3rd Time's a Charm

[kloan]

After two attempts at transforming my body composition (due to unforeseen circumstances, had to put on hold), I think 3rd time's the charm.

Step 1 - start a Keto diet (check)
Step 2 - start 2nd cycle (check)

Start Date: Oct. 8th


The plan
-----------

Week 1-8
- Test E/EQ 400mg, Tren Hex 400mg weekly

Week 8-14
- Test E/EQ 400mg, Test E 250mg, Tren Hex 400mg weekly

Week 14-16
- Test E 500mg weekly (might taper down)


Sitting at around 170lbs right now, ~14% bf, 5'7"

[kloan]

Only 10 days in, but had a kickass workout tonight. All lifts were up... could be because of my cheat meal last night (had sushi - lots of rice).

I have noticed some things such as periodic waves of 'well being' (which I never really felt my last cycle), as well as an increased libido and the occasional hot flash.

No change on the scale, but have noticed a small decrease of fat in the midsection. Have skipped a few days of cardio now, going to get back on track tomorrow.

[ironwill]

Good work, i get the wellbeing thing about 2 weeks in once things start ramping up, i get the odd hot flash when eating a lot of carbs...
Good luck on your journey and keep us posted bro....
Did you start dcing it yet??

[Talo]

After your re-feed ( cheat ) do you feel sluggish at all for a day or two ?

[kloan]

After your re-feed ( cheat ) do you feel sluggish at all for a day or two ?
Sure do.

After my first cheat meal, it took 2 days to get back into ketosis. Had to go through the headache, tired and sleepy feelings all over again.

Second cheat meal I just had this weekend went much better. Felt tired the next day, but felt great today.. lots of energy.

Overall, my energy seems to go up and down on this diet. Some days I feel better than others. I'm really looking forward to introducing carbs back into my diet and starting the DC training. I'm going to give it another 3 weeks or so before I do that.

[gsxr750]

Good luck man no doubt you can do it

[Talo]

Sure do.

After my first cheat meal, it took 2 days to get back into ketosis. Had to go through the headache, tired and sleepy feelings all over again.

Second cheat meal I just had this weekend went much better. Felt tired the next day, but felt great today.. lots of energy.

Overall, my energy seems to go up and down on this diet. Some days I feel better than others. I'm really looking forward to introducing carbs back into my diet and starting the DC training. I'm going to give it another 3 weeks or so before I do that.

Ever take B12 (inject) ? That might help with your energy levels.

[kloan]

Well, 2 weeks in now.

Strength is up, noticeably. Both bench and squats have increased. Both of which I was struggling with before.

Visible changes in definition and size. No change on the scale.

Last two nights I had very troubling dreams, waking up feeling quite restless but sleeping very deeply. Breaking out in spontaneous hot flashes/sweats at night.

So far so good!! :)

[kloan]

Strength still going up, pushed myself arms day and my left forearm is very painful now. Affected tonight's workout. Stamina is also quite diminished.. little motivation to keep going, could be related to my forearm since it's hurting through movements.

Maxed out on the weights I have for seated rows... 200lbs, way too easy now... need to pick up a couple 45lb plates asap.

Far as gear effects.. boys have shrunk about 2/3, feeling more aggressive/short fused, bit shortness of breath, BP is up a bit, more hot flashes, still sleeping deeply though.

Might have to take it easy on my arms for a week or two to let my forearm heal, or otherwise it's gonna **** up every other lift. Pretty damn frustrating because I can lift more weight than my forearms can take.

[Ritch]

Doing basic 3 day split, EOD... cardio every day
- Arms
- Shoulders, Back
- Chest, Legs


Even though you`re training eod, I gotta comment on your split. I think it stinks! The oder of the muscle groups trained will affect each workout the follows. And how do you train chest and legs together? I may not see the big picture here and maybe there is a method to your madness so can you fill me in here bro?

[kloan]

I like training bis/tris/forearms all at the same time.
Shoulders I like to train with my back because of the exercises I finish up with my shoulders (back of) also work back.
I have a disproportionately large chest, so I only do 5-6 sets of flat bench, then the rest is legs.

I'm always open to different ways of doing things though, so if you've got a better 3 day split to suggest, I'm all for trying it.

[Timbo89]

his triceps must be tired? ur using em every one of those three days.

[kloan]

not really, no...

[fathead]

your arms are your smallest muscle group and youve given them an entire day to themselves... pairing very large muscle groups on the same day... doesnt make sense

[kloan]

I'll admit, I'm still a little obsessed with getting my arms bigger. I'm self-conscious about the size of my chest in relation to everything else, so I've been focusing on my arms and shoulders a lot... less so more recently since I got the weight rack system.. but it usually takes over an hour to work my arms (actually, every day is usually 1.5hrs). I don't spend much time on my chest during the chest/legs workout, so most of my effort goes into my legs.

I have noticed results with this unconventional split. I hear what you're saying though, I am open to suggestions. If there's a better way of doing things, I'm all for it. Last thing I want to do is waste any amount of time.. the whole point is to maximize results from my effort.

[Ritch]

I'm always open to different ways of doing things though, so if you've got a better 3 day split to suggest, I'm all for trying it.

I can`t vouche for any 3 way split that`s effective. Some DC`ers may like doing stuff like chest, shoulders and tri`s, but it`s just not for me. Usually if you train chest, shoulders, tri`s another workout would be Back and biceps. Way too much to do here. Seriously, ever since I have a day for back width and one for thickness, I`m never going back to training back in one full workout. Plus you get extra bicep stimulation from this approach. Something you mention having an obsession with...

If I were you, I`d seriously consider a 4 way split. This way you have the luxury of doing 2 bodyparts per workout and have enough time for ab, lower back and calve work. That`s just something you don`t have time for when training 3 body parts in the same workout.

The only argument I can think of with a 3 way split for somebody who wants to train 4 times a week is the advantage of training the body parts again later on in the week. To me it`s not an advantage as I know the bodyparts haven`t recovered yet. So it comes down to personal preference I guess and how you like to go at it...

What do you think?

[tiramisu]

You aren't going to make your arms bigger by overtraining them.

At 170, starting strength or 5x5 makes a heck of lot more sense than whatever it is you are trying to do.

You need to build your workout around big compounds. Squat, Deadlift, Powerclean, Bench. You can probably skip direct arm work altogether for the next year for all that matters.


You really need to rethink your programming. You almost assuredly need to be working on some kind of linear program, and 3 days a week rather than any kind of advanced split. Just about any advanced split is LESS productive than a 3 day a week program. The reason for advanced splits is that once you are advanced to elite your ability to recover from a workout is not as easy as when you are a novice to intermediate lifter.

You are a NOVICE lifter. This means that you can gain lots of strength and size most effectively on a 3 day a week, Bill Starr type 5x5 (or madcow) or Rippetoes Starting Strength. You are robbing yourself by pissing about with accessory exercises and useless volume.

Number one in your mind needs to be increasing the weight on the big exercises pretty much every workout for the next 12-16 weeks (plus or minus a few resets).

[kloan]

Ok, I'm open to trying a new routine. Can you recommend some links for reading up on the Bill Starr 5x5 or Rippetoes Starting Strength?

Considering the amount of effort that goes into my workouts, I don't want to be wasting it... if these are better suited for me, I wanna get started on it asap.

I really prefer to stick with something I can do EOD.. I tried a 4 day split earlier in the year, and I got burnt out really quick. Unless I was doing too much in the workouts. The every other day thing seems to work well for me.

[Ritch]

You can probably skip direct arm work altogether for the next year for all that matters.




Strongly disagree here. Kloan, if you`re looking to like a bodybuilder, I`d recommend you train like one. I`m not shitting on the bill star program, but look at it this way... Take 2 guys and have them train. One with the Bill star programm the other with a bodybuilder split. Both will gain strength and size, that`s a given, but which one do you think will have the most aesthetic looking physique? Which will look the best with his shirt off? The one who follows the split for sure.

Take the path that suits what you wanna look like...

[waderow]

big shoulders, big arms, big back, big legs, big chest

they all get their own day for me

[kloan]

Strongly disagree here. Kloan, if you`re looking to like a bodybuilder, I`d recommend you train like one. I`m not shitting on the bill star program, but look at it this way... Take 2 guys and have them train. One with the Bill star programm the other with a bodybuilder split. Both will gain strength and size, that`s a given, but which one do you think will have the most aesthetic looking physique? Which will look the best with his shirt off? The one who follows the split for sure.

Take the path that suits what you wanna look like...

Oh I didn't realize they were geared towards powerlifting. Of course I want to look like a bodybuilder. I've said it before, I don't give a shit about numbers.. only in that they show me I've made progress. But the most important thing for me is how I look. Vain? Sure. But to me that's the whole point of spending all this time and energy lifting weights... to look good! (and feel good)... I mean, obviously I want to be strong too.. but they can go hand in hand. So ya, I want to make the most of my time and efforts and look good for doing so.

This 3 day split has been working for me, I've been making good progress since I started it a few months ago, however I can try to start a 4 day split again and see if I can do it without burning myself out.

Any recommendations for a 4 day split?

Also, what's a good exercise for hamstrings when all I have to work with is the squat rack, olympic straight bar, and Powerblocks?

Btw, when I was younger I didn't know any better and used to work body parts 3 times a week.. always recovered and always grew fast. Can't do that anymore, but 2 days/week I can handle no problem. I'm thinking DC is going to be good for me once I start eating carbs again in another couple weeks.

[Ritch]

My fav 4 way splits are:

shoulders/biceps/abs/lower back
legs/calves
off
chest/trieps/abs
Back/abs/lower back
off
off

or

Back width/shoulders/ lower back and abs
Legs/calves
Off
Back thickness/chest/abs (since you mention you have a strong chest this would be great for you)
Biceps/triceps/ lower back and abs
off
off

or
Chest/shoulders/abs/lower back
Legs/calves
off
Back/abs
Arms/abs/lower back
off
off

[tiramisu]

Obviously I disagree...

and my reasoning is this. You aren't going to look like a bodybuilder till you've added well over 50 pounds of muscle to your frame. The fastest way is using a novice strength program not an advanced bodybuilding program.

Once you are 230-250 at your height a split routine will allow you the extra time to recover and the ability to emphasize training any specific weaknesses to become a bodybuilding.

[kloan]

Ok, but I never want to be that heavy. I honestly think that's too much for my height. Maybe we're thinking about two different things.. I'm not going for the pro look. Take Baza for example.. He looks great, and to me looks like a bodybuilder. For being 5'6", I think somewhere around 190 at around 10%bf is a good weight for me. I'd look built/jacked, but not massive like a pro.

[waderow]

Ok, but I never want to be that heavy. I honestly think that's too much for my height. Maybe we're thinking about two different things.. I'm not going for the pro look. Take Baza for example.. He looks great, and to me looks like a bodybuilder. For being 5'6", I think somewhere around 190 at around 10%bf is a good weight for me. I'd look built/jacked, but not massive like a pro.

its not hard to get that big.... its hard to get that cut

[JacktheThriller]

i wouldnt worry about getting too big, i tell this to my gf, it not as if u goto bed at 160 pds and wakeup with 10pds of extra muscle, just focus on getting larger and you will naturally taper off when u r satisfied

[Ritch]

Obviously I disagree...

and my reasoning is this. You aren't going to look like a bodybuilder till you've added well over 50 pounds of muscle to your frame. The fastest way is using a novice strength program not an advanced bodybuilding program.

Once you are 230-250 at your height a split routine will allow you the extra time to recover and the ability to emphasize training any specific weaknesses to become a bodybuilding.

Before you say that, ask yourself one question. How were and are today`s most impressive physiques built. Using a split or a 5X5 routine? The answer is the split. You can`t deny the superiority of the bodybuilding split. The 5x5system should however be used as it`s a good system. I`d use it once a year for a change.

Even if it were the best answer, good luck convincing some novice that he won`t be training arms...

[tiramisu]

The one advantage of being old, possibly the only one, is that I have made an almost infinite number of mistakes. A 4 day split is an advanced routine for an advanced lifter. The programming is designed to allow for longer recovery times and specific body part work. This is suitable for athletes whose strength does not allow them to recover quickly and who have already developed an advanced physique.

Novice weight trainers are ready to hit the weights every second day. They can squat 3 times a week and deadlift once a week without over training. Advanced athletes can not. When you combine squatting 3 times a week, deadlifting once a week in a close to full body workout and mix in your benching, overhead lifts and power cleans you can put on far more muscle as a novice then you can using a 4 day split.

Once you have progressed to a mid-level intermediate lifter then it's time to make a choice between the bodybuilder splits and the 5-3-1/westsides.


Using a 4 day split as a young energetic man I got from 175-186 as I remember during a period of about 18 months with not much in the way of strength increase.
Using starting strength as a 40 plus'er I went from 200-210 @ 5' 9" but I added slightly about 35 pounds of muscle (20% BF -> ~10%) in about 16 months
I'm getting close to hitting 315/405/495 @ 225-13% on my bench/squat/dead which are huge PR's for me but have progressed from SS, 5x5 to DC.

I wish I had known about these approached when I was in my teens and 20's. It is so much more productive than volume and big splits.

[Ritch]

What you say about beginners is the absolute truth about them being able to hit bodyparts more often. But I believe Kloan is passed that point. A similar question was once asked to Charles Glass to when a beginner if ready to move onto a split from such a routine, maybe I`ll find that answer as I re-read old articles on the crapper over the next few days. Seems to me it was less than a year however. But having a beginner train back 2-3 times a week does seem like a winning proposition.

[tiramisu]

Kloan is 170 @ 16%. He is not an intermediate strength athlete.

[Ritch]

Kloan is 170 @ 16%. He is not an intermediate strength athlete.

Touché. I thought Kloan was bigger (sorry bro) Well if he`s been training for over 2 years I`m gonna have to say I can`t seem him squating 3 times a week. Surely he can put enough intensity into his workouts to train each bodypart once a week.

[tiramisu]

Here's some strength standards that rippetoe,starr and company would agree on.

http://push-hard.blogspot.com/2009/10/basic-strength-standards-for-adult-men.html

I found starting strength started to cause overtraining as I got to intermediate levels.
5x5 was really good for intermediate, I never did try texas method as I jumped to DC.

[Ritch]

Yé, I`m advanced!

[tiramisu]

I'm half way between intermediate and advanced but DC has me beating the log book and putting up PR'S like crazy. I should probably be doing a texas method or a 5x5 but I'm really enjoying DC.

[Ritch]

I'm half way between intermediate and advanced but DC has me beating the log book and putting up PR'S like crazy. I should probably be doing a texas method or a 5x5 but I'm really enjoying DC.

I`ve just started DC as well. A modified version of course. **** me, my cycle is over an I`ve gained 3 pounds this week! The pump from those rest pause sets are intense. My ****ing calves were rock hard stiff. I`m looking forward to see where this is going to go.

Kloan bro... I have no clue now what to tell you. Some of the points Tiramisu made were pretty good. Hopefully some others will chime in to help out here. But if you`ve done 4 way splits and have overtrained I`m thinking you know how to train hard and would still lean on the idea of doing a split. Based on that argument Tiramisu, what do you think?

[waderow]

i think the moral of the story is .... do what works best for you Kloan

[tiramisu]

:) .... Waderow shoots.... Waderow scores.

[Ritch]

i think the moral of the story is .... do what works best for you Kloan

It always is, but he`s not sure that`s why he`s asking!

[kloan]

Kloan is 170 @ 16%. He is not an intermediate strength athlete.

Not to be a stickler for details, but I said 14%, I know it's just a guess.. but I have leaned out and still maintained my weight since I started my diet.... and no, I can't work the same body parts 3 times a week any more. That's why I changed my routine.. recovery wasn't the same as it used to be when I trained the same body parts 3 times a week. I can probably still handle twice a week.


It always is, but he`s not sure that`s why he`s asking!

Well actually I was asking because I was getting flack for my routine.. so I wanted to know if there was something better I should be doing.

Honestly, it's been working well for me. I'm not attached, and I know when it's time for change I'm gonna start DC so I think for now I'll just stick with what I'm doing, since it's working, and go from there when the time is right. I am looking forward to DC.. and maybe I'll try a 5x5 after that.

After all, it's only week 3 in this run and it's going to be 16 weeks.

According to that site I'm between novice and intermediate.. some lifts are novice (such as new lifts for me like dead, squat, etc) and intermediate-advance (bench).

[Ritch]

^^^ As I always say, the truth is in the middle. One guy was saying once a week, the other 3 times...

But it kills me to say this kloan... You`re on steroids now and shouldn`t be. When you do this, you should be pretty confident that what you`re doing in the gym is perfect for you and you don`t know that yet.

[kloan]

^^^ As I always say, the truth is in the middle. One guy was saying once a week, the other 3 times...

But it kills me to say this kloan... You`re on steroids now and shouldn`t be. When you do this, you should be pretty confident that what you`re doing in the gym is perfect for you and you don`t know that yet.
Well I was until you guys started questioning it... maybe I should just trust my own instincts and tell you guys to piss off next time you question me? :P

I wouldn't have started this cycle unless I was sure I had things 'dialed in', and I am confident in saying I do.

[kloan]

Really annoyed and irritated today... workout sucked... every song got on my nerves and was distracting (more so than usual).... didn't lift as much either compared to last shoulder/back day. Aches and pains in joints, starting to wonder if this 'var' is actually winny...

Think I'm done with keto for the time being. It's been a number of weeks now, and I'm really not making much progress anymore.. I have gotten some more definition and burned of some fat in the mid section, but it seems to have stalled and I've had enough of it for a while.. might pick it back up towards the end of my cycle.

Going to start a high protein, moderate carbs, low fat diet now.

Up 3lbs with no change in bf.

[kloan]

what an intense surge of raw emotions.... guess thats what they mean by tren rage.

dropped my rare out of production cant be bought anymore expensive Prada sunglasses today.. fell of my head and got scratched up really bad.

haven't been that pissed in a loooooong time. lasted a good couple hours... good thing im eating carbs again cuz it puts me down like a tranq.

[Ritch]

Gonna go ahead and be a smart ass here, don`t hate for it, but looks like the third time wasen`t such a charm after all...

I`ll delete this post if you want as I find it`s pushing some boundaries but the temporary posting of it satisfies my what`s left of damaged neurons...

[kloan]

why are you being an ass? im not done, i havent given up ive just stopped the keto diet and am trying a different approach.

stop crapping in my thread.

[Ritch]

why are you being an ass? im not done, i havent given up ive just stopped the keto diet and am trying a different approach.

stop crapping in my thread.

First off, I before that post I was giving you some constructive advice. Advice of which I still think I`m correct for having said.

The last post could do 1 of 2 things. Make you realize the diet`s not for you, or get back on the horse with a vengance...

But if all that is looked upon as craping in your thread, then you`re wish is granted. I`m out of your hair bro. Good luck with you cycle and training.

[L3]

K, be careful with the tren bro. it ****ed with my head hardcore, even though i was taking antidepressants with it.

my thoughts, drop the "var" for now, the tren is more than enough for strenght gains. once you decide you've had enough ****ed up emotions and drop the tren, reintroduce the var.
it will save you some money, cause right now, IMO , the var aint doing dick all for you, being such a mild compound.

[JacktheThriller]

i think u should take a lil break than get back on the keto bud, stick to your guns, no diet will work for u if ur switching up everytime ur unsatisfied, BUCK UP

after this run i would re-evaluate things, u seem to be playing catch up with training theory and its essential you find one that will work for u.

pick a program and know it down pat, run it clean and see if u gain, u may be happy with natural gains, your quick to jump on the juice wagon, but u need more essentials bud work with one of the vets on this board, dont be mad at ritch its his MO to be a ass lol but he can help you a lot, i wouldnt shun his knowledge away

[kloan]

K, be careful with the tren bro. it ****ed with my head hardcore, even though i was taking antidepressants with it.

my thoughts, drop the "var" for now, the tren is more than enough for strenght gains. once you decide you've had enough ****ed up emotions and drop the tren, reintroduce the var.
it will save you some money, cause right now, IMO , the var aint doing dick all for you, being such a mild compound.

I was wondering if I should drop the var.... so ok I'll drop it. I was thinking it'd probably be better to take when I drop down to 250mg/wk test only for a short cruise before I come off.


i think u should take a lil break than get back on the keto bud, stick to your guns, no diet will work for u if ur switching up everytime ur unsatisfied, BUCK UP
yeah im probably going to start it back up in a couple months while i still have the support of test/var. for now i want to take advantage of the compounds im running and eat properly to make some decent gains.

[waderow]

you will still need some fat. dont go too low.

not sure what your target for calories is, but with the compounds youre running, I would hope youre shooting for 4000ish. 15% of that should be fat

[kloan]

I haven't eliminated fats completely.. still taking fish oil, EFAs, olive oil/udo's 3-6-9, some fats from cheeses, etc. I'm slowly increasing my calories to gauge how much I can tolerate before I start gaining fat again.

Last cycle I was consuming around 2800-3000 calories and gained a fair amount of fat. Most of those calories were from protein and carbs.

[waderow]

I haven't eliminated fats completely.. still taking EFAs, olive oil/udo's 3-6-9, some fats from cheeses, etc. I'm slowly increasing my calories to gauge how much I can tolerate before I start gaining fat again.

Last cycle I was consuming around 2800-3000 calories and gained a fair amount of fat. Most of those calories were from protein and carbs.

more food is better with tren

[kloan]

more food is better with tren

ok, good to know... i know my appetite has increased quite a bit, probably the EQ as well... thats another reason i had to stop the keto diet.. just way too hungry, carb cravings got too hard to control.. lol.

[Drummer]

hey Kloan... thought id chime in here.

If you want to build your arms, you build them around a simple compound routine. I have a hard time with arms, so Im familiar with this. The most simple 3 day split is the classic back/bi's, chest/tri's/shoulders, legs. Very basic, heavy compounds, followed by any iso's at the end of your workout. All compounds done to fail in less than 8 reps. Hit 8, weight goes up. 2 sets each compound. Warm up target parts before lifting heavy, then no more warmups. You can train abs after every workout for a few minutes. For example :

Monday : Incline Smith, wide dips, flat bar bench for chest. Dumbell Military press for shoulders. Side laterals, maybe some reverse flies for shoulders. Now kill your tri's with some skull crushers, extensions or some cable work. I like to also toss in some close grip dips for tri's, maybe close grip bench. or some cable work for chest.

Wednesday : Bar Squats, leg presses/hack squats. Straight leg deads for the hams (sometimes curls if the lower back is sore). Seated calf raises. Mix in some standing. I like to do a couple sets each of inner/outter thigh at the end. You can move shoulders to this day, and hit them a little harder.

Friday : Deadlifts, Chin ups, close grip cable rows, shrugs. You can throw in some wide rows too, for the rear delts. Heavy and hard, and these basics should pack on size. For bi's : preacher ez curls, reverse or hammer curls, and straight bar standing curls. This bi routine really helped me hit the biceps, brachialis and brachioradialis for over size.

All of your compounds should be heavy and fail before 8. Have someone there to help lift that failure rep. All your iso's should be controlled and slow, dont use momentum. You can cheat out a rep at the end.

This is a simple, age old routine for building raw mass. Worry about sculpting later!

Just MHO, cause it works for me. I hit 218 at 5-8 easily with this.

~D~

[Drummer]

Oh yea... this is all considering your rest and eating are all in check. Eat good solid foods like a horse and only use supplements to supplement!

~D~

[waderow]

^^^ good post

[kloan]

Thanks Drummer.

----

Taking time off until next Tuesday. Had shit form I guess with squats (or might have been the bulgarian split squats). Pulled a muscle in my right leg. If I twist it at all when I walk, it hurts like hell. Gonna chill for a week and hopefully it'll heal in that time. Then will start that 3 day split.

I'll have to figure out some alternatives to the exercises I don't have the equipment for. I have a bench, squat rack, cable pulley, chin up bar and Powerblocks.

[Drummer]

Thanks Drummer.

----

Taking time off until next Tuesday. Had shit form I guess with squats (or might have been the bulgarian split squats). Pulled a muscle in my right leg. If I twist it at all when I walk, it hurts like hell. Gonna chill for a week and hopefully it'll heal in that time. Then will start that 3 day split.

I'll have to figure out some alternatives to the exercises I don't have the equipment for. I have a bench, squat rack, cable pulley, chin up bar and Powerblocks.

Hey Kloan -

Im betting you are falling victim to the appeal of all that extra power. If you dont take it slower, you will keep injuring yourself. Slow down on increasing the weight. Make sure you are very comfortable with the previous weight. Even if you feel like the hulk, your connective tissue, cns etc are going to be strained. Take it a bit slower, be very deliberate with your motions on all your exercises, and you can reap all the growth from the AAS while avoiding injury, which sidelines you while on - a huge pissoff.

~D~

[kloan]

Yeah, absolutely. I didn't think I was pushing myself too hard though. It was only a 5lb increment from the last workout.. which is what most guys seem to recommend for increasing weight. But I hear ya, I will try to remember to be patient with the weight... and **** me I need to be more diligent with my form.. I get all hyped up from the stims in my pre-workout drink and get too anxious to finish each rep instead of taking my time making sure I maintain strict form. With this injury, I somehow placed too much of the load on the upper part of my leg, right near my groin, and that's such a small muscle there, it couldn't handle the load.

I have to be careful... this is exactly the same way I tore a muscle in my neck, and that really ****ing hurt. Had to take 2 weeks off of lifting before I could do anything.. could barely move my head without excruciating pain.

I'm going to stay with the weight it is right now and focus on strict form before I add any more plates to the bar to avoid more serious injury. I'm still new to squats so I can't rush it, despite feeling like I want more plates on there.

[Drummer]

Increasing 5lbs on a squat is not much... on bi's it is etc. However, if the starting weight is too heavy to begin with (sqatting 315 when you should be doing 275) then the 5lb increment is worthless.

I get all riled up while on too - and get careless lifting. Your right on the money there - gotta keep your head cause one bad lift can do it! Just ask my left center delt from last week. It will tell you "hey asshole, why did you go so heavy on those side laterals? Huh??? HUH?? I bet your sorry now you bastard! Now your out for a week!". Lol

Ironwills advice on going LIGHT with squats, ATG, chest OUT shoulders BACK and thrust them hips forward is paying off for me. I dropped back down to 225 just to start over and rebuild! I was routinely doing 315 and up in my sets.


~D~

[kloan]

Holy **** I feel weird!!

I was in the shower, suddenly got very very hungry... so hungry I started rushing, got anxious and got out of the shower as quick as I could to track down an ice cream bar from the freezer.. almost in a panicked state.

When I got to the freezer, I was shaky, couldn't grip things properly, felt dizzy and jittery.

It's been 30 mins or so since that happened, and I still feel very weird. When I get up, I'm slightly dizzy, can't focus my eyes properly, jilted movements (like MS), waves of anxiety and hot flashes.

Are these typical sides of tren?? lol... Part of me hopes they are, so at least I can try to relax and hope it passes.... otherwise, I'm kinda worried I don't know WTF is going on. Sitting here in my chair I feel somewhat manageable... as long as I don't get up, but my head feels very droopy.

I took my BP, and it's elevated at 150/79 with 68 bpm (normal for me). A few days ago it was 140/80.

I just chowed down a huge helping of mixed nuts and fruit with a chunk of cheese, now about to have a cup of stress reliever tea with kava kava... hoping it'll help. Also taking a couple doses of Oscillococcinum (homeopathic flu remedy) as a precaution.

Feeling a bit paranoid at the moment.. don't quite want to go to sleep just yet. God dammit that foghorn is frickin loud!!!!!! Christ why don't they shut up with that thing..... agghhh.

[kloan]

Feel better today (aside from some mild dizziness), whatever it was I slept it off.

[GYMBRAT]

get that a lot if I dont eat when I should, it's almost like being diabetic....weird ass shit I know. I even had my wife (a nurse) do an insulin check once when it happed and my blood sugars were normal so I don't know!

[Drummer]

Those are not good sides. Tren can play with you, but the dizziness and light head is not good. Tren causes anxiety, restlessness etc. Sounds like you had a little panic attack from the new sensations. The most important thing is to try to relax, not panic, and see how the symtoms play out. Almost sounded like your blood sugar was out of whack, and your not on slin. If it does not pass, I would consider stopping the tren, or cutting the dose in half. You need VERY little tren to be effective. Even 200mg a week or less.

I dont mess with almost passing out. I take that seriously. The anxiety can be compounded by the EQ, which is also known to cause it.

~D~

[kloan]

Severe low blood sugar is exactly what it felt like... it came on so suddenly, it caught me off guard. Strange thing is I had just eaten 1/2 can of tuna with 1/2 cup of cottage cheese like 45 mins prior.

Today my head still feels strange.. kinda dizzy and droopy. I dunno.... gonna tough it out for now and see if it clears up.

[GYMBRAT]

Those are not good sides. Tren can play with you, but the dizziness and light head is not good. Tren causes anxiety, restlessness etc. Sounds like you had a little panic attack from the new sensations. The most important thing is to try to relax, not panic, and see how the symtoms play out. Almost sounded like your blood sugar was out of whack, and your not on slin. If it does not pass, I would consider stopping the tren, or cutting the dose in half. You need VERY little tren to be effective. Even 200mg a week or less.

I dont mess with almost passing out. I take that seriously. The anxiety can be compounded by the EQ, which is also known to cause it.

~D~

I know that reaction for me had 0 to do with tren nor eq, as I was getting that feeling for yrs even off cycle, and it does have to do with blood sugar, being outa whack fore sure........thats why a person just almost ALWAYS keep some type of food, snack on them.

....bad diet is what causes Diabetes ;)

[L3]

I had just eaten 1/2 can of tuna with 1/2 cup of cottage cheese like 45 mins prior.

you only had trace carbs, which could explain why you went into the mild shock

i get if i wait too long with my first FULL meal after my workout

[GYMBRAT]

very true ^^

[kloan]

Great work out tonight... aside from tweeking my lower back doing deadlifts (I really should invest in a few private training sessions).

Strength is definitely up. After bench, deads, did some tri's and still had energy so did a few sets of bi's and strength was way up... hammer curls were up to 45lb DBs... up 10lb each side from a few months ago.

Finished off with some chinups and pullups. Back is really starting to hurt now.... :(

EDIT: crap... pain is so bad i feel sick. every time i get up from the chair to walk or adjust my position in my chair the pain is excruciating. this sucks.

[kloan]

Well holy crap my back is almost 'g2g'.... :p
I'd say it's about 85-90% better. Quickest recovery yet!

All good for tonight's workout, though I will be taking it easy to avoid re-injury.

Gonna be legs, back and shoulders tonight.

[kloan]

general complaints post...

shoulder hurts, back hurts, havent worked my legs in two weeks because of a muscle pull. ass hurts from my last shot. having doubts about the dose of this tren. feel like crap today so no workout. gaining fat when i should be shedding, seriously wtf!! im eating really well and not even that many calories yet for my height/weight. stupid ****ing bullshit is making me very frustrated. treadmill is ****ing up so havent done cardio in two weeks, so i have to figure out how i can fix it.

BLAH.

[Ritch]

Holy shit Kloan, it sucks to hear that...

[buildinthaskinnys]

Holy shit Kloan, it sucks to hear that...

I thought you bounced?

[Ritch]

I thought you bounced?

You refering to when I said I wouldn`t come back in his log? Well one thing for sure, I`ll keep my opinions to myself... If I see one of our fellow bro`s is down on his luck, for sure I`ll send Karma their way.

Besides any hostility between Kloan and I over that time was quickly settled in other threads I believe.

[kloan]

I didn't mean to come off hostile.. it just annoyed me when you were questioning my decision to start another cycle. That's the last thing I like to hear/read when I'm already in it..... if ya know what I mean. :)

This log really isn't much of a log anymore anyway... more of some kind of sloppy journal with random thoughts and comments. But it'll still allow me to look back and see what I experienced at what intervals, etc... and that's all I really want from it.

[kloan]

So did squats last night, went well... improved my form so that I didn't put any load on the area that pulled before, worked well and lifted almost same weight as before.

I dunno how I got so distracted, but I accidentally worked out for over 2 hours. Really feeling it today.. feeling very wiped out. Gotta be sure to never do that again or I'm gonna regret it I'm sure.

Eating a lot of food, barely putting on the weight. I'm quite baffled at this point. It seems the weight/strength I've gained up til this point is more likely related to eating carbs again after the keto diet.

Currently at 175lbs. Have filled out a bit, strength has gone up somewhat.. but also getting a thicker layer of fat on my midsection again so I'm afraid to eat any more than I already am. 6 weeks in I was expecting more. At this point I can't help but start to question the gear. With everything people say about Tren, I'm doubting I'm experiencing similar results... yet? I dunno....

[Drummer]

Sry man, im kinda feeling like I saw some of this coming... the injuries and all that

~D

[kloan]

I dunno why.. I've been training for 1.5 years injury free. It doesn't seem like I'm pushing myself to hard either. Like I said it's mostly due to bad form from being new to certain lifts. The shoulder thing has been plaguing me for years..

I'm not sure what you're implying, but I'd rather you just come out and say what you're thinking and/or why instead of just saying you saw this coming.

Anyway, I felt wrecked yesterday and was feeling generally negative when I posted that. Feeling better today and more optimistic.

[kloan]

Sick... what a difference not drinking the pre-workout supplement makes. Holy hell I felt like puking and/or passing out barely 1/2 hour into it.... this is gonna take some getting used to!

Cut back amount of sets and reps this workout, taking the advice from the helpful posts in another thread. Tried to limit rests between sets to 30-60 seconds, which was extremely difficult considering how winded I felt tonight. I'm sure I'll adjust and it'll get better.

Tonight was Legs/Back/Shoulders.

My left shoulder is still really hurting, so I had difficulty finding an accessory exercise to supplement military press. Will have to do some research to see what I can pair with it.

I was thinking that since I'm working muscle groups every 4 days, that I can come up with 2 accessory exercises to alternate with, doing Workout 1A, 1B, etc.

Squats - 1x warmup set, 5 x 5
Lunges - 3 x 8
Seated Rows (handles) - 1x warmup set, 3 x 8
Seated Rows (close overhand grip) - 3 x 10
Lat Pull Down - 1x warmup, 6, 8, 10, 12
Standing Military Press - 1x warmup set, 5 x 5
Lateral Raises - 2 x 10
Shrugs - 3 x 5 (<-need wrist straps for higher reps)

Total time: 1:25 hrs

[natenator]

dude, why don't you go to a traditional split and train 1 bodypart once a week?

If you can hit each bodypart more than once and not doing it on pro style calories then you seriously aren't working the muscle hard enough when you train.

Training hard is not the same as training smart.

[kloan]

dude, why don't you go to a traditional split and train 1 bodypart once a week?

If you can hit each bodypart more than once and not doing it on pro style calories then you seriously aren't working the muscle hard enough when you train.

Training hard is not the same as training smart.
I tried it that way, it felt like I could work out my muscle groups more often so I wanted to try something that allows me to train them twice a week.

I don't quite follow your point about pro style calories, not working my muscle hard enough, etc. What do you consider working the muscle hard enough? I lift to failure.. keep strict form, progress in weights each week, etc. What do you consider 'pro calories'? Isn't my recovery going to be better anyway because of the gear? Once this cycle is done, I probably will go back to the traditional.

Maybe I should just stick to my original plan and start DC already.

[natenator]

When I train chest, it's sore for a few days
When I train shoulders, they are sore for a few days
When I train legs, they are sore for a week.

I kill myself in my training to the point where I cannot train the same muscle group multiple times in a week UNLESS I am eating massive amounts of calories to support training multiple body parts and even then it's suspect. I've done it and it kills me over a 4-6 week period.

Pro style calories = 5000, 6000+ clean calories

I guess I just don't understand if you are going balls out, training to complete muscle failure as you say you are then how are you able to train the same bodypart a few days later? Gear or not.

[kloan]

I don't either man... I lift as heavy as I can, I'm grunting, shouting, distorting my face.. struggling to get the last few reps done.... any heavier and my form would suffer.... yet I don't feel sore for more than a day or two... recently, I'm only a little sore the next day even though I'm doing more than usual.... this is why my workouts keep getting longer, because I keep doing more trying to exhaust my muscles as much as I can... that's the whole point right? Yet I don't get that post-workout soreness anymore.

****ed if I know why..... if high volume doesn't do it for me anymore, then perhaps lower volume higher intensity will?

What's the normal rep range for high intensity, 3-5?

One point I want to make though, if you muscles are only sore for a few days, then working them every 4 days would work then, wouldn't it? Or are they still recovering, even though they're no longer sore?

Aside from all this confusion, I'm still getting bigger.

[faller]

Aside from all this confusion, I'm still getting bigger.

So whats the problem??

I'm never "sore" anymore, unless i've just come off a rest week. If your poundages are going up and your weight is going up, what does it matter if you're sore or not?

[kloan]

So whats the problem??

I'm never "sore" anymore, unless i've just come off a rest week. If your poundages are going up and your weight is going up, what does it matter if you're sore or not?
I dunno.. Nate mentioned it first questioning how I could possibly work my muscles twice a week without busting ass every work out (which I do).

I'm only 5'6" and have a very small frame. Whenever I try to push myself too hard by increasing weights to the point where I can only do 3 or so reps, that's when I injure myself.. I don't know why, but my body doesn't seem to be able to handle that kind of intensity -> which is why I've always done high volume.

I used to think soreness was an indication of a good workout, but in the past the soreness went away after a few months of getting back into it (I stopped a lot over the years unfortunately).

I'm my own worst critic, so I end up questioning everything I do wondering if I can do it better, especially when I post what I'm doing and people jump on it, it makes me question myself even more.

I think I'm just gonna keep things to myself from this point on. I'll keep writing in my notebook, keep reading up on stuff, and when I need help I'll just PM a few key members.

[Talo]

Whenever I try to push myself too hard by increasing weights to the point where I can only do 3 or so reps, that's when I injure myself.. I don't know why, but my body doesn't seem to be able to handle that kind of intensity -> which is why I've always done high volume.


I'm the opposite. Ever since I've gone low rep everything feels great and when I did more of a bb style training i was getting injured more.

I don't get very sore either and my numbers are still climbing. I think I owe a lot of that to proper stretching and foam rolling.

[faller]

Ya it could definitely get confuseing when you get a bunch of opinions.... I've always had an absolutely terrible bench, and i've been doing this for 35 years. My goal now is to get that 3 plate bench and what i've been doing is PMing a member on here, its a lot less confuseing haveing just one guy coach you through it.

Find the member you trust the most to give you solid advise and go with that. At least that way you won't be second guessing yourself all the time..

[JacktheThriller]

Kloan u are so indecisive and u need to get on a lifting program and stick with it for 12 weeks and then evaluate, bouncing around between well maybe il do high volume or high intensity or DC pick one follow it to the letter. All the manuels on training can be found through this site or by google, FOR FREE. Get on a program get some gains!

[kloan]

i settled on something.... im not gonna post it but i like it.

skipped tonight's workout, pain in shoulder was just too much to deal with.. i really dont know what the **** is going on or why its getting worse when ive actually stopped benching and limited shoulder exercises.

started doing the broomstick exercise, so im praying to god it works.. this is really not the time i need this kind of shit happening.. right when things are starting to peak.

gonna keep my head high, try to stay positive! only way it'll get better.... full time job taming the demons this tren stuff unleashes though, holy cow.

[kloan]

well crap on a plate it was the bed causing me grief..... i put the memory foam mattress topper on my bed last night and all the aches and pains ive been waking up with were completely gone, in one night!! my shoulder still hurts a bit, but not as much as yesterday... gonna continue the broomstick exercise and i think i should be ok in another week or so hopefully.

[JacktheThriller]

good bed is key i recently bought a 2000 dollar mattress, great investment. no pain

[kloan]

Haven't worked out since the 7th. Neck and shoulder still hurt. Neck is getting better though.... really f'in slow to recover. Getting VERY frustrated and anxious to lift again.... I feel like useless sack of meat right now with nothing else to occupy my time.. and man what a waste of a perfectly opportune time to be lifting (at week 10 now). :(

[Talo]

Are you doing anything to help you recover ?

ART , Massage , Chiro , foam roalling , band work , etc...

[kloan]

I gave up on the chiro and I've just been sitting around a lot.

Can you recommend things I can do at home? Never done foam rolling or band work.. are either of those helpful with neck injuries?

[Talo]

Foam rolling helps everything , however when it comes to smaller things like the neck , shoulders , pecs . I like to use a tenis ball ( some use squash balls or whatever ) differnt material will be more or less dense , so it's a personal choice .

I think when it comes to your neck massage is the best thing to have done . Atleast once a week for the first bit.

[JacktheThriller]

do u stretch regularily kloan, you may want to do the basic neck work with a towel

[kloan]

Couldn't take it anymore.. did a workout tonight.

Actually went really well. Took it a bit easy, since I've been out for almost 2 weeks, I decided to hit every body part, but only did one exercise each (except bis n tris). Warm up set, then 4 sets of 6-8.

I did:
Squats, Seated Rows, Standing Military Press, Close Grip Bench, Pull Downs, DB Curls, Hammer Curls. Took approx. 1hr 15 mins.

Lifted a bit lighter, but was feeling quite knocked out/winded very early into the workout. I was surprised even lifting 10-20lbs lighter I had a tough time with some of the exercises. Oh well, I'll get caught up soon enough. I think the Tren might be knocking my stamina down a few pegs.

Overall, it felt good and I didn't re-injure. Stuck an icepack on my neck right after the workout, layed down on the floor with a rolled up towel behind my neck, for 20 mins. Then had a hot shower. Neck feels better than it did before the workout. Shoulder on the other hand was still giving me problems... will have to pick up the broomstick again.

Gonna start up my regular routine on Monday.
..

[JacktheThriller]

keep your reps under full control when ur shoulder is in play, u dont want to destroy that, take 4 secs per rep and be safe

[kloan]

yeah absolutely, ive been using very strict form and lowered the weight so i can make sure my shoulders stay in place.. its when they start kickin in to help with the reps that the left hurts.. so ive cut out some shoulder exercises as well as dropping the weight a bit and using very strict form.

neck hurts again today. its been pretty consistent now... by the time i go to bed there's virtually no pain, but when i wake up it hurts again. ive tried different sleep positions, pillows... nothing's helping yet.

i hope that ultrasound thing is effective...

feel like shit today. layed awake til 9-frickin-am... couldnt sleep AT ALL.... then finally fell asleep and slept til 1pm... then went back to sleep until 4pm. ****ing sucked.

[buildinthaskinnys]

yeah absolutely, ive been using very strict form and lowered the weight so i can make sure my shoulders stay in place.. its when they start kickin in to help with the reps that the left hurts.. so ive cut out some shoulder exercises as well as dropping the weight a bit and using very strict form.

neck hurts again today. its been pretty consistent now... by the time i go to bed there's virtually no pain, but when i wake up it hurts again. ive tried different sleep positions, pillows... nothing's helping yet.

i hope that ultrasound thing is effective...

feel like shit today. layed awake til 9-frickin-am... couldnt sleep AT ALL.... then finally fell asleep and slept til 1pm... then went back to sleep until 4pm. ****ing sucked.

You should get a part time job or sumthin dude, it'd make yuh feel better.

[kloan]

You should get a part time job or sumthin dude, it'd make yuh feel better.

i think you're right.

[kloan]

captain's log... start date jesus's birthday... woke up with a massive head****... sinuses pushing into my brain like a lead filled sponge... stomach gurgling and somersaulting... ears ringing not with the bells of santa's sleigh, but in some sort of emergency tone warning there's trouble ahead. my hope, nay, my struggle to keep the food down that ive managed to swallow. a single dose of chlorine dioxide is my only hope to stave off whatever attack this may be.

until we meet again 'post quick reply' button... until we meet again.

merry frickin xmas ya'll.

[kloan]

Updates.... well, looking at the post above, I remember I felt shitty... lol. I did take a dose of the chlorine dioxide, and it did relieve me of those symptoms. I woke up feeling better. Shit works wonders, I swear it.

So yeah.. it's come to week 13 of this thing... whatever it is. The Tren Hex I am almost positive wasn't Tren at all. At least, I had none of the trademark symptoms people talk about. No night sweating, rapid increase in strength, fat melting off, etc.

I did experience quite a bit of intensity in the 'ol brain, quite cranky (and still am, though not quite as much), but that could easily have been the Test and/or Eq.

Insomnia has been present, as well as anxiety. A moderate amount of lethargy.. don't feel like doing shit at-all. Only want to lift, eat and sleep... that's it. I've had things I need to do pile up because I just haven't had any motivation at all to get any of it done.

My last shot of the 'Tren Hex' was this Monday, which was 1cc and the previous shot was 1cc as well

Tonight I shot 1cc of the Test/Eq, 0.5cc of Test Cyp and 1cc of Deca (yes, I know I said I wasn't going to.. but what can I say.... I get an idea stuck in my head and I feel compelled to follow through.... it's a sickness really... lol).

So I'm gonna ride this one out for another 6-8 weeks, unless I change my mind and do something else. I am expecting to have another combo shortly, which will be Test Enth & Masteron Enth.

I will be using that for my cutter, which will also include Anavar, T3 and Clen.

Yep, this is going to be a long one. ;)

Oh, and also.. I've been using liquid Bolasterone starting Dec 29th. I will be using this for 4-5 weeks. So far I'm really enjoying this stuff. In the last week, my big lifts have all gained 20lbs and feel really good doing so.. no threat of imminent injury, still being very cautious so as to not disrupt the careful balance of ****ing things up again.

As far as sides go... irritability, lethargy, cardioless, acne on my ****ing face dammit, insomnia. That's about it. I'm fine with everything BUT the goddamn zits on my mother****ing face. For the love of god.... put em anywhere but on my face! I'm using Tea Tree oil like it's going out of style... at least it helps dry them out quick. Also using a bodywash I got from a member over on OLM.

Anyway, all lifts have improved, and I've gained 12lbs since week 5 (or is it 6? I can't remember or be bothered to go back and check). Biggest improvement has been in my legs, which is fan-****ing-tastic because they were severely lacking. They're actually starting to look like I work them now (which I didn't up til about 5 months ago... :(). Biggest strength improvement as well. I've added 80lbs to the bar since I started doing squats for the first time. Close Grip Bench is another big improvement. I've added 35-40lbs on the bar with that one.

Meanwhile, still pussyfarting around my left shoulder/rotator cuff and my neck squabble.... that has interfered with my progress somewhat, mostly with my shoulders, but I'm making the most of it, and overall I'm doing well.

So that's it for now.....

[kloan]

Thought I'd update this a bit.

Stopped taking the Bola 19 days later, from fear that estrogen was building, plus it was affecting my appetite.

Turns out it wasn't increasing estro, because after cessation I still had puffy nips (still do).

I continued taking Caber, but stopped taking Aromasin after 5 days of taking Nolva and Aromasin to help lower the estro, which it seemed to do temporarily.

I stopped taking Caber a few weeks ago, and my libido came right back. Odd because no one mentions anything about Caber affecting libido, but it sure as hell affected mine. I started taking Arimidex last week because I need something to control estro, but I can't use up any more of my Aromasin, I need it for PCT.

So anyway, it's been 6 weeks now on the Test/EQ & Deca. Strength has just now come to a standstill (or it was just a shitty workout day today), but has been increasing slowly from the start of it.

Lifts now are at a decent level from when I first started this cycle. Here are some highlights:

- Seated rows up 100lbs
- Squats up 100lbs
- Close grip bench up 60-70lbs
- DB curls up 10lbs each side
- Tricep cable pull downs up 30lbs

Those are the best improvements. Shoulders obviously haven't increased much because of my left shoulder.

So it's been 19 weeks since I started this thing. I probably shouldn't have started with the Deca, because now that it's been peaking, I'm tempted to keep going with it. I hadn't planned on going this long, and it's probably pretty irresponsible to continue, but I feel compelled to keep going.

It's time I really take a good look at what I'm doing though. For the first 13 weeks, my nuts barely shrunk at all. But since starting the Deca, they've shrunk quite a bit and I'm definitely shut down. Do I really want to keep going another few weeks like this when I've still got Phase 2 upcoming?

Phase 2: The Diet

I know, I know. It's not recommended to go into a diet from a bulking cycle. But, it's also noted that Clen is anti-catabolic, so it stands to reason that it will help aid muscle retention while dieting, doesn't it? Please correct me if I'm wrong though.. it'd be an awful waste to go about it and lose my gains like an idiot.

The plan is simple. Keto + Test E/Mast E, Anavar, T3 & Clen. Working my way up to 2 cardio sessions a day.

That's the plan anyway. If I wasn't so stubborn and didn't keep pushing for more gains, I would already have started this diet 6 weeks ago. However, not being content with the gains I had the first 13 weeks, I really wanted to continue. My goal was to surpass 190lbs before calling it quits with the bulker, but I've been struggling to get past 187lbs for a couple weeks now. I started eating more, added brown rice to 2 meals a day, and that seems to have helped. Up to 189lbs now for the past couple days.

Feeling tired, lethargic, unmotivated... the usual.

Getting pretty sick of sticking myself with needles, that's for damn sure. Stuffing myself til I feel like I'm going to pop is getting pretty old as well.

Fun times..... fun times.

[kloan]

I will have the answers I'm looking for very soon. Got blood tests done today. I will make my decision based on the results.

[cyberfitnessguru]

Its all about stickativity.

Just stick with it and you will be fine.

Dont give up and success will come.

[kloan]

Some interesting developments this past week. Strength has gone down a bit, I've dropped 4lbs in the last 5 days and I'm looking noticeably less bloated, especially in my face and stomach. So far all I've done is stopped eating so much. I guess that can attribute to some strength loss as of these past few days, however even last week I was weaker yet I hadn't done anything different. Perhaps overtraining, but I'm not sold on that idea. I've also been very fatigued. Definitely due in part to my off the wall sleep schedule, not getting enough day light and fresh air.

Sucks that my strength has gone down, but at least while dieting it is expected, so I'm not going to focus on that, instead remain positive and focus on my goal of leaning out and making myself look better. #1 is to hold onto as much mass as possible.

My weight peaked at 191.8lbs, currently at 188.

Day #4 on 20mcg of Clen, '500mg' of Test Cyp and '300mg' of Deca (each is probably slightly lower than the labeled amount). I'm going to drop the Deca though, considering the results of my blood test, and I'm going to lower the Test Cyp. I may or may not add Masteron. I'll have to do some more reading up on that compound and see if it can have a negative impact on my lipids.

To be continued....

[kloan]

Last shot of Deca (150mg) was last Thursday (Mar 18).

Today is one week of Clen. I am increasing to 20mcg 2x day. Started Anavar, 25mg 2x day today as well.

Started new product, Test E and Mast E blend (250mg/200mg). First shot today.

Calories have been significantly reduced. Aiming for 180-200 grams of protein per day, and playing it by ear with carbs and fat. Low each one, but not strict. Enough that calories are below maintenance, but not so much that I feel like shit.

So far, down 4lbs and holding steady. Looking significantly less bloated, starting to lean out.

[Talo]

How much do you weigh ?

[kloan]

I'm sitting at 187.4lbs today, 5'6.5" (http://www.canadabodybuilding.com/forums/showpost.php?p=364196&postcount=107)

Great work out tonight, strength is almost back to where it was. Thinking there were some other factors contributing to my strength loss last week. Feeling pretty good, and I have more energy than I've had in a while. I think all those extra calories and carbs were really tiring me out.

[kloan]

I'm visiting my sister in Vancouver... didn't bring needles with me, getting them here... meantime thought I could make do with using the dropper today. Guess not!! lol.... think I might have taken more than what I'm used to... powerful stuff... probably somewhere around 50mcg, I was taking 30mcg before.. you wouldn't think it'd be that much of a difference.

Droppers are no good for measuring!!

EDIT: oh, well, that wasn't so bad... only lasted an hour or so... i can handle that.