Reading up on Macros

[JacktheThriller]

So carbs fats and protein

2 are escential to sustain life according to some: fats and proteins

but are there some essential aspects to carbohydrates?

Eating a diet of just fat a protein with minimal carbs, puts the body into ketosis or starvation mode. A keto diet is stavation with supplementation. So in the absence of carbs the body thinks its starving. Does this not suggest something essential in the nature of carbohydrates? Can someone help explain this to me? Carbs are not necessary to survive, but are they essential to thrive???

[LondonMuscle]

why would u compare a keto diet to a starvation diet? the two have nothing in common at all... a starvation diet is one that does not contain enough nutrients or enough calories... a keto diet is simply one that is low enough in carbohydrate intake that the body starts manufacturing ketones from fat for energy... so i see no comparison

as for the essential"ness" of carbohydrates, the body can manufacture enough from proteins to maintain health via gluconeogensis... so i agree with the statement that there are only two essential macronutrients that must be consumed... however it should still be noted that even though carbohydrates are not a necessary nutrient much of the nutrition they provide such as those found in fruits and veggies are essential

that being said, i dont believe a keto diet is optimal for size and strength gains... in this respect a non essential nutrient can still be beneficial to performance and health gains... there are however no bodily tasks that require an external source of carbs for functionality

[Ritch]

Good question. I`d say they are necessary to thrive as every one I see doing palumbo is not in that state. Effective for sure, but it has it`s consequences...

[Thorgrim]

I agree carbohydrates are not essential.

I think they are a good source of energy but not much else. Fruits are healthy but there is really no nutrition that you can get from fruits that you can't get from fibrous vegetables, low carb nuts and meats.

One of my biggest discovery's for my own body is that I respond very well to lower carbs. Eating too much just makes me fat and doesn't increase my muscle growth. Even when I bulk now I rely on fats for my excess calories and mainly consume my carbs around my workouts. I'll eat some carbohydrate foods if I really feel like it but I don't go overboard.

I think we've all been trained by schooling and the media to think that eating lots of carbohydrates is healthy and normal but look at how fat everyone is getting. Diabetes and heart disease rates are out of control. You could remove the entire grains group from the food pyramid and you would still have plenty of energy and nutrients to train hard and grow. One of the biggest scams of the century if you ask me. Definitely worked out good for big Agra and the pharmaceutical industry though.

[MMASTAR]

carbs really only started to be eaten in higher vloumes 10000 yrs ago when agriculture started.. before that it was all fats and protein.. is there carbs in breast milk? are babys always in ketosis?? would be interesting to know..

[ta-kid]

I agree carbohydrates are not essential.

I think they are a good source of energy but not much else. Fruits are healthy but there is really no nutrition that you can get from fruits that you can't get from fibrous vegetables, low carb nuts and meats.

One of my biggest discovery's for my own body is that I respond very well to lower carbs. Eating too much just makes me fat and doesn't increase my muscle growth. Even when I bulk now I rely on fats for my excess calories and mainly consume my carbs around my workouts. I'll eat some carbohydrate foods if I really feel like it but I don't go overboard.

I think we've all been trained by schooling and the media to think that eating lots of carbohydrates is healthy and normal but look at how fat everyone is getting. Diabetes and heart disease rates are out of control. You could remove the entire grains group from the food pyramid and you would still have plenty of energy and nutrients to train hard and grow. One of the biggest scams of the century if you ask me. Definitely worked out good for big Agra and the pharmaceutical industry though.
Same line of thought I am debating with myself over.I just started watching my calories to see what level I need to maintain and grow but not gain bodyfat,which I beleive is more driven by carb intake.
For many years I consumed lots of carbs to train but as I get older I find I gain more bodyfat around the waist.So I have just started a high protien and fat diet with limited Carbs to see how I respond.Time will tell I guess.I am at 265lbs and would like to lose 1 lb of body fat per week at 3000 or less calories per day.Need to lose about 10 lbs of fat around my waist.

[Thorgrim]

is there carbs in breast milk? are babys always in ketosis?? would be interesting to know..

Sure there is carbs in breast milk. Per 100ml, 4.2g fat, 7g lactose, 1.1 grams protein.

I don't think it represents an ideal diet for a bodybuilder though. Look how low the protein is. The purpose of the milk is put the maximal amount of weight on the baby as fast as possible, not just lean weight. All animal milk is relatively high in carbs but often the adults of the species eat little to no carbs. Look at wolves for example. Lean and strong on meat and fat only. But the pups drink milk that also contains carbs.

[JifeLacket]

For athletics carbs are essential.. but if one is just doing normal people shit they can live off fat and protein.

[JacktheThriller]

why would u compare a keto diet to a starvation diet? the two have nothing in common at all... a starvation diet is one that does not contain enough nutrients or enough calories... a keto diet is simply one that is low enough in carbohydrate intake that the body starts manufacturing ketones from fat for energy... so i see no comparison




Without discussing the technical details here, it should be understood that fasting (thecomplete abstinence of food) and ketogenic diets aremetabolically very similar. The similarities between the two metabolic states (sometimes referred to as ‘starvation ketosis’ and ‘dietary
ketosis’ respectively) have in part led to the development of the ketogenic diet over the years.The ketogenic diet attempts to mimic the metabolic effects of fasting while food is being consumed.


That is where i got the comparison but technically i should have said fasting rather than ketosis

[ab_chic25]

carbs really only started to be eaten in higher vloumes 10000 yrs ago when agriculture started.. before that it was all fats and protein.. is there carbs in breast milk? are babys always in ketosis?? would be interesting to know..

I know from friends having babys and trying to diet right after, that in order to have breast milk.....a woman needs to eat some carbs. I had a friend a couple years ago who tried the Atkins diet about a month after and her breast milk wasn't heavy enough so the baby wasn't getting enough. Doctor told her to eat more carbs.

[LondonMuscle]

Without discussing the technical details here, it should be understood that fasting (thecomplete abstinence of food) and ketogenic diets aremetabolically very similar. The similarities between the two metabolic states (sometimes referred to as ‘starvation ketosis’ and ‘dietary
ketosis’ respectively) have in part led to the development of the ketogenic diet over the years.The ketogenic diet attempts to mimic the metabolic effects of fasting while food is being consumed.


That is where i got the comparison but technically i should have said fasting rather than ketosis

i really have no idea what the author is talking about... hes actually comparing fasting, which is eating nothing, to a diet that is rich in proteins and fats

he says that they are metabolically similar, however starvation diets tend to preserve fat mass while catabolizing muscle proteins and keto diets do the exact opposite in primarily drawing energy from fat reserves while leaving proteins intact

without a more detailed explanation i cant even begin to understand on what basis he is making this comparison

[JacktheThriller]

its from Lyle McDonalds Keto Diet

if u want to learn more, i posted it, search my threads

[LondonMuscle]

oh, ive actually read and own his book... any idea what page number?

[JacktheThriller]

Chapter 2 history of ketogenic diet