg Dbol ED(Oral)
Week(6-10)25mg Winny ED(oral)
PCT
Week 12 40mg Nova ED
Week (13-16) 20mg Nova Ed

Is this enought for PCT???


Looking to add some good quality mass 15-20 Pounds. Im curently 6'1 215lbs around 12-14% BF. Usually get 2 workouts in a day 5-6 days a week. 45 minutes of cardio every morning, and 1hr of lifting in the evening.

Thanks for your inut guys.

Too much gear for your first cycle, go with 500mg test for 12 weeks. Look at it this way if you could gain 20lbs on 500mg test with it being your first cycle but instead you go with the above then you have WASTED several growth periods. Think about logical progression after this cycle you could add a little d-bol to the next one, next one maybe a little eq etc. After all your years of training naturally your super primed for growth and you'll BLOW UP on 500mg test easy just EAT EAT EAT.

[Chaps]

Also i'd suggest priming your body by dieting for 2-4 weeks not only will you be leaner but your body will respond much better to the cycle.

[DEXTER DANO]

Too much gear for your first cycle, go with 500mg test for 12 weeks. Look at it this way if you could gain 20lbs on 500mg test with it being your first cycle but instead you go with the above then you have WASTED several growth periods. Think about logical progression after this cycle you could add a little d-bol to the next one, next one maybe a little eq etc. After all your years of training naturally your super primed for growth and you'll BLOW UP on 500mg test easy just EAT EAT EAT.

So your saying ill see the same gains off of just test alone then i would on dbol/eq and test??

[PdH]

I think what he's saying is you'll get similar gains from test alone. There's a host of other factors to consider as well, such as sides. If you start having problems using 4 compounds off the bat how will you identify what's giving you a particular side. For example, maybe you'll get a pile of acne from the dbol but not from the others. Maybe you'll get serious anxiety from the EQ, but how can you identify the culprit? Start with test, which will give you phenomenal gains first cycle, and see how you respond. Then add something in each succeeding cycle to see how you respond to those. IMO using 4 compounds first cycle is folly. This isn't saline solution you're putting in your body.

[Reaver.]

Test + Dbol

Done and done.

If your thinking of using 4 different compounds on your first cycle, you got alot of reading to do.

[CanadianIron]

Based on the fact that this is your first cycle and you arent looking to gain THAT much weight. I'd say go for a Test/Dbol only cycle.

I gained 20lbs in the first 4 weeks of my cycle on the Dbol alone. Im 14 weeks into my cycle and I'm holding at +20lbs. If this is your first cycle, you'll be happy with just test/dbol, the dbol will give you the powerful gains, the test will solidify the gains, I cant imagine you not meeting your goal on these 2 compounds.

[monkey]

Yeah.. as most have said.

Gear:

500 mg test per week is ALL you need.

D-bol.. well if you really want, throw it in after 4-5 weeks ( when the test has kicked in)

WHoever told you to run EQ longer then Test is wrong. Based on my knowledge, it should be the other way around.-

YOU DO NOT NEED EQ AND WINNY FOR YOUR FIRST CYCLE. Trust me, you will get big on Test only...keep it, it won't turn bad.

-----------------------------------

Nutrition:

double your calorie intake and see how your body responds. You can always adjust ( e.g. down if your getting too fat too fast or up if your growing enought)

I personally would even stop cardio ( i hate it anyways) or seriously reduce it.
You are basically burning calories that your body will need to grow.

Your body NEEDS excess calories to build mass.
you burn it through cardio=you have to eat more.

Excess calories will be needed to build, lack of calories to loose weight. Getting lean while putting on mass is generally not possible. It scientifically doesn't work and you WILL waste time, money and balls if you limit your gains by trying to stay lean.

Keep in mind that PCT will result in loss of muscle ( how much depends on you) Therefore pack on as much as you can by eating and eating, so you have a certain buffer.. you can worry about being pretty later.

PCT

There is lots to know about PCT. It is generally overlooked a bit by first time users.

HCG. I would suggest it. It will help to keep your balls alive and should shorten the needed recovery time= less muscle loss due to low test levels


Read up on PCT ( lots to google) . There is much more to PCT then just the drugs. Intensity of training, rest, nutrition are all other factors that play a mojor role in keeping what you have before your HTPA kicks in.

Don't diet in PCT. Keep your calories high enough to maintain muscle. You will loose really fast if you diet during PCT

Plan your cycle. Chances are that you will go through a slump after your cyce ( PCT depression or whatever). Make sure it is planned so you don't hit PCT in a crucial time of your life (e.g. exams, etc).

[gregdoucette]

I used to train for triathlons and bodybuilding and trust me they are not compatable. U cant be running and gaining muscle. Try bike riding I can bike ride and still make gains. Ur basically eating liek ur dieting for a show so how can u expect to gain 15 lbs. If I eat 2500- 3000 cals a day I would get very very lean even without cardio. Ur 27 and u say uve peaked. Well if u stop all this crazzy cardio and stick to lifting weights ull be making some huge gains.

[DEXTER DANO]

Day 13 into my cycle started @ 213 now up to 230.....Gains are amazing up 17lbs im assuming it is alot of water rentention. But strength is thru the roof. Not sure if the test is even kicked in yet not expecting the eq to kick in until the 4-5 week mark. But either way here is my final cycle changed a little but not much. Maybe length.
Test E 500mg week (1-12)
EQ 600mg week (1-12)
Dbol 40mg/ed week (1-5)
Winny 50mg/ed week (7-12)

PCT
Nolva 40/40/20/20/

Have Arimidex and Nolva on hand... Gonna be running a .5mg eod of adex at week 3 to keep water down a bit. But no signs of gyno or anything yet... Knock on Wood...lol

Thanks Guys ill keep u posted

[GYMBRAT]

fairly over done for a first cycle imo

[steve_o]

Way to not listen to any advice that people gave you on this site. What is the point of posting your cycle if you are not going to listen to the people that have tried and tested the chemicals you are using? Not a good way to get advice in the future.

If you have gained 17lbs already I would say you might be eating a bit too much food and by the end of your 12 week cycle you are going to be very heavy. The test has probably not even started to work yet as it takes at least 3 to 4 weeks for it to kick in normally. Good luck with everything.

[Praetorian]

Day 13 into my cycle started @ 213 now up to 230.....Gains are amazing up 17lbs im assuming it is alot of water rentention. But strength is thru the roof. Not sure if the test is even kicked in yet not expecting the eq to kick in until the 4-5 week mark. But either way here is my final cycle changed a little but not much. Maybe length.
Test E 500mg week (1-12)
EQ 600mg week (1-12)
Dbol 40mg/ed week (1-5)
Winny 50mg/ed week (7-12)

PCT
Nolva 40/40/20/20/

Have Arimidex and Nolva on hand... Gonna be running a .5mg eod of adex at week 3 to keep water down a bit. But no signs of gyno or anything yet... Knock on Wood...lol

Thanks Guys ill keep u posted

Just an FYI for the future. The test at 500mg per week was all you really needed. The EQ is too high for that level of test...most would run into libido issues at that ratio. The dbol was unnecessary but would have worked much better if started at week 4-5...you missed the entire synergistic effect. EQ gets into the system in a few weeks....it is actually quite fast and not the 4-5 weeks people have been mislead to believe. The winny is completely unnecessary...it is strickly a cosmetic hardener useful only when very lean....quite limited for muscular growth and not good as it pulls water from the joints...leads to tendon issues offseason. Running two orals back to back like that is also putting unecessary stress on the liver. Nolva for PCT will be very limited...you will need longer to recover with only that. Next time look for aromasin or femara....arimidex will destroy your HDL and puts almost everyones cardiac health in the danger zone...get blood work done after your PCT and check cholesterol.
All in all there are much more effective and safer ways of running a first cycle.
P

[cerati19]

same kind of question here.. i m 26 about 5'9 and i ve been training for about 1-2 years.. its really nearly impossible to put on more weight no matter how much i eat (at about 72 kg) does anyone know a good recommendation for a good 1st cycle??

thanks for your help!

[MuSuLPhReAk]

Best to post up your diet..etc first. You may be off on that part.

[steve_o]

same kind of question here.. i m 26 about 5'9 and i ve been training for about 1-2 years.. its really nearly impossible to put on more weight no matter how much i eat (at about 72 kg) does anyone know a good recommendation for a good 1st cycle??

thanks for your help!

X2 - you need to post your diet in order to see where you are at in terms of macro nutrients. I find it hard to believe that you have maxed out at 72kg or 160lbs at 5'9. You need to be eating a lot of food if you are a hard gainer and train for longer and maybe more intensely. Post up your diet and what training regime you are using and we can go from there.

Most people will tell you to train naturally for a while longer (another couple of years) and then once you have plateaued go from there.

[DEXTER DANO]

Day 32/33...........Getting really really strict on the diet.....cals around 3500-4000, protein 250-300 gm per day, carbs aound 200 per day.....Weight is 234 and its pretty dry, as i have cleaned up my diet alot and taking 1mg of arimidex EOD....i look leaner at 234 then i did when i was 205... gonna stop dbol in 4-5 days to give the old liver a break for 3-4 weeks before switching to 50mg ed of winny. Crazy pumps at the gym, there actually quite painful especially on shoulder and leg workout. Vascularity coming back really good as i was quiet puffy the frist couple weeks.
Side Effects: Sometimes painful lower back pumps, night sweats usually only once or twice a week if at all. weird muscle flutter in my abs every couple days, lasts only seconds thou. Other then that going quiet smoothly.

Ill keep u posted.

[DEXTER DANO]

Current Weight 236lbs........
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p64/NOVIVERT/danny.jpg

[cog]

[QUOTE=DEXTER DANO;341190]Day 13 into my cycle started @ 213 now up to 230.....Gains are amazing up 17lbs im assuming it is alot of water rentention. But strength is thru the roof. Not sure if the test is even kicked in yet not expecting the eq to kick in until the 4-5 week mark. But either way here is my final cycle changed a little but not much. Maybe length.
Test E 500mg week (1-12)
EQ 600mg week (1-12)
Dbol 40mg/ed week (1-5)
Winny 50mg/ed week (7-12)

PCT
Nolva 40/40/20/20/

Have Arimidex and Nolva on hand... Gonna be running a .5mg eod of adex at week 3 to keep water down a bit. But no signs of gyno or anything yet... Knock on Wood...lol

Thanks Guys ill keep u posted

Still doing the same cardio routine?

[DEXTER DANO]

2x30min swims a week and one run 5-10k......gonna be increasing cardio son thou

[DEXTER DANO]

i dont think 2 runs a week is gonna kill that much muscle???