View Full Version : Should I add dBol to first cycle?
I'm going to soon running a 12 week, 250 mg Test E 2x per week and I was wondering if it would be a good idea to capitalize on my fresh young bod by adding some dBol from weeks 6-10? I figure if I am to have sides from the test I will know it by the 6th week so I would still be aware of each compound.
I am planning on taking arimidex during the cycle .5 EOD, as well.
Would dBol be worth it for a first time? Will it cause me more problems in recovery?
EDIT: Here is my daily diet @ 5'6 150 lbs
Umm I dont know where you guys get the idea that my portions are small, maybe try reading my post more carefully before raging?
Meal 1. 4 XL omega eggs, 1 cup dry oatmeal, 1 banana, 1 tbsp olive oil,
Meal 2. 4 XL omega eggs, 1 cup oatmeal, 1 tbsp olive oil
Meal 3. 3 scoops weight gainer, 650 calories
Meal 4. Striploin steak 1 cup brown rice + veggies
Meal 5. 350 g chicken breast, 1 cup brown rice
Meal 6. striploin steak or 300 g groundbeef + 1 cup rice
Threw this into a Calorie counter, about 3600. I eat like this every single day.
waderow
10-12-2009, 04:05 PM
stats
training exp
diet
pct
assuming all the above are all good, I would sooner see you up the test and leave the dbol for later
nitrous
10-12-2009, 04:55 PM
stats
training exp
diet
pct
assuming all the above are all good, I would sooner see you up the test and leave the dbol for later
agreed if you wanted to make it stronger then up the test to around 600mg a week
MikeyFXD35
10-12-2009, 05:59 PM
If you want to add an oral on your first cycle go with anavar
21 years old, 5'6, 155. Been working out since I was 13, just started getting serious with my diet (bodybuilding serious) in the last year after a bad back injury, 3000 calories a day off cycle and will log 4000-5000 a day on cycle.
PCT is Nolvadex and Clomid, basic dosages for both for 4 weeks.
Its just that I have very good quality testosterone and was wanting more out of it.
CanadianIron
10-12-2009, 06:00 PM
Just run test only at 500, you will make great gains and it wont be hard on the bod.
Kronis
10-12-2009, 06:03 PM
I absolutely loved dbol so I'd just say if you do add it try 20mg/day.
waderow
10-12-2009, 06:11 PM
21 years old, 5'6, 155. Been working out since I was 13, just started getting serious with my diet (bodybuilding serious) in the last year after a bad back injury, 3000 calories a day off cycle and will log 4000-5000 a day on cycle.
PCT is Nolvadex and Clomid, basic dosages for both for 4 weeks.
Its just that I have very good quality testosterone and was wanting more out of it.
shit dude.... unless you have low test problems I wouldn't hit the juice just yet. Diet is everything at your age, so get up to 200 pounds, and mid 20's
then juicve
My diet is good, but unfortunately there is no way I will get to 200 naturally. I have a very small frame so anything that can help me get the most out of my diet is great.
massabsamurai
10-12-2009, 06:19 PM
if you wanna kickstart the cycle, do it for the first 4 weeks than get off of it. 15-20mg shud do the job!
waderow
10-12-2009, 06:34 PM
My diet is good, but unfortunately there is no way I will get to 200 naturally. I have a very small frame so anything that can help me get the most out of my diet is great.
for real man, I am not shitting.... if you eat enough you will gain serious poundage at your age.
for real man, I am not shitting.... if you eat enough you will gain serious poundage at your age.
I've made great progress with just diet alone, but I feel it's time to get more out of it. Thank you for your advice tho, much obliged.
i think I will stick with just the test this cycle.
Kronis
10-12-2009, 08:09 PM
21 years old, 5'6, 155. Been working out since I was 13, just started getting serious with my diet (bodybuilding serious) in the last year after a bad back injury, 3000 calories a day off cycle and will log 4000-5000 a day on cycle.
PCT is Nolvadex and Clomid, basic dosages for both for 4 weeks.
Its just that I have very good quality testosterone and was wanting more out of it.
Weird, I didn't see this post before I commented.
I don't think you even need 500mg test. 100mg prop EOD for 8 weeks, but I'd suggest getting to at least 170 natural first.
liquidfire
10-12-2009, 08:16 PM
You can definitely get some more lean gains at your height before hitting the juice. I am only 5'8" and I was about 220lbs before I did my first cycle.
If you mind is set, leave the orals out and just do the 500mg/week of test.
gregdoucette
10-12-2009, 09:56 PM
U dont need to be 200 lbs too look good especially at 5 foot 6. Really starting out on testosterone at such a young age is just going to get u to need even more steroids to improve when u get older. Just imagine what youll have to take at 31 to gain anything if ur already relying on testosterone at 21. You should just go for the basics like creatine protein powder, glutamine that sort of thing and save the big gains for later.
Why would starting younger be detrimental? Wouldn't it just mean I've gone through more potential growth-phases by starting early and not abusing the drugs? From the research I have done, it doesn't appear that steroids become 'less effective' each subsequent time you use them.
What I mean to say - I understand needing higher dosages to stimulate further growth, but isn't that more a result of that individual's ability to build muscle, IE natural 140 lbs man vs. natural 220 lbs man?
rob66679
10-12-2009, 11:32 PM
Why would starting younger be detrimental? Wouldn't it just mean I've gone through more potential growth-phases by starting early and not abusing the drugs? From the research I have done, it doesn't appear that steroids become 'less effective' each subsequent time you use them.
I've seen may different opinions about giving your receptors "off time".
I think the biggest reason people gain less after the first cycle is they are closer to their genetic natural limits. Theres a point where any further muscle gain requires constant juicing, all the big pros are always on 24/7/365.
I'm not gonna tell you not to because its your choice, and you sound like your minds made up. The biggest way it could be detrimental is if your not done growing ( stunted height ) or if your not well researched and prepared.
I don't really buy into the whole "slippery slope" theory that you'll automatically be doing a Munzer stack at age 30 because you did test at 21, any more than I believe smoking a joint leads to being a crackhead.
As long as you know theres a difference between use and abuse you'll be fine.
That being said, you are to small and to young lol. Eat more, train hard and when you're 25 give er hell.
Ritch
10-12-2009, 11:44 PM
C`mon Wade, a guy who`s 5`6 to bulk up to 200lbs naturally. Yeah he could do it, but will end up looking like porky pig.
nitrous
11-12-2009, 12:55 AM
i agree with Ritch... this is coming from a guy who is also 5'5-6.. im 25 though.. currently at 182lbs.. and i understand where he is coming from its not easy.. sure i could get to 200lbs naturally but i wouldnt be able to see my abs.. and if i can it would take me like 10 years lol.. i'd like to see 200lbs by summer but probably not going to make it but im gonna try my best to get as close as i can...
in my opinion if you want to make the best gains possible i'd start with your diet.. if you want some help let us know.. i've got no issues telling you what i do for a diet.. train heavy
My diet is 6 meals a day, eggs for the first 2 meals, beef for 3, 1 weight gainer shake. 3-4 tbsp olive oil a day, and my carbs for every meal is either plain oats w/water + Cinnamon for blood sugar control, or steamed brown rice. Veggies with every meal as well.
For the cycle I will simply up this by portion size.
I understand what you guys are saying re: smaller guys like me not having proper diets. If I just give it time with my diet I will surely make gains, that is without question. However, I would like to increase the speed and quality of those gains. I feel with minor AAS use I can go through more growth phases with my proper diet and training than if I started at 175.
waderow
11-12-2009, 12:45 PM
My diet is 6 meals a day, eggs for the first 2 meals, beef for 3, 1 weight gainer shake. 3-4 tbsp olive oil a day, and my carbs for every meal is either plain oats w/water + Cinnamon for blood sugar control, or steamed brown rice. Veggies with every meal as well.
For the cycle I will simply up this by portion size.
I understand what you guys are saying re: smaller guys like me not having proper diets. If I just give it time with my diet I will surely make gains, that is without question. However, I would like to increase the speed and quality of those gains. I feel with minor AAS use I can go through more growth phases with my proper diet and training than if I started at 175.
well, you can listen to everyone and do it the right way, as we have all been there done that, or you can take the easy way out and put on a bunch of quick muscle, then lose it, and be chubby afterwards and have to work harder
nitrous
11-12-2009, 01:08 PM
My diet is 6 meals a day, eggs for the first 2 meals, beef for 3, 1 weight gainer shake. 3-4 tbsp olive oil a day, and my carbs for every meal is either plain oats w/water + Cinnamon for blood sugar control, or steamed brown rice. Veggies with every meal as well.
For the cycle I will simply up this by portion size.
I understand what you guys are saying re: smaller guys like me not having proper diets. If I just give it time with my diet I will surely make gains, that is without question. However, I would like to increase the speed and quality of those gains. I feel with minor AAS use I can go through more growth phases with my proper diet and training than if I started at 175.
the diet is hard for me to judge cuz you say eggs but its like hwo many eggs? omega 3 eggs or regular eggs? and do you actually not have carbs for your first 2 meals?
and i cant say wait till you hit 175.. i didnt wait till i was 175 but i did wait till i was 165...
AlladdinSane
11-12-2009, 01:28 PM
the diet is hard for me to judge cuz you say eggs but its like how many eggs? omega 3 eggs or regular eggs? and do you actually not have carbs for your first 2 meals?
and i cant say wait till you hit 175.. i didnt wait till i was 175 but i did wait till i was 165...
Exactly. Skinny guys are always vague about quantity. They word their food descriptions so it sounds like a lot of food: "A BIIIG bowl of oats" = a bowl of oatmeal an 8 year old could throw back; "A bunch of eggs" = more than one, less than three; "A big dinner at McDonald's" = a dbl cheeseburger combo, regular sized, threw away half the fries; "A huge steak" = a 6 oz steak.
Ridiculous.
#1. Be honest with yourself for pity's sake.
#2. If you really want help, be honest with the people you are asking for advice.
****.
natenator
11-12-2009, 01:30 PM
Exactly. Skinny guys are always vague about quantity. They word their food descriptions so it sounds like a lot of food: "A BIIIG bowl of oats" = a bowl of oatmeal an 8 year old could throw back; "A bunch of eggs" = more than one, less than three; "A big dinner at McDonald's" = a dbl cheeseburger combo, regular sized, threw away half the fries; "A huge steak" = a 6 oz steak.
Ridiculous.
#1. Be honest with yourself for pity's sake.
#2. If you really want help, be honest with the people you are asking for advice.
****.
i heart you
we could be good together. Think about it.
nitrous
11-12-2009, 01:31 PM
ya you wanna know what i eat for breakfast..
6 omega 3 eggs.. some egg whites throwin in that plus 1 cup of raw oatmeal
and i try to get 7 meals back a day that size..
AlladdinSane
11-12-2009, 01:44 PM
i heart you
we could be good together. Think about it.
I've thought about it.
Hott offspring, no doubt.
AlladdinSane
11-12-2009, 01:45 PM
There's a lot of under-achieving in this thread (and board in general, lately).
Way to set your sites on "mediocre", everyone!
natenator
11-12-2009, 01:50 PM
There's a lot of under-achieving in this thread (and board in general, lately).
Way to set your sites on "mediocre", everyone!
gee thanks :(
btw? I will give you a reach around for pushing the Rehband stuff. I got my gear in the other day and had a chest workout with them last night (first one in about 6 weeks) and was able to incline 245 for 8 reps and have zero pain in my arms!!!
Going to do legs today and see how the knee supports feel :)
AlladdinSane
11-12-2009, 01:51 PM
...And why does this kid think he's going to get big on a weightloss diet: Eggs, oats (w/cinnamon for blood sugar control, don't forget!), beef a few times, and 4 spoons of oil/day.
OH! That's right! Drugs! Silly me! That's why all the starving African kids on the CCF commercials are skinny, cuz they have no drugs and bad genetics! We should just send them a shitload of crank!!! That'll fix everything!!!
****.
natenator
11-12-2009, 01:53 PM
...And why does this kid think he's going to get big on a weightloss diet: Eggs, oats (w/cinnamon for blood sugar control, don't forget!), beef a few times, and 4 spoons of oil/day.
OH! That's right! Drugs! Silly me! That's why all the starving African kids on the CCF commercials are skinny, cuz they have no drugs and bad genetics! We should just send them a shitload of crank!!! That'll fix everything!!!
****.
easy tiger, easy. You'll get a reputation for being a hater if you keep up with these comments ;)
AlladdinSane
11-12-2009, 01:53 PM
gee thanks :(
btw? I will give you a reach around for pushing the Rehband stuff. I got my gear in the other day and had a chest workout with them last night (first one in about 6 weeks) and was able to incline 245 for 8 reps and have zero pain in my arms!!!
Going to do legs today and see how the knee supports feel :)
Nate, you and Wade are not on the under-achiever list :handsome
I'm really glad the rehband stuff is workin' out for you! :a+
AlladdinSane
11-12-2009, 01:54 PM
easy tiger, easy. You'll get a reputation for being a hater if you keep up with these comments ;)
Rawr.
I will give you a reach around
rusty trombone or go home
Shortdave
11-12-2009, 02:06 PM
I hate to jump on the bandwagon... but you gotta eat man I am also 5'6" and I am sitting at 220 right now. Am I super lean? No, in fact I am not really that lean at all, but I am strong and I am big and I am getting bigger and stronger every week.
Also, I don't look like porky pig.
natenator
11-12-2009, 02:19 PM
Nate, you and Wade are not on the under-achiever list :handsome
I'm really glad the rehband stuff is workin' out for you! :a+
Actually, I would say I am an under achiever as I did not reach my goal this year. Injuries or not, it's still a disappointment and an underachievement.
AlladdinSane
11-12-2009, 02:27 PM
Actually, I would say I am an under achiever as I did not reach my goal this year. Injuries or not, it's still a disappointment and an underachievement.
Yes, but you had a Man-Sized Goal that you fell short of. Different than most on here lately, "I wanna gain 8-9 pounds and finally break that pesky 180lb mark. How much gear do I need to do that?"
natenator
11-12-2009, 02:30 PM
Yes, but you had a Man-Sized Goal that you fell short of. Different than most on here lately, "I wanna gain 8-9 pounds and finally break that pesky 180lb mark. How much gear do I need to do that?"
lmao
always good for a giggle you are haha
Umm I dont know where you guys get the idea that my portions are small, maybe try reading my post more carefully before raging?
Meal 1. 4 XL omega eggs, 1 cup dry oatmeal, 1 banana, 1 tbsp olive oil,
Meal 2. 4 XL omega eggs, 1 cup oatmeal, 1 tbsp olive oil
Meal 3. 3 scoops weight gainer, 650 calories
Meal 4. Striploin steak 1 cup brown rice + veggies
Meal 5. 350 g chicken breast, 1 cup brown rice
Meal 6. striploin steak or 300 g groundbeef + 1 cup rice
Pretty sure this is a perfect weight-gaining diet, as I have been gaining very well since April.
edit: Threw this into a Calorie counter, about 3600. I eat like this every single day.
...And why does this kid think he's going to get big on a weightloss diet: Eggs, oats (w/cinnamon for blood sugar control, don't forget!), beef a few times, and 4 spoons of oil/day.
OH! That's right! Drugs! Silly me! That's why all the starving African kids on the CCF commercials are skinny, cuz they have no drugs and bad genetics! We should just send them a shitload of crank!!! That'll fix everything!!!
****.
How's my diet? tell em why u mad son
meals 3-6 are lacking healthy fat.
if you want to grow, replace oatmeal with yams, trust me on this one... oatmeal is very very overrated.
increase brown rice to 1.5 cups
So take oatmeal out? Why are the yams superior, because of the effect on glucose?
personal experience
if you're concerend with blood sugar you should reconsider the weight gainer shake
It only has 5 grams of sugar, per 3 scoops. Thanks for the yam reminder, I always feel much better after eating some yams. So a tablespoon of olive oil with the last 3 meals?
AlladdinSane
11-12-2009, 03:26 PM
Uncalled for.
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o286/VespertineIconoclast/obamam-lol-y-u-mad-tho.jpg
oh i know why because you tried to talk shit like a bitch but then you got put down like old yeller. stfu faggot unplug your keyboard.
CanadianIron
11-12-2009, 03:35 PM
Just run test only... jump start your cycle with a new pre-workout.
If you maintain that diet, maybe add 1000 calories, you'll make nice gains from week 4-12. Kudo's for you if you actually eat like that everyday. Thats a lot of work, I wish I could maintain a diet like that. I concider a triple baconator good eating.
I've been eating like that daily since the end of may. I've gained a good amount of weight so the basic frame of this diet works for me. Thanks for your input on the test. What sort of lean-muscle gains would you expect from a cycle like this and diet like this?
I'm serious about bodybuilding and gaining weight. Unfortunately I started at a much lower weight than most people (117 lbs) but I can make up ground.
natenator
11-12-2009, 03:39 PM
I've been eating like that daily since the end of may. I've gained a good amount of weight so the basic frame of this diet works for me. Thanks for your input on the test. What sort of lean-muscle gains would you expect from a cycle like this and diet like this?
I'm serious about bodybuilding and gaining weight. Unfortunately I started at a much lower weight than most people (117 lbs) but I can make up ground.
117lbs? were you a girl?
Shortdave
11-12-2009, 03:41 PM
oh i know why because you tried to talk shit like a bitch but then you got put down like old yeller. stfu faggot unplug your keyboard.
He's upset because your "weight gain diet" is a joke, I mean seriously 300 grams of beef as a meal? 300? I can't remember the last time I ate that little food at one time.
4 eggs and ONE cup of oatmeal. Are you sure that you aren't a 14 year old girl?
You are eating pretty much the way I do when I am dropping fat. But I mean hey, you managed to bulk yourself up to 150lbs, I guess you already know how to eat.
How much do you weigh? Youre really grasping at straws here. 3600 calories a day, over 2 G of protein per g of bodyweight, at 150 lbs? This is not an adequate amount of food? Why don't you make fun of my height LOL
300 g ground beef is 570 calories. Pretty sure thats plenty of protein for one meal for a 150 lbs natty the goal is to add lean muscle and not "add lbs to the scale"
natenator
11-12-2009, 03:47 PM
How much do you weigh? Youre really grasping at straws here. 3600 calories a day, over 2 G of protein per g of bodyweight, at 150 lbs? This is not an adequate amount of food? Why don't you make fun of my height LOL
300 g ground beef is 570 calories. Pretty sure thats plenty of protein for one meal for a 150 lbs natty
Pretty sure SD is about 5'6'ish as well and weighs around 220lbs...
Shortdave
11-12-2009, 03:53 PM
How much do you weigh? Youre really grasping at straws here. 3600 calories a day, over 2 G of protein per g of bodyweight, at 150 lbs? This is not an adequate amount of food? Why don't you make fun of my height LOL
300 g ground beef is 570 calories. Pretty sure thats plenty of protein for one meal for a 150 lbs natty
I am also 5'6" and I weigh 220 right now. Got here natural then blew out my achilles and I am now running the whopping cycle of 140mgs var and 10 iu gh/ week for enhanced tendon repair.
You have to eat for the weight that you want to be, not the weight that you are, I mean your weight gain shake alone can be bumped to 1500 calories, add another scoop of powder, some oatmeal, 3-4 tbsp of peanut butter and some oil.
I started at 140lbs.
nitrous
11-12-2009, 03:55 PM
How much do you weigh? Youre really grasping at straws here. 3600 calories a day, over 2 G of protein per g of bodyweight, at 150 lbs? This is not an adequate amount of food? Why don't you make fun of my height LOL
300 g ground beef is 570 calories. Pretty sure thats plenty of protein for one meal for a 150 lbs natty the goal is to add lean muscle and not "add lbs to the scale"
Start doing this... Its a cut from a post from Dave Palumbo
MEAL 1:
6 whole eggs (buy the OMEGA-3 EGGS they sell in the supermarket) with 1 cup of Oatmeal (cooked)
MEAL 2: (pre-workout)
SHAKE: 55g Whey Protein** with 40g Waxy Maize*** (high molecular weight carbohydrate) with 1 tablespoon of Macadamia Nut Oil
GYM: WEIGHT TRAINING
MEAL 3: (post-workout)
SHAKE: 55g Whey Protein** with 50g Waxy Maize*** (high molecular weight carbohydrate).
MEAL 4:
“LEAN PROTEIN MEAL” 8oz (cooked) of chicken (or turkey or lean fish or shrimp)-- with ˝ cup cashew nuts (or almonds or walnuts) with 1 cup (cooked) RICE (brown)
MEAL 5:
“FATTY PROTEIN MEAL” 8oz (cooked) of red meat (or salmon or swordfish) with a salad with 2 tablespoon of olive oil (or macadamia nut oil) and vinegar with 1 baked potato and/or yam
MEAL 6: Repeat One of Above
MEAL 7: 5 whole eggs
*****MEAL ORDER IS UNIMPORTANT. ALL MEALS ARE EQUAL.
***ONCE A WEEK, HAVE A CHEAT MEAL (instead of MEAL #6 or 7) – try to make it the last meal of the day (start after 2 weeks on the diet)
I am also 5'6" and I weigh 220 right now. Got here natural then blew out my achilles and I am now running the whopping cycle of 140mgs var and 10 iu gh/ week for enhanced tendon repair.
You have to eat for the weight that you want to be, not the weight that you are, I mean your weight gain shake alone can be bumped to 1500 calories, add another scoop of powder, some oatmeal, 3-4 tbsp of peanut butter and some oil.
I started at 140lbs.
I completely agree with what you said about eating for the body you want. But without enhanced nutrient synthesis, the additional nutrients just get stored at fat. I started this diet at 4500 cals a day and got a nice tire around my mid section with the same rate of strength gain as I am seeing now at 1000 cals less.
I want to juice so I can eat even MORE without getting fat. That's my whole point.
Start doing this... Its a cut from a post from Dave Palumbo
MEAL #1
5 whole Omega-3 Eggs (with 4 additional whites)
MEAL #2
SHAKE: 54g Whey Protein Isolate*** with 1.5 Tablespoon of All Natural PB
MEAL #3
“Lean Protein Meal” 7oz (cooked) chicken (or Turkey, or Tuna, or tilapia, flounder, or cod) with 1/3-cup RAW almonds, cashews or walnuts
MEAL #4
SHAKE: 54g Whey Protein Isolate with 1 ˝ tablespoons of All Natural Peanut butter (no sugar added)
MEAL #5
“Fatty Protein Meal” 7oz (cooked) Salmon, Swordfish, or 8oz RED MEAT (filet mignon, or top round cut) with a green salad (no tomatoes, carrots, or red peppers) with 1 tablespoon of Olive Oil or Macadamia nut oil and vinegar
MEAL #6
SHAKE: 54g Whey with 1 ˝ tablespoon all natural peanut butter OR 4 whole Omega-3 eggs
*****MEAL ORDER IS UNIMPORTANT. ALL MEALS ARE EQUAL.
***ONCE A WEEK, HAVE A CHEAT MEAL (instead of MEAL #6) – try to make it the last meal of the day (start after 2 weeks on the diet)
Looks like a great diet for someone trying to cut... where are the carbs?
nitrous
11-12-2009, 04:09 PM
Looks like a great diet for someone trying to cut... where are the carbs?
lol good call.. updated it with his mass diet
gsxr750
11-12-2009, 04:12 PM
Kill yourself.
Spit out my food.. you and Nate.. wow awesome
Skip the DBOL, buy 50 pounds of chicken breast instead
AlladdinSane
11-12-2009, 04:35 PM
oh i know why because you tried to talk shit like a bitch but then you got put down like old yeller. stfu faggot unplug your keyboard.
I weigh twice as much as you. Take your 155lb bird body, load it up with drugs, keep your diet subpar, and I will still be bigger and stronger than you. Always. I got this way from listening to people who knew more and told me so.
Jeezus, my girlfriend weighs as much as you and is in great shape.
PS. Congrats for gaining the weight you have, but to say that you're
pretty sure this is a perfect weight-gaining diet is ludicrous if you've stopped gaining weight. I was trying to help and happened to vent in your thread at the same time.
I haven't stopped gaining weight. No where did I say that. Why are you jumping to ridiculous conclusions about me, it seems you've made up your mind without knowing/caring about the facts.
AlladdinSane
11-12-2009, 04:42 PM
Why else would you jump on drugs @ 21?
dremen
11-12-2009, 04:43 PM
Spit out my food.. you and Nate.. wow awesome
Skip the DBOL, buy 50 pounds of chicken breast instead
I would get the dbol and the chicken.....lol
Then again it's no secret i love my gear:D
Keep eating food like a 77' chevy drinks gasoline.
this is what you should think about:
genetically, your body probably sucks balls.... just don't see you as being "big boned". that being said, the point everyone is trying to make is to DOUBLE what you're eating, or forget about this sport. i mean like, its a ****ing awesome feeling to be ON, but in reality, its not gonna do much more than that for you. with your current diet you'll put on a bit of weight, then lose it, you're only on for 12 weeks anyways imo not enough time to help mature the muscle
I appreciate what you guys talking shit are trying to do, that is prevent somebody from hurting themselves.
The point I'm trying to communicate once again is my diet and training are working for me, I am achieving the results I started out for. I am looking to utilize every tool I can in order to achieve my ultimate bodybuilding goal, and the only one I am not using is AAS.
I am coming with a question about AAS, something I am well-read in but NOT experienced in. Why is this so difficult for you to understand?
dremen
11-12-2009, 04:48 PM
Why else would you jump on drugs @ 21?
How old were you when you started?
Lots of guys start before there 21(not good at all)so at least this guys waited a bit longer.
Dude there was a thread over at steroidology where some 20 year old kid was saying he need a good cycle because he hit a plateau at 170lbs.....LOL, holy **** i layed into that ****ing clown:beat
Anywho if the dude's gunna run gear i hope he just eats and trains like a crazy ****er.
Best luck.
natenator
11-12-2009, 04:51 PM
How old were you when you started?
Lots of guys start before there 21(not good at all)so at least this guys waited a bit longer.
Dude there was a thread over at steroidology where some 20 year old kid was saying he need a good cycle because he hit a plateau at 170lbs.....LOL, holy **** i layed into that ****ing clown:beat
Anywho if the dude's gunna run gear i hope he just eats and trains like a crazy ****er.
Best luck.
I was 30.
How old were you Dreman?
Shortdave
11-12-2009, 04:53 PM
How old were you when you started?
Lots of guys start before there 21(not good at all)so at least this guys waited a bit longer.
I am 28 and I just now went on because of an injury.
Alladdin started up at around 25-26 if I remember correctly, then he stopped and just focused on diet and training.
I guess everything I say is HORSESHIT without some pics. I'm not looking how I want to look yet, but this is my progress in about 4 months. I'm obviously doing something right. =/
126 -> 146
May -> Sept
http://i47.tinypic.com/3354k94.jpg
http://i49.tinypic.com/2nofiv.jpg
natenator
11-12-2009, 04:56 PM
I appreciate what you guys talking shit are trying to do, that is prevent somebody from hurting themselves.
The point I'm trying to communicate once again is my diet and training are working for me, I am achieving the results I started out for. I am looking to utilize every tool I can in order to achieve my ultimate bodybuilding goal, and the only one I am not using is AAS.
I am coming with a question about AAS, something I am well-read in but NOT experienced in. Why is this so difficult for you to understand?
What L3 said is right. You have horrible genetics if you started at 117lbs. When you come off most of what you gained likely won't stick around which is why I ALWAYS advocate guys training to gain natural muscle for many years before considering the sauce. Naturally gained muscle sticks around.
dremen
11-12-2009, 05:00 PM
Easy there Nate and Shortdave, i was just asking a question with no disrespect intended ok:)
Myself i was 25 or so when i ran my first cycle.
KON, bro i just went back to the first page and DUDE your only 150lbs and you want to use gear???
Look im not going to tell you what to do, but FYI before i started gear again 2 months ago i went from 180lbs to 210-215 then started gear again. It took me a solid 5 months and buckets full of steaks, chicken, shakes ect. to bulk natty, but i got there bro.
Im not gunna hate on ya bro, but you need to get up to 200lbs (at least) all natty before you jump on the juice.
Best wishes bro:D
So I shouldn't use gear because my starting point was lower than yours? That doesn't really make sense. I've put on over 30 lbs since I started. =/
natenator
11-12-2009, 05:02 PM
So I shouldn't use gear because my starting point was lower than yours? That doesn't really make sense. I've put on over 30 lbs since I started. =/
lets see how much you keep when you come off. Wanna place bets?
[IMG][IMG]
[IMG][IMG]
dude... like seriously?
where are you gonna pin the oil? anything longer than .5" is gonna hit your humerus. for ****s sakes man
natenator
11-12-2009, 05:07 PM
dude... like seriously?
where are you gonna pin the oil? anything longer than .5" is gonna hit your humerus. for ****s sakes man
LMAO!
Now we can add AS and L3 to my hate group :D
dremen
11-12-2009, 05:11 PM
So I shouldn't use gear because my starting point was lower than yours? That doesn't really make sense. I've put on over 30 lbs since I started. =/
Look steroids are fun im not gunna lie, but there a TOOL bro not a crutch.
Wait you've put on 30 pounds already? Shit you were 120lbs when you started????????
**** bro do you like in Ethiopia....lol
Bulk up to 200 natty then blow yer wad with roids, that my advice.
i'll keep every bit of it
natenator
11-12-2009, 05:13 PM
i'll keep every bit of it
Spoken like a young, arrogant, puke runt who hasn't done or accomplished shit in this game
I got $1000 that says you don't.
nitrous
11-12-2009, 05:14 PM
^ lol
Could I see an example of your progress in 4 months, AAS or non? Don't be angry.
Why would I lose any muscle I have gained if my training and diet are consistent? I haven't lost any of the size I've gained since I started working out. Are you confusing 'muscle' with 'water retention'?
dremen
11-12-2009, 05:23 PM
Could I see an example of your progress in 4 months, AAS or non? Don't be angry.
Why would I lose any muscle I have gained if my training and diet are consistent? I haven't lost any of the size I've gained since I started working out. Are you confusing 'muscle' with 'water retention'?
Dude you just chummed the water.....lol
Here comes the dredded nate shark:D
LonelyBedouin
11-12-2009, 05:28 PM
Obviously this guy its trolling... I dont see why you guys waste your time with this.
After 9 pages, and he hasnt learned that hes going to be doing more harm to himself by using gear now.
And to the OP if you gained 30lbs since started training keep doing what your doing Im sure you can get another 30lbs. Hold on to the gear for now... Your just throwin money away
Please, I don't think I have an acceptable body by any means, let me see an example of what is good progress.
As far as trolling I think I'm the one being trolled here.
I posted my full diet, full stats, and pics and the very last point they can yap about is "your genetics are too shitty for gear"
Aren't shit genetics the reason you are all injecting gorilla hormones into your balls?
natenator
11-12-2009, 05:32 PM
Could I see an example of your progress in 4 months, AAS or non? Don't be angry.
Why would I lose any muscle I have gained if my training and diet are consistent? I haven't lost any of the size I've gained since I started working out. Are you confusing 'muscle' with 'water retention'?
this just proves you ain't got a ****ing clue what you are doing.
LonelyBedouin
11-12-2009, 05:33 PM
Please, I don't think I have an acceptable body by any means, let me see an example of what is good progress.
As far as trolling I think I'm the one being trolled here.
I posted my full diet, full stats, and pics and the very last point they can yap about is "your genetics are too shitty for gear"
Aren't shit genetics the reason you are all injecting gorilla hormones into your balls?
1. http://www.canadabodybuilding.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13309
2. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZxTSy4BMqc
cch and I forget the first guy are two good examples of what can be done NATTY (hope they dont mind I use them as examples)
Shortdave
11-12-2009, 05:50 PM
http://www.canadabodybuilding.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11699&page=3
also read that whole thread.
gicantor
11-12-2009, 06:11 PM
http://www.canadabodybuilding.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11699&page=3
also read that whole thread.
^^^nice progress
That's fantastic work. I don't know how you managed to not get fat. Are you sure that's 3 months?
LonelyBedouin
11-12-2009, 07:48 PM
That's fantastic work. I don't know how you managed to not get fat. Are you sure that's 3 months?
Its hard work and dedication. And eating lots of good clean food
Shortdave
11-12-2009, 08:18 PM
That's fantastic work. I don't know how you managed to not get fat. Are you sure that's 3 months?
I did get fat, I just busted ass so hard that I didn't get TOO fat. My results aren't super typical I had been training HARD in an underfed state for a long time and once I was taught how to feed my body I blew up, and I have the stretch marks to prove it.
dremen
12-12-2009, 01:22 AM
I did get fat, I just busted ass so hard that I didn't get TOO fat. My results aren't super typical I had been training HARD in an underfed state for a long time and once I was taught how to feed my body I blew up, and I have the stretch marks to prove it.
http://www.canadabodybuilding.com/forums/showpost.php?p=272274&postcount=31
See this is what gets me. If i posted a diet like the one you used (link above) to bulk up i would get flamed off this board. I have a hard time believing you ate like that and got that big with VERY lil bodyfat in only 3 months:confused:
Either way killer job man.:a+
Ya I don't buy the time lines or stats. The progress is good though.
mersanary
12-12-2009, 01:54 AM
After 9 pages, and he hasnt learned that hes going to be doing more harm to himself by using gear now.
And to the OP if you gained 30lbs since started training keep doing what your doing Im sure you can get another 30lbs. Hold on to the gear for now... Your just throwin money away
I agree with this 100%. Too many pages full of bickering. Your a 20 year old kid. Why are u so eager to jump on drugs when you keep making good gains doing what your doing right now? Up the food intake like everyone says. You'll make even more gains :a+
:beat :dftt
Well the issue is that although I'm making gains I'd like to be eating way more than I am right now. When I pushed my diet to over 3600 calories (AT THE MOMENT) I don't gain anything but fat. My body's ability to synthesis protein is not that great.
natenator
12-12-2009, 12:06 PM
Well the issue is that although I'm making gains I'd like to be eating way more than I am right now. When I pushed my diet to over 3600 calories (AT THE MOMENT) I don't gain anything but fat. My body's ability to synthesis protein is not that great.
I find that hard to believe given you started at 117lbs. Its obvious you have a fast'ish metabolism.
Btw, no one is saying your gains that you had achieved aren't good but you've already jumped on the steroid bandwagon. What are you going to go in 2 years? How much gear are you going to need to run to keep making gains? That is the problem here and why MANY of us advocate not jumping on gear until you've tried to maximize your genetic potential naturally first.
AlladdinSane
12-12-2009, 12:13 PM
Ya I don't buy the time lines or stats. The progress is good though.
Luke Skywalker: "I... I don't believe it!"
Yoda: "That is why you fail."
Time line and stats are real. I'm the one who taught him to eat to gain. He moved from Sask to Calgary so I could train him and he jumped up 20 lbs in the first month.
I find that hard to believe given you started at 117lbs. Its obvious you have a fast'ish metabolism.
Btw, no one is saying your gains that you had achieved aren't good but you've already jumped on the steroid bandwagon. What are you going to go in 2 years? How much gear are you going to need to run to keep making gains? That is the problem here and why MANY of us advocate not jumping on gear until you've tried to maximize your genetic potential naturally first.
You would think I have a fast metabolism, but I don't. I have some pudge on my stomach and I gain fat extremely easily. My metabolism is slow and it takes me a long time to get hungry again. My low starting BW was a combination of very small bones and very short height + low levels of muscle mass.
What are you going to go in 2 years? How much gear are you going to need to run to keep making gains? That is the problem here and why MANY of us advocate not jumping on gear until you've tried to maximize your genetic potential naturally first.
Who is to say I can't keep making gains using 500 mg test enan? My long term plan is to add lbs after lbs of lean tissue to my frame until I cannot build more muscle.
'Genetic limit' refers to how much muscle you can carry on your frame at your max, not your ability to 'build max muscle without juice'.
Time line and stats are real. I'm the one who taught him to eat to gain. He moved from Sask to Calgary so I could train him and he jumped up 20 lbs in the first month.
Well you are lucky to have been training an Aryan Super God because I know for myself there is no way I could gain 20 lbs of lean muscle tissue in one month. I'm not interested in pudging myself up to the max w/ fast food and sodium.
AlladdinSane
12-12-2009, 12:49 PM
I've done roughly this plan with 5-6 guys here at my gym over the past 2-3 months. Some had VERY poor genetics.
Here's one that I introduced this site to after he joined my gym:
http://www.canadabodybuilding.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12445
LonelyBedouin
12-12-2009, 02:18 PM
I've done roughly this plan with 5-6 guys here at my gym over the past 2-3 months. Some had VERY poor genetics.
Here's one that I introduced this site to after he joined my gym:
http://www.canadabodybuilding.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12445
Id probably give my left nut to join your gym, it sounds like heaven lol...
But OP it now just sounds like your finding excuses to take the easy way out.... You say you dont feel hungry try black hole by (forget company) or one of the other many supplements to increase appetite
I can't wait until I go on , I'm going to be ****ing HUGE! :D
Bowlcut
12-12-2009, 07:24 PM
Id probably give my left nut to join your gym, it sounds like heaven lol...
But OP it now just sounds like your finding excuses to take the easy way out.... You say you dont feel hungry try black hole by (forget company) or one of the other many supplements to increase appetite
Great gym. Too bad the owner is a douche bag.
Ritch
12-12-2009, 07:47 PM
^^^ Ha!
AlladdinSane
13-12-2009, 02:11 AM
Great gym. Too bad the owner is a douche bag.
You homo!
They'll think you're serious, y'know...
Shortdave
13-12-2009, 02:29 PM
http://www.canadabodybuilding.com/forums/showpost.php?p=272274&postcount=31
See this is what gets me. If i posted a diet like the one you used (link above) to bulk up i would get flamed off this board. I have a hard time believing you ate like that and got that big with VERY lil bodyfat in only 3 months:confused:
Either way killer job man.:a+ The diet is very unconventional, but I am in no way a bodybuilder except that I do train my "guns" on occasion. I also don't measure things in lean weight, just weight. If I am up 20lbs then I know its a combination of fat, muscle, water and food that is still inside me but my total weight is up so in my eyes I am winning.
Ya I don't buy the time lines or stats. The progress is good though.
Believe me or don't, you asked for pictures I gave them whether you believe me or not doesn't matter to me in any way.
dremen
13-12-2009, 04:35 PM
The diet is very unconventional, but I am in no way a bodybuilder except that I do train my "guns" on occasion. I also don't measure things in lean weight, just weight. If I am up 20lbs then I know its a combination of fat, muscle, water and food that is still inside me but my total weight is up so in my eyes I am winning.
Well bro im unconventional as well so i know where you are coming from....lol
Good for you man and i hope i can pack on the LBM as good as you have.
Awesome works brudda:D
buildinthaskinnys
13-12-2009, 05:19 PM
The diet is very unconventional, but I am in no way a bodybuilder except that I do train my "guns" on occasion. I also don't measure things in lean weight, just weight. If I am up 20lbs then I know its a combination of fat, muscle, water and food that is still inside me but my total weight is up so in my eyes I am winning.
Believe me or don't, you asked for pictures I gave them whether you believe me or not doesn't matter to me in any way.
I would sooner prescribe a kid steroids than the diet you were consuming. If you arent diabetic its a miracle, but if you countinue eating that way theres a pretty good chance you will be before you are 30.
Shortdave
13-12-2009, 05:55 PM
I would sooner prescribe a kid steroids than the diet you were consuming. If you arent diabetic its a miracle, but if you countinue eating that way theres a pretty good chance you will be before you are 30.
Nope, no blood sugar problems at all.
You gotta realise that along with my high carbs I also take in high fat and high protein.
Bowlcut
13-12-2009, 08:05 PM
You homo!
They'll think you're serious, y'know...
Maybe I am, maybe I'm not. I think we should have a flame war on the internet to prove how tough we are to each other, and then we can make up over choc weight gainer shakes and cookies.
nitrous
14-12-2009, 01:05 PM
Maybe I am, maybe I'm not. I think we should have a flame war on the internet to prove how tough we are to each other, and then we can make up over choc weight gainer shakes and cookies.
e-penis size comparisons are a must
AlladdinSane
14-12-2009, 01:12 PM
Maybe I am, maybe I'm not. I think we should have a flame war on the internet to prove how tough we are to each other, and then we can make up over choc weight gainer shakes and cookies.
Let's skip right to the chocolate/peanut butter weight gainer shakes and cookies... leave the drama to the queens ;)
:ilu
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