If size is your goal....

[CanadianIron]

So heres my question.... guys like Arnold, competitive throughout their career, constantly bulking/cutting for competitions etc.

If someones goal is just size, no competitions, just muscular size. Should they ever cut?

I get this feeling from people that I should stop my bulking once in a while and cut a bit. But I see it as counter productive.

If my goal is say, 220lbs lean. Shouldnt I just bulk/train hard til I reach atleast 230-240lbs? Given my body type, i would always maintain a relatively low bodyfat. I dont think I should cut til I've achieved a size im happy with.

Ill say it again, is cutting necesarry to solidfy gains, keep body fat manageable, or for getting to the next level with muscle mass?

[Andre]

There is no benefit to letting body fat get out of control... Arnold always kept himself pretty lean!

[CanadianIron]

Exactly... question though...

If Arnold knew his potential for size and said, screw it. Im going to see how much size I can put on and skipped a couple years... could he have been bigger?

And im not necesarily talking about out of control body weight, i just mean. Not having a phase every year where you try and get "cut".

[Danger]

I think its obvious, anytime your losing weight you cant be adding muscle so it stands to reason that the more time you spend losing bodyfat the less time you have to devote to adding muslce mass.

If your goal is to be the best football player do you take breaks to practice golf? probably not until your in the NFL.

[GYMBRAT]

I seem to hold strong on my weight even while dieting, though I also don't go over board in the bulking neither though.

[rated_rko]

usually i dont cut but i increase my cardio when off so i can eat enough to maintain and i end up losing a lil bf or bloat i was retaining while on...ie my bulk got up to 238...now im holding at 231-233...all i noticed is strength is down but not drastic

[Memo]

I find that cutting is good for insulin sensitivity & for the whole metabolism.

If i cut 10 pound, Its very easy after to gain some more muscle when i start bulking again, and without the cut, it seems that whatever I eat it does not do nothing.

It slow my metabolism down.

[MikeyFXD35]

I going through the same question so I have decided to add some cutting agents to my diet but not going overboard on the cutting back on food.

[baza]

Most people want to get leaner for summer so they try and cut some of the pounds.
If your main goal would be to get as big as possible, I would be bulking in the summer too.

[tiramisu]

The most efficient way of getting muscular is also getting fat. 3 Years of eating like a sumo, lifting like a powerbuilder and injecting like a junkie would put far more muscle on than any other approach.

But lets be clear that's not bodybuilding, not terribly healthy and you truthfully might just end up a really big fat unhealthy guy that sweats a lot and can't breathe at night.

So I wouldn't take this road, and I'd bet anyone who's ever had any kind of overweight problem would be smart enough to know that once you are obese you may be one of those guys who's body fights to keep every f'ing pound of fat.

BUT You'll definitely add muscle.

[CanadianIron]

I tried to cut a bit at the beginning of the summer and all I really did was lean out a bit and lose a few months worth of work. Thats basically why I asked. I dont think ill try that again next spring.

[#8]

^^ Use anavar with GH the next time you cut. Thats a whole new bag of marbles.

[kloan]

^^ Use anavar with GH the next time you cut. Thats a whole new bag of marbles.

Man, if only.... I'm not liking my diet so far.... could use some help from the ol var and gh.

Fortunately, ive got var on the way and once i got that im gonna start my cycle while still on keto... im just gonna eat a lot more.. should be good. about a month in or so i'll start eating carbs again.

[Ritch]

To those saying getting fat as a pig is the best way to bulk, I disagree. When you get up in the body fat range, say you can`t see you upper 2 abs anymore, you`re getting fat. Most likely every pound of muscle you put on from this point will come with 4 pounds of fat. Plus your body becomes insulin resistant.

Then we all know what will happen to this muscle when you diet. You loose it. To me it`s just not smart to get sumo fat in the off season. Mabe if you plan on dieting with anabolics, using clen and T3 it can be done. But the suffering is beyond what most people can endure and is why I think you see alot of guys who just can`t get lean. Sure they can bulk up, but they`re digging a hole they just can`t get out of when it comes time to leaning out.

[Talo]

^^ Well said , Ritch.

[GYMBRAT]

I totally agree with Rich 110%

[kloan]

Yup, fo sure... I read so much about eat eat eat then diet.... so I did, and I regret it. Spent way too much time packing on the lbs along with fat, and now I'm working hard to shed it all and start again. Not likely going to go back to where I was when I started, obviously... but I plan on eating properly/smartly from here on in.

[GYMBRAT]

^^ I did the same thing bro, and no never again! Why have all that muscle when it's hidden under fat! :)

[Ritch]

Yup, fo sure... I read so much about eat eat eat then diet.... so I did, and I regret it. Spent way too much time packing on the lbs along with fat, and now I'm working hard to shed it all and start again. Not likely going to go back to where I was when I started, obviously... but I plan on eating properly/smartly from here on in.

I did that last winter as well. I had never gotten this fat. Some of my friends even made comments on how my stomach was getting big. Man that bugged me... My usual easy going diet where I eliminate carbs for the last 2 meals of my day didn`t get me lean for summer. Plus I was on gear and clen. I`m never gonna put myself in that situation again. I`m even doing cardio this year, after every workout to help stay leaner. Something I should be doing anyway as my cardio absolutely sucks.

[ryankely]

this post makes me think of lee preist,fat or ripped,no happy medium.

[kloan]

I did that last winter as well. I had never gotten this fat. Some of my friends even made comments on how my stomach was getting big. Man that bugged me... My usual easy going diet where I eliminate carbs for the last 2 meals of my day didn`t get me lean for summer. Plus I was on gear and clen. I`m never gonna put myself in that situation again. I`m even doing cardio this year, after every workout to help stay leaner. Something I should be doing anyway as my cardio absolutely sucks.

Same with me.. everyone was telling me I needed to cut, was getting too big.. :(

I never did cardio either, but I'm doing it regularly now. Once I lean out completely, I plan to keep it that way.. if it slows my growth, so be it.. I've got time.

[buildinthaskinnys]

How did guys lke Frank Zane and Will Harris grow into contests?! Can anyone explain this fact?

[Danger]

Hard Work + Genetics + Drugs would be my guess.

[Ironhorse]

What kind of cycle plan would you suggest for stacking Deca with DBol???? Anyone?

[kidmode]

I had this discussion with AlladdinSane today. One thing to consider is the possibility of injury. You should always be within arm's length of "healthy". If you're 30lbs away from your intended lean weight it's gonna be rough times if you get injured.

[agingtechie]

Same with me.. everyone was telling me I needed to cut, was getting too big.. :(

I never did cardio either, but I'm doing it regularly now. Once I lean out completely, I plan to keep it that way.. if it slows my growth, so be it.. I've got time.

How do you work in your cardio? When I tried this it seemed to push me into the over training zone. I was feeling tied with muscle aches all the time.

[Ritch]

I had this discussion with AlladdinSane today. One thing to consider is the possibility of injury. You should always be within arm's length of "healthy". If you're 30lbs away from your intended lean weight it's gonna be rough times if you get injured.

So since AlladinSane weighs 315lbs his target weight is 285 ripped???

[kidmode]

So since AlladinSane weighs 315lbs his target weight is 285 ripped???

Keep your shorts on, it's gonna be different for everyone. For me I'm 210 right now, If I dropped 30lbs of pure body fat I think I'd be shredded.

Edit: That's not what I said. I said 30lbs away from intended lean weight. I think 200 lbs is a healthy weight for me. It was just an example.

[AlladdinSane]

So since AlladdinSane weighs 315lbs his target weight is 285 ripped???

Hahaha... It was more of a "Do as I say not as I do: The things I've learned over the years" conversation. That being said, I'm looking at being in shape @ 270ish when it becomes time to do it.

edit: But I can poop 15lbs at a time so it's about right ;)

[kidmode]

^ I made up the numbers unrealistically I suppose. Woe is me :mock

[AlladdinSane]

I hate Wednesdays because you don't come in and that blows.

[kidmode]

Hahaha, I get home sick after being away from your gym for too long :P Christmas break is gonna be rough in Saskatoon. The ironworks I found was okay, but it's no Remington's! Maybe I'll just go to the U of S gym so I can feel big :)

[Ritch]

The 30 lbs nuber does sound about right however. 10-15 lbs of water, then 10-15lbs of fat...

[Ritch]

Keep your shorts on, it's gonna be different for everyone. For me I'm 210 right now, If I dropped 30lbs of pure body fat I think I'd be shredded.

Edit: That's not what I said. I said 30lbs away from intended lean weight. I think 200 lbs is a healthy weight for me. It was just an example.

You weight 210 in that pic? You look bigger. BTW, I don`t wear shorts.

[kidmode]

You weight 210 in that pic? You look bigger. BTW, I don`t wear shorts.

lol, pants are just long shorts :P Yea, if you're talking about my pic in the member's picture's section that's 210. It was probably taken post workout so I may appear larger than I actually am haha

[ironwill]

Hahaha... It was more of a "Do as I say not as I do: The things I've learned over the years" conversation. That being said, I'm looking at being in shape @ 270ish when it becomes time to do it.

edit: But I can poop 15lbs at a time so it's about right ;)

Good stuff, i have always found that most people end up being quite a bit lighter when they get in shape than they intend to be.....270 at your height would be very impressive for sure, and tough to do IMO, considering some of the best in the world arent that large, but then again it all depends on how in shape you want to be i suppose, and what one considers in shape for them.............:)

[AlladdinSane]

but then again it all depends on how in shape you want to be i suppose, and what one considers in shape for them.............:)


It's very true. I should have been a bit more specific. I have no intention or real desire to be ripped (or even what most here consider "lean"). When I say "in shape", I simply mean being able to see a hint of abs and being able to still rock the big three then do a flight of stairs without somebody calling an ambulance. Keeping my arms above 21" would be nice, too.

;)

[Ritch]

lol, pants are just long shorts :P Yea, if you're talking about my pic in the member's picture's section that's 210. It was probably taken post workout so I may appear larger than I actually am haha

How tall are you if you don`t mind me asking?

[ironwill]

It's very true. I should have been a bit more specific. I have no intention or real desire to be ripped (or even what most here consider "lean"). When I say "in shape", I simply mean being able to see a hint of abs and being able to still rock the big three then do a flight of stairs without somebody calling an ambulance. Keeping my arms above 21" would be nice, too.

;)

Gotcha, either way with your shoulder and chest, etc. width, size, thickness, you will look great.......:)

[kidmode]

How tall are you if you don`t mind me asking?

5'10.7"

but with shoes on I clear that so I always say 5'11" hehe.