PDA

View Full Version : Primobolan-Good Read



ultrasafe
17-12-2009, 10:28 PM
PRIMOBOLAN (Methenolone Enanthate)

If ever there was a steroid that can be considered “perfect” (or as perfect as can be), it would be Primobolan. It’s considered to be the safest and least suppressive anabolic steroid, has few side effects and is extremely effective. So why isn’t Primobolan used by everybody? The reasons may lie in many of the misconceptions surrounding this incredible drug.

Primobolan does not give fast gains, or more accurately, does not cause a quick increase in water retention, therefore it’s considered “weak”, yet in terms of building solid muscle, it’s one of the most effective steroids available.

All steroids are based on the testosterone molecule and all steroids provide two functions – one, of mimicking androgenic effects within the body. (Basically all “male” attributes – strength, aggression, the ability to grow muscle, etc). And there’s also the “anabolic” effect, in that they recirculate nitrogen (protein) therefore utilizing more of the necessary building blocks needed for tissue growth and repair. Unless sufficient amino acids are present muscle growth will be sub par and in the case of Primobolan this is of utmost significance. You MUST train hard and you MUST eat a lot of protein. THAT, is when you’ll see what Primobolan can do.

The concept behind Primobolan was to have a far greater anabolic to androgenic ratio. The reasoning is not far removed from the original steroid Dianabol, which was formulated to be a “kinder, gentler” form of testosterone. In this way, the athlete can get all the benefits of greater muscle growth without all the detriment and suppression of excess androgens. In the case of Dianabol, it was a good idea yet just it didn’t turn out quite as well as expected. With Primobolan, they got it right.

Primobolan also has a unique fat burning/estrogen blocking capability resulting in “lean gains.” (Leading some people to believe it’s just a “cutter” which is also ridiculous since all steroids are growth drugs). It doesn’t actually burn fat but it can prevent more fat from being formed.

Being a DHT derivative (technically it’s DHB) Primobolan blocks SHBG (sex hormone binding globulin) thus preventing estrogen from forming. When using Primobolan you not only do not need to add an anti aromatase it acts as one on its own, so if you add testosterone, an anti e may not be required.

If you’re wondering if you can do a cycle solely of Primobolan without suppression you’d be mistaken. Although mild, Primobolan is a source of exogenous androgen and after a few weeks the HPTA will begin to shut down and one’s natural Testosterone production will be compromised since the androgens in the drugs will not sufficiently replace what’s been lost. Consequently, strength and libido will tank. For that reason, most bodybuilders add some testosterone into a Primobolan cycle.

Primobolan has often been compared to Deca Durabolin – most likely due to the fact that they’re both mildly androgenic. However, Deca’s “nandrolone” qualities are actually more suppressive than straight testosterone. Deca also increases progesterone that causes extreme water retention, which incidentally is often regarded, incorrectly, as muscle growth. Primobolan causes almost no water retention that is why many people feel it isn’t a good “mass” builder, which is probably its biggest misconception. Primobolan is deceptive in that the gains are so clean they aren’t overtly apparent at first -- which accounts for another myth that Primobolan takes weeks to “kick in.” That, of course, is nonsense. It begins working within hours, but the results may not be noticeable for a while.

Primobolan can be an outstanding size drug on a bulking cycle, If... you consume adequate protein. That is the principal on which it is based. It repairs though increased anabolism. Without the food source, the drug has nothing to work with, so if you aren’t committed to training hard and eating a lot of protein, Primo will be a disappointment. But for more advanced trainers, and those who are used to training naturally, Primo will seem like a wonder drug. Which it kinda is.

There is also an oral form of Primobolan that is often overlooked, the reason being, they are probably the most impractical steroids available. Primobolan acetate is not 17 alpha alkylated, therefore they do not stress the liver. Sounds great, eh? The problem is, they’re only bioavailability for about 4 hours, resulting in several dosages throughout the day (and night) in order to maintain stable blood levels. The other problem is the cost. At what usually amounts to $2 a pill and a necessity of 8 pills a day, the weekly price will exceed $100 a week for a mild cycle. Therefore, Primobolan tablets are not in large demand. (Though if cost isn’t much of a concern they’re an excellent “safe” choice for a first time user, the needle phobic, or a “natural” athlete who needs it clear his or her system within a day).

Primobolan is the “Rolls Royce” of steroids – expensive, but worth it. It stacks well with everything and adds increased anabolism to any cycle while keeping blood pressure, cholesterol count and blood platelet within normal range with moderate use. It may also be the only steroid suitable for women, with the exception of Anavar, though Primobolan is safer.

People are concerned with hair loss with the usage of Primobolan but most users claim it’s no harder on the hairline than straight testosterone.

Because of Primobolan’s mild nature some bodybuilders use it as a “bridge” between cycles though that is not recommended since it will further suppress natural testosterone production and make it more difficult to rebound.

Primobolan can be an excellent addition to HRT (Hormone Replacement Therapy) (200 mgs of Primo with 100mgs of testosterone weekly) but it is not available even with a prescription in most countries.

Dosages:

Primobolan is usually injected several times a week since a cc contains only 100 mgs. ( This is due to a heavy molecular weight. Only so much will “fit” into a ml of oil). It’s active for approximately 2 weeks. Anything under 200 mgs a week will not show a tremendous difference but once it goes to 400 mgs, that’s when the magic usually begins. Also due to the molecular weight, Primo tends to be a painful shot. Not bad going in, but the next day you can expect some soreness.

Arnold Schwarzenegger was known to love Primo and to use 100mgs a day, which by today’s standard is quite conservative for a pro but back in the 70’s it was considered outrageous! As mentioned, Primo needs a more androgenic compound to truly get the maximum benefit so an additional steroid is often used and Arnold was thought to maybe use 50 mgs of d-bol a day, which was also pushing the envelope at the time. As little as 200 mgs of test will suffice to maintain a favorable androgenic environment. (Though most people use more, which is essentially more than they need. At a certain point, the risk/benefit ratio becomes unfavorable).

Availability:

Primobolan is the most faked steroids on the black market. Even UG labs fake it because the raw materials for the chemical compound so expensive. The common “substitute” for Primo is Equipoise since the effects are similar – solid muscle with little bloat. But EQ is not in the same league as Primo and experienced Primo users know it. EQ is a cheap veterinarian drug and can leave the user feeling a little “ill” whereas Primo makes you feel “healthy.” Unless you can get your hands on legit Primo in Turkey or Germany, a reliable UG lab is the only way to go, though you’re never really certain of what you’ll get or if the dosage is correct. Even in countries where it’s legal, Primo isn’t readily available due to the high cost and the fact that there really isn’t a medical reason to use it. It’s strictly a muscle builder and for that purpose it’s unparalleled.

When it comes to putting foreign substances in your body, you don’t want to go bargain hunting. Primobolan costs a little more but in the long run you’ll get more -- with less risks. It’s a shame it’s so hard to obtain but with more access to more UG labs via the internet, it may be possible to track it down. It isn’t a “get big quick” drug, but is a great adjunct to developing solid, quality muscle that can be maintained post cycle with natural training as long as proper PCT is used

Rhinobolt10
18-12-2009, 01:28 AM
and now I'm very much considering Primo

Praetorian
18-12-2009, 11:12 AM
For women the acetate tabs were great. For men the depot is necessary as well as a very large dose as it is quite weak...dont believe the hype. The benefits for men are to say the least mediocre at best...not worth the money for anyone lifting seriously.
For the beach body guy it would be fine along with some var...maybe a bikini to go with it.
P

rickyboy36
18-12-2009, 11:43 AM
For women the acetate tabs were great. For men the depot is necessary as well as a very large dose as it is quite weak...dont believe the hype. The benefits for men are to say the least mediocre at best...not worth the money for anyone lifting seriously.
For the beach body guy it would be fine along with some var...maybe a bikini to go with it.
P

But say someone could afford to use 800mgs a week and combined it with some test for 12 weeks or so,wouldnt it be better than deca or any other "complimentary" steroid?

I have "older" friends at my gym who use to compete..and they used primo exclusively during a cut and they tell me there is no comparison to what is out there today.Not only does it build,it also "keeps" your muscle when going through drastic cutting cycles.Maybe things have changed and the primo that was out there before is not the same as todays..just like tren hex.

waderow
18-12-2009, 12:15 PM
Anyone who has run legit primo has always raved about it.

I intend to give it a whirl sometime soon at a gram a week

rickyboy36
18-12-2009, 12:34 PM
Anyone who has run legit primo has always raved about it.

I intend to give it a whirl sometime soon at a gram a week

Wow man,you cant go wrong with that.How long will you be running it for?

waderow
18-12-2009, 12:44 PM
Wow man,you cant go wrong with that.How long will you be running it for?

lol Prob 200 amps worth

ultrasafe
18-12-2009, 12:49 PM
For women the acetate tabs were great. For men the depot is necessary as well as a very large dose as it is quite weak...dont believe the hype. The benefits for men are to say the least mediocre at best...not worth the money for anyone lifting seriously.
For the beach body guy it would be fine along with some var...maybe a bikini to go with it.
P

LOLOL.. nothing wrong with a beach body..lol. Praetorian if Primo and var are taken would you think some test should be added to avoid shut down.

I was actually thinking of these cycles with primo..

Primo 300-400mg per week (inj) (100mg shot every other day) 8-10 weeks
Test Prop 50-75md EOD. last 4 weeks
Npp 50-75mg EOD. last 4 weeks

or

Primo 300-400mg per week (inj) (100mg shot every other day) 8-10 weeks
Test Enth 200mg per week 8-10weeks
var 40mg per day

or

Primo 300-400mg per week (inj) (100mg shot every other day) 8-10 weeks
Var 40 mg per day
Tribulus


My goals are just to add speed, strength and slowly add size and keep my beach body..If i only add 4-5 pounds of muscle with no sides than that is great with me..

Ohhh and what colour Bikini should i wear.. pink or mauve..hahahahahaha :D

troy_trinity
18-12-2009, 12:59 PM
primo is not a mass drug that gives you that bloated "on" look such as anadrol. So if you are a fan of stuff like drol and dbol or even deca you probably won't like primo too much.

Primo is a wonderfull drug if used in a good doseage- it's going to give some nice gains with no sides- but nothing like the gains anadrol will give you.

Primo is just a different "beast" altogether. run some good stuf at 1g a week for 12 weeks and you won't be disapointed in it if your goals aren't rediculous.

It has a bad rep in some places because people get pissy when they don't gain 20lbs in 6 weeks mostly consisting of water and glycogen storage.

It's like a hybrid of var+eq+mast. You either love it or hate it.

troy_trinity
18-12-2009, 01:05 PM
LOLOL.. nothing wrong with a beach body..lol. Praetorian if Primo and var are taken would you think some test should be added to avoid shut down.

I was actually thinking of these cycles with primo..

Primo 300-400mg per week (inj) (100mg shot every other day) 8-10 weeks
Test Prop 50-75md EOD. last 4 weeks
Npp 50-75mg EOD. last 4 weeks

or

Primo 300-400mg per week (inj) (100mg shot every other day) 8-10 weeks
Test Enth 200mg per week 8-10weeks
var 40mg per day

or

Primo 300-400mg per week (inj) (100mg shot every other day) 8-10 weeks
Var 40 mg per day
Tribulus


My goals are just to add speed, strength and slowly add size and keep my beach body..If i only add 4-5 pounds of muscle with no sides than that is great with me..

Ohhh and what colour Bikini should i wear.. pink or mauve..hahahahahaha :D

i know this question was not directed at myself but yes you need test in there at a minimum of 100mg's/week of converted in your system.

300-400mg's isn't really going to do much- You'd be much happier at 800+ because it's a weak steroid and not really any sides to it.

and not sure 40mg's of var is going to cut it either... I would up that dose...

not trying to be rude but would this be a first cycle for you? Since you suggested trib in place of test I'm assuming so?

ultrasafe
18-12-2009, 01:58 PM
i know this question was not directed at myself but yes you need test in there at a minimum of 100mg's/week of converted in your system.

300-400mg's isn't really going to do much- You'd be much happier at 800+ because it's a weak steroid and not really any sides to it.

and not sure 40mg's of var is going to cut it either... I would up that dose...

not trying to be rude but would this be a first cycle for you? Since you suggested trib in place of test I'm assuming so?


Thanks for the response Troy.. Ya this would be my first and no offence taken on the question.. I hear ya on the dosage but I do have HG gear and many on here say 300-400mg of HG is a good dose. If it was UG than what you suggest would be appropriate.

Just to reiterate that i am not a BB, but an athlete that wants to remain competitive at a high level and doing so safely.

Thanks

Praetorian
18-12-2009, 02:08 PM
But say someone could afford to use 800mgs a week and combined it with some test for 12 weeks or so,wouldnt it be better than deca or any other "complimentary" steroid?

I have "older" friends at my gym who use to compete..and they used primo exclusively during a cut and they tell me there is no comparison to what is out there today.Not only does it build,it also "keeps" your muscle when going through drastic cutting cycles.Maybe things have changed and the primo that was out there before is not the same as todays..just like tren hex.

800mgs weekly of real pharm depot would be very expensive and you would get much more benefit from 75mg EOD of tren. No it would not be better than deca because at least with deca you get joint saving benefits. Using primo as a muscle preserver is a waste of money...test will preserve muscle much better and should be the base of any precontest cycle.
Ive used many different version of real Pharm primo 10-15 years ago...it is very comparable to low dose EQ...nothing special.
P

Praetorian
18-12-2009, 02:09 PM
Anyone who has run legit primo has always raved about it.

I intend to give it a whirl sometime soon at a gram a week

Been there...done that..not impressed.
P

Praetorian
18-12-2009, 02:15 PM
[QUOTE=ultrasafe;333242]LOLOL.. nothing wrong with a beach body..lol. Praetorian if Primo and var are taken would you think some test should be added to avoid shut down.

I was actually thinking of these cycles with primo..

Primo 300-400mg per week (inj) (100mg shot every other day) 8-10 weeks
Test Prop 50-75md EOD. last 4 weeks
Npp 50-75mg EOD. last 4 weeks

or

Primo 300-400mg per week (inj) (100mg shot every other day) 8-10 weeks
Test Enth 200mg per week 8-10weeks
var 40mg per day

or

Primo 300-400mg per week (inj) (100mg shot every other day) 8-10 weeks
Var 40 mg per day
Tribulus


My goals are just to add speed, strength and slowly add size and keep my beach body..If i only add 4-5 pounds of muscle with no sides than that is great with me..

Ohhh and what colour Bikini should i wear.. pink or mauve..hahahahahaha :D[/




If you are not interested in gaining much muscle and just improving strength and add a bit of size then primo and var would be a decent choice. 400mg primo weekly with 30mg var ED for 12 weeks....start the var week 6. Depending on how you react you may need to add some test as some experience HPTA shut down even on these compounds...prop at 100mg EOD should alleviate those issues if you experience them.
I was only kidding about the bikini ;o)

P

troy_trinity
18-12-2009, 02:35 PM
as an athlete tren would hinder OP's cardio for the most part.

test is not important for an athletes performance.

if you told us what kind of athlete you are it would be helpful- also depends on what season you are in.

for an athlete low dose var, eq, test, gh would be an optimal cycle imo though. Possibly low dose deca for the joints as well.

OP- as far as the doseage of primo and everything else it's all person dependent and everything varies from board to board.

I think 800mg's of hg is a good dose. People here will think it's high probably. But on GK's old board for example a cycle of under 5g's of gear was unheard of lol.

Start off on the lower end of things and go up as you see how you respond.

For a first cycle this is what I'd reccomend for you though- assuming you want a straight aas cycle.

1-16 200mg's test (you want test in you trust me)
1-16 EQ (everyone responds to different doseages- anywhere from 400-1g (id go 600 personally but that's just me)
8-16 50mg's var/ day

you won't bloat up, you won't gain a shitload of size, nice slow solid gains. Increased cardio output from the EQ. IF you beat the shit out of your body in training even a nice low dose of gh will be good for recovery if you can afford it.

troy_trinity
18-12-2009, 02:35 PM
Been there...done that..not impressed.
P

how long you run it for bro? what dose?

ultrasafe
18-12-2009, 02:37 PM
[QUOTE=ultrasafe;333242]LOLOL.. nothing wrong with a beach body..lol. Praetorian if Primo and var are taken would you think some test should be added to avoid shut down.

I was actually thinking of these cycles with primo..

Primo 300-400mg per week (inj) (100mg shot every other day) 8-10 weeks
Test Prop 50-75md EOD. last 4 weeks
Npp 50-75mg EOD. last 4 weeks

or

Primo 300-400mg per week (inj) (100mg shot every other day) 8-10 weeks
Test Enth 200mg per week 8-10weeks
var 40mg per day

or

Primo 300-400mg per week (inj) (100mg shot every other day) 8-10 weeks
Var 40 mg per day
Tribulus


My goals are just to add speed, strength and slowly add size and keep my beach body..If i only add 4-5 pounds of muscle with no sides than that is great with me..

Ohhh and what colour Bikini should i wear.. pink or mauve..hahahahahaha :D[/




If you are not interested in gaining much muscle and just improving strength and add a bit of size then primo and var would be a decent choice. 400mg primo weekly with 30mg var ED for 12 weeks....start the var week 6. Depending on how you react you may need to add some test as some experience HPTA shut down even on these compounds...prop at 100mg EOD should alleviate those issues if you experience them.
I was only kidding on the bikini ;o)

P


Hey Praetorian thanks for the info. Very informative. O ya no worries I knew you were joking, just trying to be quick witted lolol and having some fun...

Should I wait to see how my HPTA reacts on the Primo and var before i start the Test or should i incorperate it right at the beginning of the cycle.

And would 100mgs of Test Enth once a week be a good sub for 100mgs of Test Prop EOD.

thanks

Praetorian
18-12-2009, 02:40 PM
how long you run it for bro? what dose?

Getting old but if memory serves correctly 12 weeks at about 200mg EOD....that was back in the mid to late 90's....pharm stuff was still good....we even had real para.
P

Praetorian
18-12-2009, 02:46 PM
[QUOTE=Praetorian;333286]


Hey Praetorian thanks for the info. Very informative. O ya no worries I knew you were joking, just trying to be quick witted lolol and having some fun...

Should I wait to see how my HPTA reacts on the Primo and var before i start the Test or should i incorperate it right at the beginning of the cycle.

And would 100mgs of Test Enth once a week be a good sub for 100mgs of Test Prop EOD.

thanks

You can start at 100mg weekly...use enanthate prop would be too fast at that dose....see how you react. If you are feeling lethargic, low libido, depressed etc you will know its too low and you can increase it...its individualistic and I know for myself 100mg weekly doesnt do much but you may be different...doesnt hurt to start low.
P

troy_trinity
18-12-2009, 02:56 PM
Getting old but if memory serves correctly 12 weeks at about 200mg EOD....that was back in the mid to late 90's....pharm stuff was still good....we even had real para.
P

hmmm interesting man- 12 weeks seems to be the gold standard for minimum run on primo. Stuff back then was a lot better from what we have now apparently from what the older bro's tell me too. Did you just run it that once or did you try it again?

I know one guy from the U.S. on another board swears by 3g's of the stuff pre-contest and says it's unlike anything else. I don't understand the point of running primo and tren at the same time (which we all know tren is a must pre-contest) because the tren would just fill the androgen receptors leaving the primo useless in theory. But everyone seems to respond to stuff differently no matter what so who knows.

For someone who can't handle stronger compounds due to sides I think primo is a good alternative. Some people get anxiety on Eq and other people have prol problems with deca so in this case primo is a good alternative.

It's a good compound if you're not expecting rediculous gains and want something very mild too- but I deffinately hear you about the gains being disapointing- primo is just another beast altogehter really i think.

Praetorian
18-12-2009, 03:06 PM
hmmm interesting man- 12 weeks seems to be the gold standard for minimum run on primo. Stuff back then was a lot better from what we have now apparently from what the older bro's tell me too. Did you just run it that once or did you try it again?

I know one guy from the U.S. on another board swears by 3g's of the stuff pre-contest and says it's unlike anything else. I don't understand the point of running primo and tren at the same time (which we all know tren is a must pre-contest) because the tren would just fill the androgen receptors leaving the primo useless in theory. But everyone seems to respond to stuff differently no matter what so who knows.

For someone who can't handle stronger compounds due to sides I think primo is a good alternative. Some people get anxiety on Eq and other people have prol problems with deca so in this case primo is a good alternative.

It's a good compound if you're not expecting rediculous gains and want something very mild too- but I deffinately hear you about the gains being disapointing- primo is just another beast altogehter really i think.

I tried it a few different times offseason and precontest...never saw any gains out of the ordinary or any differences precontest. I dont see the point of using it precontes really either...with test as a base and some tren, winny/mast.....maybe some halo at the very end...i dont see how primo is going to improve upon anything. I try to keep cycles as simple as possible and avoid any exotic type stacking its all hype.
As you said for slow steady smaller gains for guys just lookign for a boost yes I can see the benefit...as well as making recovery easier.
P

troy_trinity
18-12-2009, 06:14 PM
I tried it a few different times offseason and precontest...never saw any gains out of the ordinary or any differences precontest. I dont see the point of using it precontes really either...with test as a base and some tren, winny/mast.....maybe some halo at the very end...i dont see how primo is going to improve upon anything. I try to keep cycles as simple as possible and avoid any exotic type stacking its all hype.
As you said for slow steady smaller gains for guys just lookign for a boost yes I can see the benefit...as well as making recovery easier.
P

Yup- and also it could be a good way to add a little something to test when cruising or when you want something to add to some test that is very mild for a break from harsher stuff- that's why I use it personally.

fathead
19-12-2009, 02:26 AM
ive asked it before and ill ask it again here... whats everyone experience with hairloss on primo? apprarently its the mildest drug but on paper should cause hairloss.... input?

please dont say you didnt lose any hair on it if you didnt lose hair on your last winny/tren/mast/test cycle either lol

ultrasafe
20-12-2009, 01:46 PM
But everyone seems to respond to stuff differently no matter what so who knows.

For someone who can't handle stronger compounds due to sides I think primo is a good alternative. Some people get anxiety on Eq and other people have prol problems with deca so in this case primo is a good alternative.


It's a good compound if you're not expecting rediculous gains and want something very mild too- but I deffinately hear you about the gains being disapointing- primo is just another beast altogehter really i think.

Very good advise Troy and that is why i will make Primo as the base for my cycle. Worried about Eq and its possible anxiety issues and eventhough not as strong as Eq and Deca, Primo offers some help with joints and so does var.

Hey if Barry Bonds, and Alex Rodriquez used primo and test than that is a stetment in itself.

ultrasafe
20-12-2009, 01:55 PM
[QUOTE=ultrasafe;333305]

You can start at 100mg weekly...use enanthate prop would be too fast at that dose....see how you react. If you are feeling lethargic, low libido, depressed etc you will know its too low and you can increase it...its individualistic and I know for myself 100mg weekly doesnt do much but you may be different...doesnt hurt to start low.
P

Thanks Praetorian..

Again I was thinking like you said Test prop would be too fast at that does 100 eod. Than what about 50mg EOD and than i can add 50 mg of NPP EOD or would that just promote an even quicker shut down on the HPTA.

Just trying to get some benefit out of nandrolone since its great for the joints and acts like a DHT blocker because of the greater binding affinity it has over DHT.

Primo 300-400mg per week (inj) (100mg shot every other day) 10-12weeks
Test Prop 50-75md EOD. last 5 weeks
Npp 50-75mg EOD. last 5weeks

ultrasafe
20-12-2009, 02:00 PM
ive asked it before and ill ask it again here... whats everyone experience with hairloss on primo? apprarently its the mildest drug but on paper should cause hairloss.... input?

please dont say you didnt lose any hair on it if you didnt lose hair on your last winny/tren/mast/test cycle either lol

fat head I have no experience with primo. But from all my research within the past two years i really believe it comes down to the individuale, if the person is pre-disposed to MPB and the dosage. The higher the dose the more chance it effecting the hair line.

Again I will have expereince and let you know sometime next year..lolol.

troy_trinity
20-12-2009, 06:37 PM
Very good advise Troy and that is why i will make Primo as the base for my cycle. Worried about Eq and its possible anxiety issues and eventhough not as strong as Eq and Deca, Primo offers some help with joints and so does var.

Hey if Barry Bonds, and Alex Rodriquez used primo and test than that is a stetment in itself.

Primo is a good add on but will never be a base.

EVERY CYCLE BASE IS TEST. If you are an elite athlete with sports doc's and whatnot that oversee your cycles than yes you may be able to do a non-test-base cycle. But, otherwise you need TEST.

Test is and always will be the ultimate hormone. It took men thousands and thousands of years to develop this drug :)

var doesn't really help with joints though bro. And primo's effect on joints is limited.


[QUOTE=Praetorian;333311]

Thanks Praetorian..

Again I was thinking like you said Test prop would be too fast at that does 100 eod. Than what about 50mg EOD and than i can add 50 mg of NPP EOD or would that just promote an even quicker shut down on the HPTA.

Just trying to get some benefit out of nandrolone since its great for the joints and acts like a DHT blocker because of the greater binding affinity it has over DHT.

Primo 300-400mg per week (inj) (100mg shot every other day) 10-12weeks
Test Prop 50-75md EOD. last 5 weeks
Npp 50-75mg EOD. last 5weeks

you are going down the wrong path bro. Trust me on this.

you NEED at least 100mg's/week all cycle long. Shit 200mg's/week would be a lot better as well.

And don't use prop use a longer ester such as E or C.

NPP is deffinately the wrong way to go with the cycle I think.

troy_trinity
20-12-2009, 06:38 PM
and ultrasafe please do not be offended by this but are you an actual athlete or are you wanting to look like one?

There are 2 different routes to go- performance or looks.

ultrasafe
21-12-2009, 09:30 PM
Primo is a good add on but will never be a base.

EVERY CYCLE BASE IS TEST. If you are an elite athlete with sports doc's and whatnot that oversee your cycles than yes you may be able to do a non-test-base cycle. But, otherwise you need TEST.

Test is and always will be the ultimate hormone. It took men thousands and thousands of years to develop this drug :)

var doesn't really help with joints though bro. And primo's effect on joints is limited.

[QUOTE=ultrasafe;333832]

you are going down the wrong path bro. Trust me on this.

you NEED at least 100mg's/week all cycle long. Shit 200mg's/week would be a lot better as well.

And don't use prop use a longer ester such as E or C.

NPP is deffinately the wrong way to go with the cycle I think.


Troy thanks for the advise Bro I am always a sponge and listen to you pros and your advise is sound with 100mg of Test and you are right I will stick with the Test Enth. Heck with this amount per week it has been been shown to give many benefits as quoted below. Also, as for Primo and Var, both are used to increase collagen syn. Maybe not so much as Deca, Eq and ofcourse GH but they do assist in this department.

Deca, Equipoise, Anavar, and Primobolan will ALL increase skeletal muscle while at the same time dramatically increase collagen syn and bone mass and density, leaving you with a substantially reduced chance of becoming injured than if you choose to use AAS like sus, cyp, or enth.

While testosterone will increase bone mass and density, even at supra-physiological levels, the result is weaker tendons due to inhibition of collagen syn.

To plan a cycle where the goal is to increase skeletal muscle mass/strength while at the same time increase joint/tendon/ligament strength, enough to keep up with the dramatic increase in skeletal muscle, you must choose drugs like Eq, Deca, Anavar, or Primo as the 'BASE' of your cycle. Testosterone and its esters can be added to your cycle to keep levels within a 'normal' physiological range (ie, 100-200 mg/wk) but must not go above this. Since drugs like eq, deca, anavar and primo will reduce endogenous, natural levels of test, these levels may be maintained with exogenous test in the 100-200 mg/wk range. Test at this dose will not inhibit collagen syn, but paradoxically, will help increase it. It is when exogenous testosterone is used > 200 mg/wk that collagen syn is inhibited. .................................................. .!!!!!!(Troy you are on the ball here with Test.. I gotch ya and also a shout out thanks to Praetorian..)!!!

Deca @ 3 mg/kg a week(about 270 mg/wk for a 200 lb male) will increase procollagen III levels by 270% by week 2. Procollagen III is a primary indicator used to determine the rate of collagen syn. As you can see, deca is a very good drug at giving you everything you want -- an increase in collagen syn, an increase in skeletal muscle, and increases in bone mass and density. The one thing it does not give you is wood

Primobolan, @ 5 mg/kg, will increase collagen synthesis by roughly 180% -- less than deca and equipoise but still substantial.

Equipoise @ 3 mg/kg will increase procollagen III by approximately 340% -- slightly better than deca.

Oxandrolone has over a hundred studies documenting its effectiveness at treating patients needing rapid increases in collagen syn to enhance healing.

cog
21-12-2009, 10:05 PM
I would like to see the actual curve showing the decline in collagen synthesis vs test levels.Some of that above info has been repeated across a huge number of boards.

Praetorian
22-12-2009, 12:12 PM
Not to mention the so called inhibition of collagen synthesis by test has not been shown to result in any adverse affects by athletes in real life situations.
P

cog
22-12-2009, 02:17 PM
Not to mention the so called inhibition of collagen synthesis by test has not been shown to result in any adverse affects by athletes in real life situations.
P

Thanks Prae.